Cuba and China

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Granma:


Raúl receives member of Political Bureau of Chinese Communist Party

GENERAL of the Army Raúl Castro Ruz, second secretary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Cuba, received Wang Zhaoguo, a member of the Political Bureau of the Communist Party of China and the delegation that accompanies him on Wednesday afternoon.

Wang Zhaoguo provided detailed information on the outcome of the recent 17th Congress of the Chinese Communist Party, and emphasized the fraternal ties between the two parties, governments and nations. Likewise, he transmitted to Raúl greetings and a message from Hu Jintao, general secretary of the Party and president of the People’s Republic of China, to President Fidel Castro Ruz, wishing him a prompt recovery.

Raúl Castro Ruz expressed thanks for the Chinese Communist Party’s gesture in sending a high-level delegation to bring information on the outcome of the 17th Party Congress, which he described as a successful event that demonstrated the guiding role of the Communist Party in Chinese society. He noted that Wang Zhaoguo’s visit is part of the fraternal relations uniting the two countries.

Raúl affirmed that the implementation of the agreements coming out of that event were an important contribution by the Communist Party to the cause of socialism in China, and a guarantee for stability and international development. For his part, Wang Zhaoguo expressed his satisfaction at Cuba’s achievements in social and economic development, and reiterated the solidarity of the Chinese Party, government and people with the Cuban Revolution.

Others who participated in the meeting included Political Bureau members José Ramón Machado Ventura and Carlos Lage Dávila, and Secretariat member Fernando Remírez de Estenoz.

On the Chinese side, others present included Chen Fengxiang, deputy chief of the Central Committee’s International Department; Cao Weizhou, general sub-secretary of the Permanent Committee of the National People’s Assembly, and Zhao Rongxian, ambassador of the People’s Republic of China in Cuba.

Looks like the Cuban regime wants to emphasize that China is really... "Socialist"?

Also


were an important contribution by the Communist Party to the cause of socialism in China,

So the Cuban regime believes China is socialist? That China's system is socialism?

[Killer Enigma]

How else does one refer to the Communist Party of China other than by calling it the Communist Party of China?

[Marxist Napoleon]

This is a ridiculous attempt to "reveal" the revisionist nature of Cuba. Communists would look at this situation from a materialist point of view, and realize that Cuba is a tiny Carribean island surrounded by enemies that is suffering economically. With the collapse of the Soviet Union, Cuba had to find new trading partners. Isn't it only natural to look to the remaining socialist countries? With China's rapidly-growing economy, why would Cuba stay uninvolved? Also, depending on your definition of the word, the People's Republic of China may be considered socialist in some ways. Are the Cubans evil reactionary pigs for wanting an end to the Blockade?

[Comrade Rage]

Originally posted by Marxist [email protected] 16, 2007 03:53 pm
Isn't it only natural to look to the remaining socialist countries? With China's rapidly-growing economy, why would Cuba stay uninvolved? Also, depending on your definition of the word, the People's Republic of China may be considered socialist in some ways. Are the Cubans evil reactionary pigs for wanting an end to the Blockade?
I'm inclined to agree with you that toadying up to the State-Capitalist Chinese, while utterly repulsive, may be necessary.

But what's with your insistence that China is actually Socialist? :huh:

[jacobin1949]

How is Deng Xiaoping Theory any different from Cuba's Special Period, or Lenin's New Economic Policy. The same people who are so quick to condemn any use of free markets are the greatest critics of Stalin, who originated this irrationalism. Markets does not equal socialism. The ideas that the market does not exist under socialism, is capitalist propaganda that you have swallowed whole. Markets simply mean supply and demand and are simple based on limited resources. Even if a theoretical pure communist state could do away with markets, its unfair to hold 3rd world nations to this standard.

[Comrade Rage]

Originally posted by [email protected] 16, 2007 04:23 pm
The ideas that the market does not exist under socialism, is capitalist propaganda that you have swallowed whole.
Oh have I...
Markets exist, but the 'free' capitalist market is abolished under socialism.

The only thing I'm interested in swallowing is food, pal.

[Cheung Mo]

How does one explain the alliance between Beijing and the bourgeois conservatives in both Hong Kong and Taiwan? The only thing communists have any business doing to the Kuomintang is making them suffer.

[metalero]

reiterated the solidarity of the Chinese Party, government and people with the Cuban Revolution.

and this is the key point of the visit. Cuba has a lot of problems to solve and blockades to overcome to have a little fresh air to keep developing its productive forces in order to maintain its social conquests and to built a healthier socialist society. Strenghtening good relations among countries, despite all the garbage spit at cuba from imperialists, is a good thing.

[BobKKKindle$]

How does one explain the alliance between Beijing and the bourgeois conservatives in both Hong Kong and Taiwan? The only thing communists have any business doing to the Kuomintang is making them suffer.

Fully agree. Increasingly, in China, peasants are beginning to rebel against the expansion of Industrial enterprise, as this is depriving peasants of their lands and, is thereby forcing them to flee to urban areas in order to support their families, as they have no alternative means of sustenance. The Chinese state has found it necessary to use armed force in order to protect the interests of the small minority that have been able to grow wealthy from China's export boom – if China were socialist, the state would consider the needs of the peasantry, and would never have transferred ownership of the country's productive resources to private companies.


How is Deng Xiaoping Theory any different from Cuba's Special Period, or Lenin's New Economic Policy.

In both cases, economic reforms were implemented in order to deal with a crisis. China did not face a crisis when market reforms were implemented, and so your comparison is not legitimate.

[LSD]

Look, I'm the first one to bash Cuba when it's appropriate, but this really is a non-story.

Cuba needs allies wherever she can find them, in this case it so happens that there's one other country left in the world that's still deluded itself into believing that the Cold War's still on. So, of course, they're natural friends.

I suppose all this embracing and trading of Leninist plattitudes could be a tad embarassing for that segment of the left which simultaneously insists that Cuba is a socialist paradise while China is a capitalistic hellhole; but I suspect that they can rationalize this as prudent foreign policy on the part of the Cuban "revolution".

For my part, I view it as nothing more special than the normal business of interstate diplomacy. But then, I don't view the Cuban or Chinese states to be anything particularly special.


How is Deng Xiaoping Theory any different from Cuba's Special Period, or Lenin's New Economic Policy.

Well, that's the question isn't it?

And an even better question is what is it that makes any of these "periods" post-capitalist? After all, capitalism hasn't actually gone anywhere. Not in Russia, not in China, and certainly not in Cuba.

There's still money being exchanged, wages being "earned", labour being bought and sold, and profits after profits after profits.

Oh, the individuals getting rich wear different clothes, sure; well they do in Cuba anyway. In Russia, they've gone back to wearing business suits, in China too. In Cuba they're still pretending to be "representatives" and "commissars", whatever that's supposed to mean. But that won't last long.

State capitalism is an inherently unstable social model, it engenders stagnation and corruption. Cuba, like most late state-capitalist regimes, is currently being held together chiefly by political inertia and a fair smattering of hope.

Hope because, for all its faults, state-capitalist Leninist "Socialism" does at least offer the semblence of a just society, and in many cases a not too shabby social welfare system.

That's what you get when the market has to vie for power with the bureaucratic elite, upper class infighting which, temporarily at least, offers the workers some practical gains in rights and supports.

Which is why while Cuba may not be anything approaching actual socialism, it's still a hell of a lot better than pretty much anywhere else in the region.

[PRC-UTE]

This isn't news, they've visited before.