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View Full Version : Was the early Soviet Union a technocracy?



Q
4th December 2007, 07:18
I know there are a few threads about technocracy running now already, but I seek an answer to a specific question, so I started a new one.

Now, the early Soviet Union was one full of troubles: it had a civil war in which the forefront of the working class fought heroicly, but also died at an alarming pace. This caused a rather unique class tension in the Soviet society in that farmers were enmasse recruited to work in the factories in the cities but did obviously not have a proletarian tradition and had in general a lower standard in education (if any).


This is why I think it was Trotsky who proposed a military like structure for the industrial working class, in which engineers and an educated few had control over vast industrial areas.

Now the reason why I started this topic is a claim that was made in several other topics about technocracy, I'll quote one:

Originally posted by drosera99
I have met certain technocrats who believe engineers should totally run society. In that sense a very limited group of "technocrats" could be percieved as advocating a class system but that is it.

It wasn't intended this way, but could one argue that the early Soviet Union was in fact a technocracy?

And this leads me to another question: Soviet democracy is a layered democratic system in which every layer has a specific function: big disasters are handled nationally, building highways regionally, that sort of thing. One could argue that people with knowledge about building highways are generally elected in a regional board about building them and one with knowledge about macro-economy would be elected in a national board for central economic planning. So, isn't a socialistic society technocratic by definition?

Dros
4th December 2007, 21:06
No. Technocracy = use of technology to solve all productive problems.

Dimentio
4th December 2007, 21:45
Originally posted by [email protected] 04, 2007 09:05 pm
No. Technocracy = use of technology to solve all productive problems.
No.

Technocracy = Scientific management of technology instead of Political management of people + Common Usership + Energy Accounting.

spartan
4th December 2007, 23:09
Also being a Technocrat means that you were hand picked to do a job not because of any political beliefs but because of your skills in the role that you were picked for.

Franco's Spain was a Technocracy in that sense as the Fascist regime always appointed apolitical Technocrats to manage the economy for them thus in a sense creating an apolitical bureaucracy.

Now the difference between Franco's Spain and the USSR is that in the USSR people were usually chosen for a role because of their politics and loyalty to a specific figure whilst Francos Technocrats were apolitical and were chosen for their skill instead of any loyalty or political beliefs.

Thus the USSR was not a Technocracy.

Dimentio
4th December 2007, 23:12
Originally posted by [email protected] 04, 2007 11:08 pm
Also being a Technocrat means that you were hand picked to do a job not because of any political beliefs but because of your skills in the role that you were picked for.

Franco's Spain was a Technocracy in that sense as the Fascist regime always appointed apolitical Technocrats to manage the economy for them thus in a sense creating an apolitical bureaucracy.
Apolitical? They were almost all members of Opus Dei. But quite competent, since Opus Dei is one of the best cults you could join if you want to become an android.

Luckily for Tech.Inc, it was a heavily anti-catholic organisation.

Dros
5th December 2007, 03:18
Originally posted by [email protected] 04, 2007 09:44 pm
Technocracy = Scientific management of technology instead of Political management of people + Common Usership + Energy Accounting.
Right. But the key element of all of the technocracy stuff I've read and all the technocrats I know is that they use technology to essentially end manual labor allowing all of humanity to live in relative labour. I understand that I was being perhaps just a little simplistic. Really...

Dimentio
5th December 2007, 11:15
Originally posted by drosera99+December 05, 2007 03:17 am--> (drosera99 @ December 05, 2007 03:17 am)
[email protected] 04, 2007 09:44 pm
Technocracy = Scientific management of technology instead of Political management of people + Common Usership + Energy Accounting.
Right. But the key element of all of the technocracy stuff I've read and all the technocrats I know is that they use technology to essentially end manual labor allowing all of humanity to live in relative labour. I understand that I was being perhaps just a little simplistic. Really... [/b]
That is the key element, and it requires the abolishment of the price system.