Freedom of speech, U$ style

[Dr Mindbender]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaiWCS10C5s

[IcarusAngel]

It's the rise of a new "police state." Naomi Klein has an interesting new book out called "The Shock Doctrine" which says that natural disasters, coups, and other events that cause a lot of dismay in a country are used to ram through reforms. Milton Friedman, every cappie's favorite economist, even advocated ramming through unpopular economic reforms in a state of disarray.

Drunk woman being tasered repeatedly (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M42sw8cXCHQ&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Edvorak%2Eorg%2Fblog%2F%3Fp %3D13749)

Girl has arm broken for dropping a piece of cake by a security guard (http://forum.protestwarrior.com/redirect.php?page=http://infowars.net/articles/september2007/280907Cake.htm)

The shock doctrine (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0805079831/ref=s9_asin_title_1/002-5526024-2159219?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-1&pf_rd_r=03013Y96BTGWD1ZNNRW0&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=278240701&pf_rd_i=507846)

[Dr Mindbender]

This is actually on another thread in another of the boards. I put it here specifically to get feedback from O.I.'ers in the hope they would defend their precious capitalist 'democracy'.

[Dr Mindbender]

Still no takers from OI'ers? Thought not. Dont like the truth, do you? :)

[Demogorgon]

Originally posted by Ulster [email protected] 30, 2007 01:56 pm
Still no takers from OI'ers? Thought not. Dont like the truth, do you? :)
Well to be fair to them, most cappies who care enough to keep coming to a Communist website and keep arguing with us are radical Libertarians who oppose Democracy anyway. So they might not be terribly concerned about this.

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by Demogorgon+September 30, 2007 02:46 pm--> (Demogorgon @ September 30, 2007 02:46 pm)
Ulster [email protected] 30, 2007 01:56 pm
Still no takers from OI'ers? Thought not. Dont like the truth, do you? :)
Well to be fair to them, most cappies who care enough to keep coming to a Communist website and keep arguing with us are radical Libertarians who oppose Democracy anyway. So they might not be terribly concerned about this. [/b]
I thought their whole rationale for us being the wrong ones is that 'communism=bad' and 'capitalism=democracy' or certainly thats what reactionaries i meet in the real world tell me.
Seems when we get down to the nitty gritty they have nothing to offer.

[Demogorgon]

Originally posted by Ulster Socialist+September 30, 2007 03:58 pm--> (Ulster Socialist @ September 30, 2007 03:58 pm)
Originally posted by [email protected] 30, 2007 02:46 pm

Ulster [email protected] 30, 2007 01:56 pm
Still no takers from OI'ers? Thought not. Dont like the truth, do you? :)
Well to be fair to them, most cappies who care enough to keep coming to a Communist website and keep arguing with us are radical Libertarians who oppose Democracy anyway. So they might not be terribly concerned about this.
I thought their whole rationale for us being the wrong ones is that 'communism=bad' and 'capitalism=democracy' or certainly thats what reactionaries i meet in the real world tell me.
Seems when we get down to the nitty gritty they have nothing to offer. [/b]
Yeah, but here, we tend to get the real hardcore who are opposed to Democracy and want to market to do everything.

In the real world your average supporter of capitalism supports the status quo, but they don't support it so much (for the most part) that they will hunt out leftist websites and spend months spewing their views out there.

It takes fascists like Objectivists and those from the Von Mises fan club (Austrian school) to do that.

[pusher robot]

Originally posted by Ulster [email protected] 29, 2007 09:14 pm
This is actually on another thread in another of the boards. I put it here specifically to get feedback from O.I.'ers in the hope they would defend their precious capitalist 'democracy'.

This is actually on another thread in another of the boards. I put it here specifically to get feedback from O.I.'ers in the hope they would defend their precious capitalist 'democracy'.

I didn't even watch because I knew that's what you wanted. Of course, since we aren't the stereotypes you like to imagine, we won't defend the indefensible.

Wow, big news! United States government is not perfect! Good luck finding anyone to argue against that, chief. Of course, "U.S. Government" != "Capitalism," so even if you did it wouldn't demonstrate what you want it to.

[Dr Mindbender]

No, the USA government isnt perfect but at least in Europe we can criticise the government in public without fear of being tazer'ed and arrested. If America is the vanguard of western capitalism then frankly the further we move away from this vile ideaology the better.

[pusher robot]

No, the USA government isnt perfect but at least in Europe we can criticise the government in public without fear of being tazer'ed and arrested.

Don't play stupid. You and I both know full well that (a) this is not a "freedom of speech" issue as the guy was disrupting a private event and (b) this thing has gotten SO much exposure precisely because it is unusual.

In any case, I refuse to be lectured about freedom of speech by someone who would happily put a bullet through my head for my refusal to give up my "reactionary" viewpoints.


If America is the vanguard of western capitalism then frankly the further we move away from this vile ideaology the better.

One always fears what one does not know.

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by pusher robot+--> (pusher robot)
Don't play stupid. You and I both know full well that (a) this is not a "freedom of speech" issue as the guy was disrupting a private event and (b) this thing has gotten SO much exposure precisely because it is unusual.[/b]
How was he disrupting a 'private' event? It looked to me like a university political rally to which the man was clearly a participating student. He was not behaving provactively in any other respect than the fact that the police felt uncomfortable about him saying things that were detrimental to the status quo. The argument that it is unusual to me is a moot point. If one group of police is prepared to stoop this low to protect the establishment, then it sets a very dangerous precedence.


Originally posted by pusher [email protected]

In any case, I refuse to be lectured about freedom of speech by someone who would happily put a bullet through my head for my refusal to give up my "reactionary" viewpoints.
Oh, spare me the cold-war cliches. I wouldnt gladly 'put a bullet through your head' unfortunately I cant speak on behalf of our more 'enthusiastic' members. I would gladly welcome you into a socialist society of equals. However wether or not you choose to fulfill a positive role within it is your own prerogitive. Don't expect to enjoy the benefits unless you do, though.


pusher robot

One always fears what one does not know.
From where I'm standing, it doesnt take a lot of imagination to think what the full blown version must be like.