American History X

[redrogue]

Has anyone seen that film?

[Sanjee]

Is there anyone who has not seen that film?

[Pawn Power]

This has been discussed:
here (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=50530&hl=american+history+x)
here (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=54941&hl=american+history+x)
here (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=34200&hl=american+history+x)
here (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=25270&hl=american+history+x)
and here (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=21562&hl=american+history+x)

I thought the film was okay. I know alot of people really like and think is somesort of masterpiece or truthful display of racism in america. I think it is decent.

[Led Zeppelin]

Just saw it a couple days ago again. Loved the quote at the end, even though it was by Lincoln.

But yeah, great movie.

[blackstone]

What was the quote?

[Led Zeppelin]

Danny Vinyard: So I guess this is where I tell you what I learned - my conclusion, right? Well, my conclusion is: Hate is baggage. Life's too short to be pissed off all the time. It's just not worth it. Derek says it's always good to end a paper with a quote. He says someone else has already said it best. So if you can't top it, steal from them and go out strong. So I picked a guy I thought you'd like. 'We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained, it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory will swell when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.'

[blackstone]

That quote sucks. :)

[Led Zeppelin]

Thanks for that insightful contribution.

[Dimentio]

As for American History X, I think it's general conclusions, that radical political action is just based on "hate", is naive and could easily be done to convince young people to support the status quo.

[La Comédie Noire]

I would like this movie if half the people who liked it didn't just think it was "cool" and took quite the opposite of the movies' intentions and considered becoming Nazis.

But I guess thats stupid people, and no fault of the movie itself.

Does anyone know what I'm talking about? Those people who like to fast foward to the curb stomping scene?


As for American History X, I think it's general conclusions, that radical political action is just based on "hate", is naive and could easily be done to convince young people to support the status quo.

Yeah especially at the end when Ed Norton's character becomes a police spy.

[Chicano Shamrock]

Originally posted by Comrade [email protected] 08, 2007 08:26 am
I would like this movie if half the people who liked it didn't just think it was "cool" and took quite the opposite of the movies' intentions and considered becoming Nazis.

But I guess thats stupid people, and no fault of the movie itself.

Does anyone know what I'm talking about? Those people who like to fast foward to the curb stomping scene?
Yeah, unfortunately I do know people like that. I heard there was an alternate ending of the movie where Norton turns back into a bonehead after his bro is killed. It was supposed to be a shot of him shaving his head as the last shot. Then it would have really attracted those idiots.

[midnight marauder]

Yeah especially at the end when Ed Norton's character becomes a police spy.

Yeah, and in the original ending before it was changed, you see Derek Vinyard in a bathroom with a razor shaving his head and reverting back into a skin.

[La Comédie Noire]

The ambigous ending is much better, it kind of has a christian overtone to it, the whole message of "you reap what you sow." or "what goes around comes around."

It also puts the audience in a position to judge what they themselves would've done.

[Led Zeppelin]

Originally posted by midnight [email protected] 12, 2007 05:24 am

Yeah especially at the end when Ed Norton's character becomes a police spy.

Yeah, and in the original ending before it was changed, you see Derek Vinyard in a bathroom with a razor shaving his head and reverting back into a skin.
Hmm, that's interesting. How do you know that?

[midnight marauder]

Yeah, I like the ambiguous ending better too. I read it on IMDB.

[blackstone]

Originally posted by Chicano Shamrock+October 12, 2007 03:54 am--> (Chicano Shamrock @ October 12, 2007 03:54 am)
Comrade [email protected] 08, 2007 08:26 am
I would like this movie if half the people who liked it didn't just think it was "cool" and took quite the opposite of the movies' intentions and considered becoming Nazis.

But I guess thats stupid people, and no fault of the movie itself.

Does anyone know what I'm talking about? Those people who like to fast foward to the curb stomping scene?
Yeah, unfortunately I do know people like that. I heard there was an alternate ending of the movie where Norton turns back into a bonehead after his bro is killed. It was supposed to be a shot of him shaving his head as the last shot. Then it would have really attracted those idiots. [/b]
I actually like this ending alot more, but your right, it would have def been interpreted the wrong way by neo-fascists and the like.

[Zurdito]

The film did somewhat give a platform to romanticised notions of the white working class as people betrayed by "their" rulers and forced to lose "their" priveliges and live with the violent blacks etc. Where was the exploration of the cause of the blacks portrayed violence (unless we're expected to believe it simply rose out of being beaten up by skinheads).

I think it seemed like a reactionary ant-capitalist film - not racist, but certainly giving a platform to the view that the modern world is no place for a "white working-class male", with too much emphasis on the "white male" and not enough on the "working class". Essentially, it was a film which explored social problems and didn't really explore class once. Seemed like a call for us to "understand" racists - not in material terms, but in terms of understanding their subjective consciousness of being art of a culture which is under attack and which has aspects worth preserving, but which their noveaux-riche brethren have left behind. If the american middle classes can return to those "traditional" values -of course, this is linked to compassion, valuing community, not being materialistic, etc. - then the "true" white working class macho culture could be reclaimed from the racists, and we could all live happilly like in the 1950's. But with blacks now treated "like whites" too.

Well that's how I saw it, a confused film which glorified aspects of people's subjective consciousness.

6/10 - could have done better.

[Vanguard1917]

Good post, Zurdito.

I think that the film presented an extremely liberal version of 'anti-racism' - where 'anti-racism' means appealing to the bourgeois state to crack down on a few handfuls of boneheads or banning school students from reading Mein Kampf.

The film also promotes a kind of liberal conformity which is opposed to all social and political confrontation. 'Life is too short to be angry all the time', etc, etc.