Free Market Fantasies...

[RadioRaheem84]

Free Markets give people more choice in their lives, i.e. the freer the markets, the freer the people.

Universal healthcare, welfare and other government programs are inefficient and force people to pay taxes on things they dont want.

Government intervention kills the incentive for people to improve their lives.

The markets are more democratic as they give people the right to choose.


Any other ones that I am missing?


Lets deconstruct some of these market myths.

[dannthraxxx]

Universal healthcare, welfare and other government programs are inefficient and force people to pay taxes on things they dont want.


are you saying this is a myth? i'm pretty positive that if america instills universal healthcrare and welfare, yes, we would be taxed out the ass for it.


not to mention, i am not a supporter of welfare, welfare is for wastes of air and lazy bastards.

[RadioRaheem84]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29, 2007 08:21 pm
Universal healthcare, welfare and other government programs are inefficient and force people to pay taxes on things they dont want.


are you saying this is a myth? i'm pretty positive that if america instills universal healthcrare and welfare, yes, we would be taxed out the ass for it.


not to mention, i am not a supporter of welfare, welfare is for wastes of air and lazy bastards.
ok thats one answer. anyone else care to chime in.

also, dan. would you care to elaborate just how welfare and universal healthcare would be for lazy wastes of air?

[bootleg42]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29, 2007 08:21 pm
not to mention, i am not a supporter of welfare, welfare is for wastes of air and lazy bastards.
I say as long as we're in capitalism, welfare is good.

Plus most people don't even stay on welfare for too long and it helps poorer people.

[RadioRaheem84]

I say as long as we're in capitalism, welfare is good.

Plus most people don't even stay on welfare for too long and it helps poorer people.

Agreed. the myth of the low class loaf is a stereotype by the middle class that tends to vote against government programs for the poor.

[Schrödinger's Cat]

Welfare has been re-organized to the point that the few leeching off the system do it through filing false disability or other dishonest means. "Lazy" bums go by the name Paris Hilton.



The markets are more democratic as they give people the right to choose.

Okay. Most people want alternative energy. Countries like Brazil and Iceland show it's manageable. So anytime now...



Universal healthcare, welfare and other government programs are inefficient and force people to pay taxes on things they dont want.

The welfare state strengthened the poor and working class more than any previous system in West Europe and America. Arguing for market healthcare -- gotta' ask why we're getting screwed out of our pockets and livelihoods when other countries aren't.


Government intervention kills the incentive for people to improve their lives.

Too much probably does. No intervention drives people to suicide, prostitution, and begging on the street.

[lvleph]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29, 2007 03:21 pm
Universal healthcare, welfare and other government programs are inefficient and force people to pay taxes on things they dont want.


are you saying this is a myth? i'm pretty positive that if america instills universal healthcrare and welfare, yes, we would be taxed out the ass for it.


not to mention, i am not a supporter of welfare, welfare is for wastes of air and lazy bastards.
What people don't seem to understand is that with Universal Health care you replace your premium, which for most people with a family is $200+ with a tax increase. Now say this tax increase is quite large (5% for a middle class family) and let's say that a middle class family makes $60k. $200 per month would amount to 4% of their income a month, but guess what those insurance companies do not provide for everything. You have to pay a copay and they can deny you treatment. So I think I will take the tax hike for Universal Health Care.

[RadioRaheem84]

Has anyone seen Adam Curtis's latest documentary The Trap? It talks about how the introduction of Game Theory by John Nash (yes, the schtizo from A Beautiful Mind) also ushered in a new era of basing everything on a rational theory of numbers. The Austrian School of Economics (the home of libertarian demi-gods Friedman, Hayek, etc.) took advantage of this opportunity and wanted to take out the notion of state planning in the economy in order to give the "rational" market free reign. It highlights how in our world outlook today, it seems rather irrational to think about the public good and how conservative politicians, "new democrats" like Bill Clinton, and the business world practically destroyed the notion of public trust and government a being efficient to solving global problems.

So this adherence to unfettered free markets is a NEW thing. Believing in the infallibilty of business over government is a new idea in the American psyche.

A great documentary. I recommend it.

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by RadioRaheem84+December 29, 2007 08:04 pm--> (RadioRaheem84 @ December 29, 2007 08:04 pm) Free Markets give people more choice in their lives, i.e. the freer the markets, the freer the people.


Government intervention kills the incentive for people to improve their lives.

The markets are more democratic as they give people the right to choose.



Free Markets give people more choice in their lives, i.e. the freer the markets, the freer the people.

[/b]
Fuck off, restrict. :angry:


Radioraheem84

Free Markets give people more choice in their lives, i.e. the freer the markets, the freer the people.

...thats assuming they can afford to pay for your 'freedom' and privatised services, but 80% of the time thats not usually the case.

The reason a homeless person without health insurance or legal status in the UK can get hospital treatment is because we have a state owned health system.

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29, 2007 08:27 pm

lazy wastes of air?
oooh look i found some! :lol:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40352000/jpg/_40352167_speech_pa220.jpg

[Brady]

Originally posted by Ulster Socialist+December 30, 2007 10:32 pm--> (Ulster Socialist @ December 30, 2007 10:32 pm)
[email protected] 29, 2007 08:27 pm

lazy wastes of air?
oooh look i found some! :lol:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40352000/jpg/_40352167_speech_pa220.jpg [/b]
:lol: :lol:

Brilliant. :D

[Lynx]

Originally posted by Ulster [email protected] 30, 2007 06:27 pm
Fuck off, restrict. :angry:
Uncalled for, you have taken the authors post out of context:

Lets deconstruct some of these market myths.

[RebelDog]

Free Markets give people more choice in their lives, i.e. the freer the markets, the freer the people.

That is true for the capitalist class. They are the only ones gain from more free market. This greater freedom gives them more scope for sourcing cheaper commodities and access to new markets. That of course is the sanitised view of the process. The reality is that greater freedom means more ruthless exploitation of the global working class, circumvention of domestic environmental controls and the greater ability to undermine workers unions.

More free market is held up in the west as some kind of ridiculous panacea to global problems and the policy of the IMF and World Bank is to open up areas to more ruthless domination by capital. When people call for more free market they are simply calling for greater freedom for the powerful to stamp all over the oppressed. They want barriers to greed to be removed.

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by Lynx+December 31, 2007 03:56 am--> (Lynx @ December 31, 2007 03:56 am)
Ulster [email protected] 30, 2007 06:27 pm
Fuck off, restrict. :angry:
Uncalled for, you have taken the authors post out of context:

Lets deconstruct some of these market myths. [/b]
my bad, I was tired. :blush: