Some questions about the communist utopia

[Individuality]

I've been learning a lot about this and it is thankfully from the few people that actually shared the ideals.

In the ideal anarchist communist society, production is controlled by society. The produced goods are free to be used by that of the population. So if society produced pizzas, I can go get a slice, FOR FREE!

So let's say I work at the cement factory. A very important industry since it builds infrastructure and stuff like that.

Did I end up working at the cement factory because society told me to work there, or because I chose to work there?

In the cement factory, who determines what position I have?

In the cement factory, is there people that have superior positions that tell me what to do?

What happens if I only feel like working one hour a week?

Can people come to the cement factory and just get a bucket of cement?

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Let's talk about the will of society.

I was talking about someone about this, and if I seized property, basically if I could keep my hands on it would be determined by the will of society.

How is the will of society determined?

How are the needs of society determined?

If there's a vote, how does the populous know the results are accurate?

How many people make up "society"? Like a town(50,000)? County(100,000)? Country(300,000,000)?

How long does it take to determine the will of society on a particular issue?

What happens to individuals in society that has impure communist thoughts(Like recognizing private property)? If nothing, how many individuals would there need to be before the communists of society to view them as a threat? If they were viewed a threat, what would society do to them?

Let's say I'm a farmer now.. I work with a few people and we produce the food for society.

Does society set a quota for the amount of food needed to feed society?

If I have to work 100hrs a week to produce that quota, what would be my motivation to produce it?

If I didn't meet the quota, which means people are going to starve, do I get eat first, since well, I can just eat it?

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Let's talk motivation. Since all the necessities of life are provided already for me, based on need. Why would I goto work? What exactly would be my "motivation" to go produce cement?

I guess all the questions sort of boil down this. Why do I need to goto work and produce value for the world when I don't need too?

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I really don't see how this anarchism communism works. It's just too damn complicated. It has a fucking bible that needs someone to enforce it(don't read into that statement too much, I'd hate to see you not answer the questions above).

[Individuality]

Another great question.

Let's say I found the cure for cancer. Society and everyone knows it. And I say, "I'm only going to cure people of cancer if they recognize the cure as my property and that I'm allowed to profit with it. If not, no one gets cured."

What would happen to said person?

[apathy maybe]

You don't get this anarchism thing do you.

I suggest reading the FAQ, reading through learning, etc. before posting again.

We aren't here to tell you how we think a future society will work. We are here to discuss amongst ourselves. If you are too lazy to read up, well, I personally can't be fucked answering your stupid questions that have answers that are easily found.

(If nothing else, any suggestion as to how a future anarchist society might work is pure conjuncture. I'm not about to tell a future society that they must do x, y, or z. That is for them to decide.)

[spartan]

In the cement factory, is there people that have superior positions that tell me what to do?

There will be a fully elected, by all the workers in a Direct Democratic election, workers council that will have managerial type roles.

Any abuse of this privileged position will result in an impeachment of the said abuser by the workers in a referendum (The workers will vote on whether or not the councilman who abused his/her position can keep their position or not).

What happens if I only feel like working one hour a week?
Then you will have to live of what that one hour a week of work will give you in return (Which wont be alot).

If you are a fully healthy (Both mentally and physically) adult then you should have no problem working for a living.

You and your communes self sufficiency relies on you and your important work to survive.

Can people come to the cement factory and just get a bucket of cement?
Kind of.

You see people can come and specifiy what they want.

If it is something that is big and hard to produce then the local commune assembly (Made up of all citizens of your commune) will have to approve it as this will directly affect them as well.

Alternatively things that are produced could be put into a big commune warehouse which would act as a center for items (Like food) for people to take what they need.


I was talking about someone about this, and if I seized property, basically if I could keep my hands on it would be determined by the will of society.

That would be pretty hard seeing how there is no property to seize in a Communist society:D


How is the will of society determined?

Direct Democratic elections and Plebiscites at a local commune level.


How are the needs of society determined?

Based on things such as ability (Someone with a mental or physical disability cant be expected to work in the same manner as someone who doesnt suffer from a mental or physical disability, especially if it will directly effect how that disabled individual works).

"From each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs." Karl Marx

If there's a vote, how does the populous know the results are accurate?
How do we know that votes in our current Capitalist society are accurate?


How many people make up "society"? Like a town(50,000)? County(100,000)? Country(300,000,000)?

The world will be divided up into small city-states of about 100, 000 people maximum.

Each city-state has a capital city (About 50, 000 people) and a number of smaller town like communes under its assemblies jurisdiction.

Each city-state will be almost completely economically self sufficient, whilst goods that cant be produced in the region, that the city-state is in, will have to be imported from other city-states that have an abundance of the said product.


How long does it take to determine the will of society on a particular issue?

Well that depends on the issue.

If we introduce computer voting then a Plebiscite could take as little as a day.


What happens to individuals in society that has impure communist thoughts(Like recognizing private property)? If nothing, how many individuals would there need to be before the communists of society to view them as a threat? If they were viewed a threat, what would society do to them?

We will treat them much like Medievalists and Feudalists are treated today, with bemusement.

They have a right to talk about their views and to produce works on it.

But if they start organizing against Communism then they will have to be punished in some manner (That is up to a communes court made up of all the communes citizens who decide whether the defendant is guilty or not guilty via a vote, and sentencing, if required and what ever sentence that they have decided on, via a vote as well).

You have to understand though that people in a Communist society will have the same attitude towards Capitalism as we have towards Medieval times and Feudalism in our current Capitalist society (i.e. history that we shouldnt be going back to).


Let's say I'm a farmer now.. I work with a few people and we produce the food for society.

Does society set a quota for the amount of food needed to feed society?

It depends who you are producing your food for, either yourself or your local commune or both?

Either way over producing goods mean that you can store it for later times or give it to another commune that might need it.

If any quotas are set then they will be set by the local commune assembly.


If I have to work 100hrs a week to produce that quota, what would be my motivation to produce it?

You, your family and your communes survival?

Isnt that why we all go to work in a Capitalist society?

Because if we dont we will eventually starve right?

Communism isnt some sort of free ride for lazy people, everyone will have their own special role in society which is essential to the survival of that society.

People who cant mentally or physically work will be looked after by a communes social services as well as that persons family.


If I didn't meet the quota, which means people are going to starve, do I get eat first, since well, I can just eat it?

Modern farming methods, and the fact that other city-states farmers will be producing an abundance of goods, means that things such as starvation are much more unlikely then in our current Capitalist society where profits are put before peoples needs (Case in point being all the millions of people starving in Africa when this need not be the case).

Right now there is enough food in the world to feed everyone and to have loads still left over, and yet over a billion of us live below the poverty line whilst millions of us starve everyday.

Only a system as cruel as Capitalism, which puts profits before peoples needs so that the boss can live in an even bigger house and have lots more sports cars, could give us a state of affairs such as what is happening in Africa and other parts of the world right now.


Let's talk motivation. Since all the necessities of life are provided already for me, based on need. Why would I goto work? What exactly would be my "motivation" to go produce cement?

You will go to work so that you can continue to produce all your necessities of life.

Cement will always be needed by someone, so your job in the cement factory is producing something that will always be in demand as it is something that is essential to building structures, etc.

So if you dont produce cement your house will eventually crumble and you wont be able to live in a nice warm house again, so get producing!;)


I guess all the questions sort of boil down this. Why do I need to goto work and produce value for the world when I don't need too?

But the whole point is that you actually do need to!

If every worker just lay down their tools and said "Do you no what, i dont fancy this after all" then everyone would suffer including the workers themselves!

Workers are always needed to produce products which are vital to a modern societies existence.

As Communists we aim to give ownership and control of all productive forces in society to the operaters of those productive forces, the workers.

To do this we must overthrow the current owners and controllers of the productive forces, the Bourgeoisie, because their position is one of exploiter (They exploit the labour provided by the workers to make more profit for themselves when it is the workers who have done all the hard work to make that profit possible).

The way i see it is why cant the workers, who operate the productive forces and thus make all products and profits made from their work a reality, also own and control what they operate?

[Demogorgon]

This is getting tiresome

[spartan]

This is getting tiresome

There should be a rule where everyone who joins has to read the "FAQ" stickies to avoid this sort of shit in the future.

[Jazzratt]

I'm closing this thread, it brings nothing new and it is clear the member has neglected to read the FAQ or tried to think (perhaps it hurts his(?) head).

I will note however that spartan's view of a future society is certainly not shared by all of us.