Amnesty International

[R_P_A_S]

I would like to get some opinions, facts or just any kind of feedback as to why many leftist don't support or are to keen with Amnesty International.

I know they are a non-profit org. and claim to be non-governmental association. and are out there trying to promote human rights and all that stuff.

any comments. good and bad? and what's our stance to such organizations? what could be an alternative?

[Dros]

I don't like a lot of things.

1.) Methodology. Writing letters and signing petitions does not get shit done in oppressive countries.

2.) Their conception of human rights violations are aimed at attacking those governments WE DON'T GET ALONG WITH! They rarely (read never) go after the U.S. or Britain for their aggregious human rights violations.

3.) My alternative is revolution and the corresponding destruction of all forms of oppression.

[R_P_A_S]

Originally posted by [email protected] 12, 2007 02:51 am
I don't like a lot of things.

1.) Methodology. Writing letters and signing petitions does not get shit done in oppressive countries.

2.) Their conception of human rights violations are aimed at attacking those governments WE DON'T GET ALONG WITH! They rarely (read never) go after the U.S. or Britain for their aggregious human rights violations.

3.) My alternative is revolution and the corresponding destruction of all forms of oppression.
thank you.
anyone else?

[Muthafuck Judas!]

They rarely (read never) go after the U.S. or Britain for their aggregious human rights violations.

That's not quite true
http://www.amazon.com/Case-Mumia-Abu-Jamal...97432052&sr=8-8 (http://www.amazon.com/Case-Mumia-Abu-Jamal-Balance-Pamphlet/dp/158322081X/ref=pd_bbs_sr_8?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1197432052&sr=8-8)

Although for the most part your right.

[Eleftherios]

I'm part of Amnesty International at my school, and all they seem to be doing is sending letters and writing petitions, which is completely worthless and a waste of time. When I tried to introduce Marxism into the group, they were not very accepting.


Although for the most part your right.

Yeah, but they do speak out against torture and stuff like that

[Vanguard1917]

As long as human rights organisations like Amnesty International call for the intervention of the West (or the 'international community') into the affairs of non-Western states, they play a reactionary role.

[Zurdito]

Originally posted by [email protected] 12, 2007 04:09 am
When I tried to introduce Marxism into the group, they were not very accepting.
That might be because marxism has nothing to do with their organisation. ;)

look, Amnesty are left-liberals who on campus etc. can run some decent campaigns against Guantanamo Bay etc., and some of them are decent activists when it comes to setting up a big event to expose the US, Britain or Israel.

Fundamentally though we have very little in common with them and we should appreciate that: like has been said they are not anti-imperialist, only anti-war. They equate all human rights violations by any organisation in any circumstances. They would oppose Britain attacking Iraq for example, but they wouldn't call victory to Iraq either.

More fundamentally, they aren't classist. So don't expect much of them.

However once we've acknowledged this, we should also accept that sometimes they will support progressive causes, and to that extent they are worth working with us, are progressive. So there's no need to "frown" at Amnesty in general, just take them for all the use they can provide to our movement, and then criticise them when they do the wrong this in specific circumstances, i.e. equate third world and imperialist govt.'s

Who knows, some of them may even be recruited - I in fact know some marxists who are ex-Amnesty, and I'm in the process of recruiting another. ;)

[manic expression]

I roll my eyes when I hear of AI because they're possibly the most impotent organization in the history of activism. Getting people to write letters to the Janjaweed Militia in Sudan isn't going to do ANYTHING; most of what they do is to convince themselves that they care so they can sleep better at night.

Seriously, AI will never accomplish anything because they are too insipid to see how the world works. This brings us to my second point:

Secondly, because of their liberalist delusions, they criticize revolutionary movements and governments. We understand that the exploiters will not go quietly, and so we encourage the use of appropriate means. They, on the other hand, are stupid enough to think that if we all hold hands and sing a few songs (after signing a petition), everything will be churchy.

I can't really think of too many groups that are as worthless and conceited as Amnesty International.

[R_P_A_S]

Originally posted by manic [email protected] 12, 2007 05:36 pm
I roll my eyes when I hear of AI because they're possibly the most impotent organization in the history of activism. Getting people to write letters to the Janjaweed Militia in Sudan isn't going to do ANYTHING; most of what they do is to convince themselves that they care so they can sleep better at night.

Seriously, AI will never accomplish anything because they are too insipid to see how the world works. This brings us to my second point:

Secondly, because of their liberalist delusions, they criticize revolutionary movements and governments. We understand that the exploiters will not go quietly, and so we encourage the use of appropriate means. They, on the other hand, are stupid enough to think that if we all hold hands and sing a few songs (after signing a petition), everything will be churchy.

I can't really think of too many groups that are as worthless and conceited as Amnesty International.
ok thanks. yeah i agree with you.. anything else?

[Dr Mindbender]

Like a charity, reformist band aid to conservative guilty consciences. They have no intention of challenging the world order or status quo so in effect they will always be reactionary. Complete waste of oxygen.

I shudder to think that i could have been once working for them. :wacko:

[Ultra-Violence]

Ragardless of thier revotionary or not they still bring alot of isues to light so i appluaed them foor that other than that yeah every one hit the nail on the ball

[R_P_A_S]

so i guess the summary would be pretty much something like,

an organization that sheds light on many on going world conflicts and injustices, though bias and reactionary offering no real solution to the injustices it condemns, it brings light to many issues that people need to be aware of?

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by [email protected] 12, 2007 09:41 pm
so i guess the summary would be pretty much something like,

an organization that sheds light on many on going world conflicts and injustices, though bias and reactionary offering no real solution to the injustices it condemns, it brings light to many issues that people need to be aware of?
the problem with amnesty is that they divert attention into reformist methods that could otherwise be ploughed into revolutionary spirit. Thats why they often do more harm than good.

[R_P_A_S]

Originally posted by Ulster Socialist+December 12, 2007 09:43 pm--> (Ulster Socialist @ December 12, 2007 09:43 pm)
[email protected] 12, 2007 09:41 pm
so i guess the summary would be pretty much something like,

an organization that sheds light on many on going world conflicts and injustices, though bias and reactionary offering no real solution to the injustices it condemns, it brings light to many issues that people need to be aware of?
the problem with amnesty is that they divert attention into reformist methods that could otherwise be ploughed into revolutionary spirit. Thats why they often do more harm than good. [/b]
damn nice one. see this is why i like asking you guys about organizations like AI... When people parade it around like it's some holly entity, I just dont agree. and something never feels right about these organizations. I just can't quite put the finger on what exactly it is that bugs me about them. and thanks to you guys I get the BIG picture.

same things with the LiNK (liberty in North Korea) organization. do you guys remember a few months back? I had this uneasy feeling about them.. on their views and tactics. thats why I asked you guys and again brought a lot of light into the issue and made me feel good about my skepticism.

thanks!

[Comrade Nadezhda]

AI is reactionary. When I attended university they were always advocating for reformist shit that makes no impact for the mostpart. They ignore the conditions causing oppression, they oppose forms of "resistance" outside of legal reforms (which I would argue is not resistance at all) but they argue it does good. From what I've seem, AI is creating more blind sheep than there already are- covering up the real issues with "what people can do" by signing a petition, sending letters- classic example of a reactionary organization. They oppose revolutionary movement, marxism, and throw around pacifist arguments. Unfortunately, people buy into it.

[Bilan]

CN, that's hardly reactionary. It's reformist, pacifist shit, but not reactionary.

I've worked with AI before. Infact, I did my work experience there. There were some really rad cats involved in it, and some who weren't. Some were anti-capitalists, some were ecologists, anarchists, communists, etc. And some were liberal twats - like the one who got angry at me when I said using violence to confront, or resist fascism isn't necessarily - or at all - bad, of which she claimed was a human rights violation. :unsure:

My main issues with AI I have already discussed with AI itself when I did WE there, which were mainly, what's been spoken of here. And many of the people involved agreed, but saw AI as a sort of presentable arm of anti-oppression politics, and an agreeable platform for people of different 'leftist' positions to organize under - the banner of human rights.
I don't agree.

[midnight marauder]

Originally posted by CN
they oppose forms of "resistance" outside of legal reforms (which I would argue is not resistance at all)

On this note, one of the problems I've had working with Amnesty International in the past is that their definition of "prisoners of conscious" is extremely narrow. The organization (at least officially, and in my experience) will not support political or politicized prisoners who advocate violent resistance.

[R_P_A_S]

the problem with amnesty is that they divert attention into reformist methods that could otherwise be ploughed into revolutionary spirit. Thats why they often do more harm than good.

Why doesn't a revolutionary alternative exist to this? or is it called the communist party?

How come is not as popular than?

[Red Rebel]

In addition to the things already mentioned, they have a strict doctrine. i.e. it is a top to bottom organization. The head sends messages to all the clubs on what the issues are. I am in another school progressive organizations (anti-sweatshop); however, because the top people in amnesty don't recognize our issue, they don't act with us in solidarity.