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which doctor
27th November 2007, 05:26
Further rioting in Paris suburb

French youths have been battling police for a second night in a suburb of Paris where two teenagers died after their motorcycle collided with a police car.

French police say more than 60 officers have been injured in the clashes, which lasted late into the night.

A state prosecutor has ordered a manslaughter inquiry into the deaths of the two teenagers in Villiers-le-Bel.

Local youths blame police for the deaths but police say the two teenagers were speeding and not wearing helmets.

The clashes come despite numerous appeals for calm, including one by President Nicolas Sarkozy, who is visiting China.

Several vehicles, including a police car, have been set on fire and there are reports that shots have been fired at police.

Police fired tear gas and rubber bullets to keep rioters at bay.

The violence follows Sunday night's clashes when about 30 cars and several buildings, including a police station, were torched in Villiers-le-Bel and neighbouring Arnouville.

Twenty-six police and fire officers were injured and nine people were arrested.

The clashes were reminiscent of nationwide riots in 2005, which followed the deaths of two youths in the nearby suburb of Clichy-sous-Bois.

A state prosecutor has ordered the National Police General Inspectorate (IGPN) - an oversight body - to carry out a detailed inquiry into the circumstances in which the two teenagers - named only as Moushin, 15, and Larami, 16, lost their lives.

Police sources say the early findings of the inquiry suggest the two officers involved in Sunday's incident are not to blame.

The motorcycle was going at its full speed, it was not registered for street use, the two teenagers were not wearing helmets and they ignored traffic rules, police officials said.

The police car was on a routine patrol and the teenagers were not being chased by police at the time of the accident, officials said.

The prosecutor who has ordered the investigation, Marie-Therese de Givry, told LCI television that the teenagers had turned into the path of the police car.

She said the officers immediately called emergency services to the scene.

Two witnesses are said to have confirmed this, but the teenagers' relatives and other local residents say the police did nothing to help the dying teenagers.

Breakdown in relations

President Sarkozy said he wanted "everyone to calm down and let the justice system decide who was responsible."

When he was interior minister in 2005, country-wide riots erupted after the electrocution of two teenagers from another Parisian suburb - Clichy-sous-Bois - in an electricity sub-station. They were reported to have been fleeing police at the time.

The trouble has highlighted the breakdown of relations between police and young people in many of France's poor suburbs, says the BBC's Alasdair Sandford in Paris.

source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7114175.stm

RedStarOverChina
27th November 2007, 12:18
Originally posted by BBC
Nearly 80 French police officers have been injured, six seriously, during a second night of riots by youths in the suburbs of Paris, police unions say.
Wow. Just Wow. :blink:

I might have to learn French and move over there at some point in my life.

lvleph
27th November 2007, 13:14
They are saying that guns are being used by the rioters.

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 13:46
this is heating up. it probably will end badly for the rioters though, although the cops seem to be getting there asses kicked. Unfortunately the government will support the pigs and these rioters will strongly be discredited. i dont know all the facts. All ths because two teenagers died. if they werent wearing helmets and were speeding then the cops are not to blame. accidents happen and if wreckless driving was involved than all this is to avAIL. just another excuse for troublemakers to beat on cops. not that i have a problem with that :D

ComradeR
27th November 2007, 13:58
From what I've seen the situation in France holds a lot of potential, events like this and the recent wave of strikes could possibly escalate into something more.
Does anyone here have any sources on the strength of the left in France? Are there any strong leftist movements there?

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 14:02
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 01:57 pm
From what I've seen the situation in France holds a lot of potential, events like this and the recent wave of strikes could possibly escalate into something more.
Does anyone here have any sources on the strength of the left in France? Are there any strong leftist movements there?
r u kidding me?
i dont have sources but France has quite a strong Left.
u r right though, as much as this may seem (to me) out of line...ths could escalate into something more. unfortunately sarkozys a fascist and would stop at nothing to crush ANY leftist movement. he has already destroyed the major unions, all thats left is the small ones and then ho wil defend the workers. WEll at least we got the teenagers with sticks in the streets!

Red October
27th November 2007, 14:23
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 08:13 am
They are saying that guns are being used by the rioters.
Yes, I've heard that too. A radio report I listened to this morning said the police have reported being shot at many times during these riots as well as rioters suing firebombs. And 80 cops is a hell of a lot lot be injured in only 2 days of rioting. This almost never happens in America. I hope revolutionary groups get more involved in this and continue to develop the situation. Do we have any french members of the board who know more about what's going on?

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 14:35
Originally posted by Red October+November 27, 2007 02:22 pm--> (Red October @ November 27, 2007 02:22 pm)
[email protected] 27, 2007 08:13 am
They are saying that guns are being used by the rioters.
Yes, I've heard that too. A radio report I listened to this morning said the police have reported being shot at many times during these riots as well as rioters suing firebombs. And 80 cops is a hell of a lot lot be injured in only 2 days of rioting. This almost never happens in America. I hope revolutionary groups get more involved in this and continue to develop the situation. Do we have any french members of the board who know more about what's going on? [/b]
i heard they were using guns but this morning in the french news paper hen i read they were using it was a certain kind of gun. does anyone have more details, i dont knowif they were actually firearms. either way, whats going s is crazy, not enough media coverage here. fucking corporate-sponsored newsstation.

lvleph
27th November 2007, 14:45
There are rumors that the police rear ended the teenagers and took off.

I read that they were using hunting rifles, and molotov cocktails.

Oh and the police are saying that it is more like urban warfare than a riot.

ComradeR
27th November 2007, 14:57
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 02:44 pm
There are rumors that the police rear ended the teenagers and took off.

I read that they were using hunting rifles, and molotov cocktails.

Oh and the police are saying that it is more like urban warfare than a riot.
The beginnings of a revolt perhaps? Or maybe thats just my hope.
I would like to get more info on this situation though.

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 15:28
Originally posted by ComradeR+November 27, 2007 02:56 pm--> (ComradeR @ November 27, 2007 02:56 pm)
[email protected] 27, 2007 02:44 pm
There are rumors that the police rear ended the teenagers and took off.

I read that they were using hunting rifles, and molotov cocktails.

Oh and the police are saying that it is more like urban warfare than a riot.
The beginnings of a revolt perhaps? Or maybe thats just my hope.
I would like to get more info on this situation though. [/b]
whatever the situation, it definitely not beig publicised enough. you can never trust north american media to tell you the full truth

Ultra-Violence
27th November 2007, 17:01
WOW! the french got BALLS! haha take that fucking pigs and thier getting shot at! im lost for words really i hop those Kids fuck em up Super Nasty stlye

lvleph
27th November 2007, 17:18
Originally posted by Ender+November 27, 2007 10:27 am--> (Ender @ November 27, 2007 10:27 am)
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 02:56 pm

[email protected] 27, 2007 02:44 pm
There are rumors that the police rear ended the teenagers and took off.

I read that they were using hunting rifles, and molotov cocktails.

Oh and the police are saying that it is more like urban warfare than a riot.
The beginnings of a revolt perhaps? Or maybe thats just my hope.
I would like to get more info on this situation though.
whatever the situation, it definitely not beig publicised enough. you can never trust north american media to tell you the full truth [/b]
I got my info from Al Jazeera (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/0FBCBB56-BA9B-40D6-860D-BC83E14ED202.htm) and BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7115267.stm).

The last article states that some police were actually shot.

Red October
27th November 2007, 18:18
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 09:44 am
Oh and the police are saying that it is more like urban warfare than a riot.
Indeed, the BBC article said the use of fire arms against police was "almost systematic", and it looks like the youth have scanners and are monitoring police activity. At least one police station was torched too. The police are also saying the violence is even more intense than the weeks of riots back in 2005. This is definitely not a typical riot, it's seems more like a small insurrection. I hope the youth find a way to unite with workers on this and continue to progress.

LOTFW
27th November 2007, 18:27
Do not expect Paris, or its oft' time radical sea port workers, or its students, or France as a whole to EVER join our cause. About 30+% are with us, but recent urban anger has a lot to do with population and culture, and the assimilation (or disinterest in doing so) of the new immigrants.

Over 40% of the French have become fiercly anti-communist (by their own poles) and another 20% will only support "socialism" where there is a traditional consitution and rolls of prsidency, etc. Most continue to be pre-occupied with whether or not the goals of the French Revolutionary spirit will be undermined by religious and factional parading and non-class struggle issues.

Good Luck to them and Revolution. The current anti-Muslim/pro-"French" arguments will fuel the right for years to come.

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 18:33
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 06:26 pm
Do not expect Paris, or its oft' time radical sea port workers, or its students, or France as a whole to EVER join our cause. About 30+% are with us, but recent urban anger has a lot to do with population and culture, and the assimilation (or disinterest in doing so) of the new immigrants.

Over 40% of the French have become fiercly anti-communist (by their own poles) and another 20% will only support "socialism" where there is a traditional consitution and rolls of prsidency, etc. Most continue to be pre-occupied with whether or not the goals of the French Revolutionary spirit will be undermined by religious and factional parading and non-class struggle issues.

Good Luck to them and Revolution. The current anti-Muslim/pro-"French" arguments will fuel the right for years to come.
im not sure about your statisics but what i can say is this. There are many french leftists and and many who do support communism. Unfortunately, as much as i like to see cops getting fucked up by lefties, i hate to admit that this is only making us and them look badbecause there is not that large base of support amongst the students, workers and the general population.
but again, i could be wrong. feel free to criticize me. i think im just just being exra sensible today..lol

LOTFW
27th November 2007, 19:17
My statistics are available at most sites that break down French public opinion and party membership. There are about 3 or 4 "communist" parties in France that get about 32% each election. All of the other stuff is up there, too.

In fact. I wasn't critizising you or your report. I just believe the closest the French got to communism is the 60's. the collapse of the Soviet block and the integration of former East Germans into western Europe was a blow to the Revolution. Young people throughout Europe are neither embracing America or Communism. They are talking about a "controlled" capitalist world, with a strong safety net for all citizens.

I believe the USA will move toward that direction as well.

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 19:25
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 07:16 pm
My statistics are available at most sites that break down French public opinion and party membership. There are about 3 or 4 "communist" parties in France that get about 32% each election. All of the other stuff is up there, too.

In fact. I wasn't critizising you or your report. I just believe the closest the French got to communism is the 60's. the collapse of the Soviet block and the integration of former East Germans into western Europe was a blow to the Revolution. Young people throughout Europe are neither embracing America or Communism. They are talking about a "controlled" capitalist world, with a strong safety net for all citizens.

I believe the USA will move toward that direction as well.
well under sarkozy things dont seem to be going anywhere towards the left but i think that the sentiment is there. alot of leftists give up their beliefs in communism when things sem to be going nowhere only to take them back up when things get heated agin. i dont see this as hypocrasy only as less solid faith, but worry not degrading social conditions for workers, families and students wil help mobilise the french again.

Nothing Human Is Alien
27th November 2007, 19:32
The basic details of the collision are not in dispute. According to the daily Le Monde, “the motorbike skidded for over twenty meters,” while “the police car’s front was smashed and the bumpers torn off; the windshield caved in deeply.” The policemen promptly fled the scene on foot.

Marie-Thérère Givry, the Pontoise district prosecutor, said that the policemen left the area and did not begin investigations until that night because of “the danger that their presence in that area would have posed.” She did not explain her comment further, but it is clear that they feared being caught by enraged inhabitants.

Le Monde quoted Younès B., an inhabitant of Villiers-le-Bel: “A second police team came to pick up their colleagues. But they left the two kids without doing anything.”
http://wsws.org/articles/2007/nov2007/fran-n27.shtml

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 19:37
Originally posted by Compañ[email protected] 27, 2007 07:31 pm

The basic details of the collision are not in dispute. According to the daily Le Monde, “the motorbike skidded for over twenty meters,” while “the police car’s front was smashed and the bumpers torn off; the windshield caved in deeply.” The policemen promptly fled the scene on foot.

Marie-Thérère Givry, the Pontoise district prosecutor, said that the policemen left the area and did not begin investigations until that night because of “the danger that their presence in that area would have posed.” She did not explain her comment further, but it is clear that they feared being caught by enraged inhabitants.

Le Monde quoted Younès B., an inhabitant of Villiers-le-Bel: “A second police team came to pick up their colleagues. But they left the two kids without doing anything.”
http://wsws.org/articles/2007/nov2007/fran-n27.shtml
i think that police are actually discriminated agains to much by us. if the police had STAYED we would not be mentioning their eroic acts of trying to save the lives of the boys but still using any means necesary to discredit them. BUT in this case, they did leave and did not try to help the boys so we have all the reason to discredit them. just be careful you arent too one sided on this issue of police. Like i said befor, i enjoy seeing cops facing off with leftists-AND LOSING , so powert those in the sreets fighting the pigs.

lvleph
27th November 2007, 20:31
It is interesting to see the differing response to very similar situations. In Las Vegas, almost a year and a half ago, a cop was speeding at 110MPH and slammed into the back of a car carrying 5 people. Everyone in the car died except a pregnant teen. The cop claimed to be heading to a call, but it was shown he wasn't. The only thing that happened to him was that he was put on suspension. No one rioted; in fact, most people in the US probably never even heard about it. Maybe, it was because the people in the car were undocumented workers?

AGITprop
27th November 2007, 21:07
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 08:30 pm
It is interesting to see the differing response to very similar situations. In Las Vegas, almost a year and a half ago, a cop was speeding at 110MPH and slammed into the back of a car carrying 5 people. Everyone in the car died except a pregnant teen. The cop claimed to be heading to a call, but it was shown he wasn't. The only thing that happened to him was that he was put on suspension. No one rioted; in fact, most people in the US probably never even heard about it. Maybe, it was because the people in the car were undocumented workers?
well then in that case ide have to say the french are mor militant then the united statians but this is only one comparison. again people are scared to face off with american police. they use any excuse to use their guns whereas the french riot police probably wouldnt shoot at you if ou attcked them with a stick or rock

which doctor
27th November 2007, 23:15
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 03:30 pm
It is interesting to see the differing response to very similar situations. In Las Vegas, almost a year and a half ago, a cop was speeding at 110MPH and slammed into the back of a car carrying 5 people. Everyone in the car died except a pregnant teen. The cop claimed to be heading to a call, but it was shown he wasn't. The only thing that happened to him was that he was put on suspension. No one rioted; in fact, most people in the US probably never even heard about it. Maybe, it was because the people in the car were undocumented workers?
In Benton Harbor, Michigan, an economically depressed, largely black community of less than 12,000 people, a popular local man was killed while being chased on his motorcycle. The next 2 days the city was in flames as people rioted all night long. It took the national guard to get the city back under control. Such small scale insurrections do occasionally happen in the United States, you just have to keep your ears open as the media are not going to broadcast it for you.

Red October
27th November 2007, 23:16
Originally posted by FoB+November 27, 2007 06:14 pm--> (FoB @ November 27, 2007 06:14 pm)
[email protected] 27, 2007 03:30 pm
It is interesting to see the differing response to very similar situations. In Las Vegas, almost a year and a half ago, a cop was speeding at 110MPH and slammed into the back of a car carrying 5 people. Everyone in the car died except a pregnant teen. The cop claimed to be heading to a call, but it was shown he wasn't. The only thing that happened to him was that he was put on suspension. No one rioted; in fact, most people in the US probably never even heard about it. Maybe, it was because the people in the car were undocumented workers?
In Benton Harbor, Michigan, an economically depressed, largely black community of less than 12,000 people, a popular local man was killed while being chased on his motorcycle. The next 2 days the city was in flames as people rioted all night long. It took the national guard to get the city back under control. Such small scale insurrections do occasionally happen in the United States, you just have to keep your ears open as the media are not going to broadcast it for you. [/b]
When did that happen?

Organic Revolution
28th November 2007, 00:03
Originally posted by Red October+November 27, 2007 05:15 pm--> (Red October @ November 27, 2007 05:15 pm)
Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 06:14 pm

[email protected] 27, 2007 03:30 pm
It is interesting to see the differing response to very similar situations. In Las Vegas, almost a year and a half ago, a cop was speeding at 110MPH and slammed into the back of a car carrying 5 people. Everyone in the car died except a pregnant teen. The cop claimed to be heading to a call, but it was shown he wasn't. The only thing that happened to him was that he was put on suspension. No one rioted; in fact, most people in the US probably never even heard about it. Maybe, it was because the people in the car were undocumented workers?
In Benton Harbor, Michigan, an economically depressed, largely black community of less than 12,000 people, a popular local man was killed while being chased on his motorcycle. The next 2 days the city was in flames as people rioted all night long. It took the national guard to get the city back under control. Such small scale insurrections do occasionally happen in the United States, you just have to keep your ears open as the media are not going to broadcast it for you.
When did that happen? [/b]
2003. http://www.adversity.net/BentonHarbor/Bent...orRaceRiots.htm (http://www.adversity.net/BentonHarbor/BentonHarborRaceRiots.htm) My comrades were up there for that.

Connolly
28th November 2007, 01:05
Does anyone have any good analysis, preferably class :P , of the situation?

Or even from the last riots there in France?

Something along the lines of this...

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/74528

which doctor
28th November 2007, 02:00
Apparently riots have spread into Toulouse, France.

Organic Revolution
28th November 2007, 02:48
Some interesting quotes,

"Police union officials warned that the violence was escalating into urban guerrilla warfare with shotguns aimed at officers - a rare sight in the last major outbreak of suburban unrest in 2005."

"That's just the beginning. This is a war. There is no mercy," Cem said. "We want two cops dead."

"The police brought this on themselves," Karim chimed in. "They will regret it."

"The anger is so strong that some young men stood by the charred timbers of the town's police station, laughing and surveying the damage."

"On the A1 highway outside of Paris, bold graffiti letters promised "Revenge for Villiers-le-Bel." Cars were burning in at least four neighboring suburbs, and minor clashes occurred in at least one other town."

ComradeR
28th November 2007, 10:08
Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 01:59 am
Apparently riots have spread into Toulouse, France.
Good sign, hopefully this spreads throughout the whole of France.

lvleph
28th November 2007, 12:36
Racist systems will all hopefully fall, but I am not quite sure if this is Frances time.

AGITprop
28th November 2007, 16:33
i read in the french newspaper today that violence has died down in France. it wasnt very detaild but apparently not much mkore is going on. Will it start up again? who knows?

Wanted Man
28th November 2007, 18:21
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.

AGITprop
28th November 2007, 18:24
Originally posted by Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho

An archist
28th November 2007, 18:26
Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 04:32 pm
i read in the french newspaper today that violence has died down in France. it wasnt very detaild but apparently not much mkore is going on. Will it start up again? who knows?
In the Paris suburbs, nothing much happened last night because thousands of riot cops were patrolling, however, in other cities, cars were torched.

AGITprop
28th November 2007, 18:32
Originally posted by An archist+November 28, 2007 06:25 pm--> (An archist @ November 28, 2007 06:25 pm)
[email protected] 28, 2007 04:32 pm
i read in the french newspaper today that violence has died down in France. it wasnt very detaild but apparently not much mkore is going on. Will it start up again? who knows?
In the Paris suburbs, nothing much happened last night because thousands of riot cops were patrolling, however, in other cities, cars were torched. [/b]
well there you go!

Organic Revolution
28th November 2007, 23:45
Originally posted by Ender+November 28, 2007 12:23 pm--> (Ender @ November 28, 2007 12:23 pm)
Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho [/b]
Jesus, do you not read anything but corporate news? It is being supported by workers, and worker unions. This riot isnt a "reactionary" anything, it is an expression of anger from oppressed youth who have been beaten into submission by the state.

AGITprop
28th November 2007, 23:53
Originally posted by Organic Revolution+November 28, 2007 11:44 pm--> (Organic Revolution @ November 28, 2007 11:44 pm)
Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 12:23 pm

Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho
Jesus, do you not read anything but corporate news? It is being supported by workers, and worker unions. This riot isnt a "reactionary" anything, it is an expression of anger from oppressed youth who have been beaten into submission by the state. [/b]
yea but things are hapenning under uncertain pretences
we dont know if the cops were actually reponsible for the death of the teens
the teens were probably speeding or probably did cross a red light like a bunch of idiots. if people are rioting because a cop car got hit by a speeding idiot than this riot is completely stupid. no on knows all the facts and untill we do im not siding with anyone

Organic Revolution
28th November 2007, 23:57
Originally posted by Ender+November 28, 2007 05:52 pm--> (Ender @ November 28, 2007 05:52 pm)
Originally posted by Organic [email protected] 28, 2007 11:44 pm

Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 12:23 pm

Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho
Jesus, do you not read anything but corporate news? It is being supported by workers, and worker unions. This riot isnt a "reactionary" anything, it is an expression of anger from oppressed youth who have been beaten into submission by the state.
yea but things are hapenning under uncertain pretences
we dont know if the cops were actually reponsible for the death of the teens
the teens were probably speeding or probably did cross a red light like a bunch of idiots. if people are rioting because a cop car got hit by a speeding idiot than this riot is completely stupid. no on knows all the facts and untill we do im not siding with anyone [/b]
So, if the cops killed the kids than its fine to riot, but if they didn't, then don't fight the cops and the state? That makes perfect sense.... :wacko:

Faux Real
28th November 2007, 23:58
Originally posted by Ender+November 28, 2007 10:23 am--> (Ender @ November 28, 2007 10:23 am)
Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho[/b]
What the fuck?

No, this is not reactionary. Reactionary would be these immigrants and minorities to follow the pacifist creed and allow themselves to be fucked over/ignored.

Of course this uprising isn't popular, they're seen as inferior throughout much of "native" French society. These are the Muslims, Arabs, Africans, southern Asians that are at the bottom of the barrel who have been left voiceless and haven't received support ever since the last mass protest.

What would you suggest they do otherwise, wait?

which doctor
29th November 2007, 00:20
Originally posted by Ender+November 28, 2007 06:52 pm--> (Ender @ November 28, 2007 06:52 pm)
Originally posted by Organic [email protected] 28, 2007 11:44 pm

Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 12:23 pm

Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho
Jesus, do you not read anything but corporate news? It is being supported by workers, and worker unions. This riot isnt a "reactionary" anything, it is an expression of anger from oppressed youth who have been beaten into submission by the state.
yea but things are hapenning under uncertain pretences
we dont know if the cops were actually reponsible for the death of the teens
the teens were probably speeding or probably did cross a red light like a bunch of idiots. if people are rioting because a cop car got hit by a speeding idiot than this riot is completely stupid. no on knows all the facts and untill we do im not siding with anyone [/b]
If you actually think these riots are solely in response to the death of the two kids, than you are idiot. These riots are the result of pent up anger towards racism, the state and capitalism.

redarmyfaction38
29th November 2007, 01:07
Originally posted by FoB+November 29, 2007 12:19 am--> (FoB @ November 29, 2007 12:19 am)
Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 06:52 pm

Originally posted by Organic [email protected] 28, 2007 11:44 pm

Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 12:23 pm

Van [email protected] 28, 2007 06:20 pm
It'll likely just fizzle out again, but it's good TV.
spontaneous reactionnary manifestations of anger like this rarely acomplish anything. it takes a support basis by a large group of people. im not saying this doesnt send a message it just doesnt start revolution. kdos to the french kids for fucking up the cops tho
Jesus, do you not read anything but corporate news? It is being supported by workers, and worker unions. This riot isnt a "reactionary" anything, it is an expression of anger from oppressed youth who have been beaten into submission by the state.
yea but things are hapenning under uncertain pretences
we dont know if the cops were actually reponsible for the death of the teens
the teens were probably speeding or probably did cross a red light like a bunch of idiots. if people are rioting because a cop car got hit by a speeding idiot than this riot is completely stupid. no on knows all the facts and untill we do im not siding with anyone
If you actually think these riots are solely in response to the death of the two kids, than you are idiot. These riots are the result of pent up anger towards racism, the state and capitalism. [/b]
WOW! an argument about something real for a change ;)
truth is, these "riots" were sparked by the incident involving the 2 youths on a motorcycle, who had, apparently, been stopped twice before on the same night and found to have theirpapers "in order".
the fact that these deaths can spark such behaviour, points to an underlying discontent within the working class areas of paris (formerly known as the red belt) and the working class areas of other french cities like marseille, where the disenfranchised lept at an opportunity to show their anger at french bourgeoius society.
however, to regard these roits as some basis for hopes of a revolutionary situation is opportunist to say the least, the organised working class, in the form of the trade unions, has been conspicuous by its abscence, this is not because the ordinary worker does not sympathise with the actions of the rioters, but because france is suffering from the same kind of political vacuum the rest of europe is enduring.
right wing fascist elements in all the major parties present this rioting as ethnic rather than class based dis satisifaction. despite the obvious participation of french youths in the disturbances and the general outrage of the older elements at the behaviour of the gendarme.

so, comrades, what is the way forward, how do we turn outbursts of anger into a revolutionary challenge to bourgeoius society?

NaxalbariZindabad
29th November 2007, 01:58
Originally posted by The [email protected] 28, 2007 01:04 am
Does anyone have any good analysis, preferably class :P , of the situation?

Or even from the last riots there in France?
France’s Proletarian Youth Erupt, from A World to Win :

http://www.aworldtowin.org/current_issues/32France.htm

Jesus Christ!
29th November 2007, 02:13
I seriously can't wait to move to france when I'm older.