Why Do People Come to the US?

[OneBrickOneVoice]

Listen to this talk, its only like 15 minutes or so.

Why do People come here from all over the world? (http://bobavakian.net/sound/why_do_people_come_here_english.mp3)

This talk basically analysizes the crimes of this capitalist-imperialist system, and how why now there is a so called "immigrant problem" in the US when in actuallity we have a capitalist problem

[AmbitiousHedonism]

no.

[Dean]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29, 2007 06:00 am
Listen to this talk, its only like 15 minutes or so.
Listening right now. He has a speech impediment :lol: but I don't dislike him, all I know is that he is president of the RCP.

At leasy he talks about human rights more than many of the 'communists' here...

[settlefornothin]

Bob Avakian likens himself to a god, the RCP and RCYB act like a bunch of stalinists toward this guy. It's almost like a cult of personality, when the revolution comes, stalinists and authoritarians like Avakian will have to be put up against the wall and shot right next to the capitalists and the reactionaries.

[OneBrickOneVoice]

Originally posted by [email protected] 30, 2007 05:03 pm
Bob Avakian likens himself to a god, the RCP and RCYB act like a bunch of stalinists toward this guy. It's almost like a cult of personality, when the revolution comes, stalinists and authoritarians like Avakian will have to be put up against the wall and shot right next to the capitalists and the reactionaries.
dude, go fuck yourself. The RCP/RCYB promotes him as the main leader of the party because his message is inspiring and he reaches the masses. If you had any clue what you were talking about you'd know that Engels made it clear in his essay "On Authority" that Revolution is the most authoritarian action because it is the action of one class suppressing another.

[Dean]

Originally posted by settlefornothin+August 30, 2007 05:03 pm--> (settlefornothin @ August 30, 2007 05:03 pm) Bob Avakian likens himself to a god, the RCP and RCYB act like a bunch of stalinists toward this guy. It's almost like a cult of personality, when the revolution comes, stalinists and authoritarians like Avakian will have to be put up against the wall and shot right next to the capitalists and the reactionaries. [/b]
Why would we have to kill someone who is already going to be out of power by that time?

He may liken himself to a god - power usually corrupts - but does that mean that he deserves to die? Would it help to kill him when it would do nothing but make people think that his messages have become unpopular to the new regime?


LeftyHenry
dude, go fuck yourself. The RCP/RCYB promotes him as the main leader of the party because his message is inspiring and he reaches the masses. If you had any clue what you were talking about you'd know that Engels made it clear in his essay "On Authority" that Revolution is the most authoritarian action because it is the action of one class suppressing another.

That's a different kind of authority; Bob Avakain doesn't represent a class all to himself, and I hardly think that class war is more authoritarian than dictatorial regimes like Nazi Germany and Russia (during the Tsar, USSR and now).

It is perhaps a wider group of people with authority, but certainly not the greatest authority. I think he meant that the change in social organization was more authoritarian, because that changes not only the present but the future as well. I don't see that as a problem, but such productive forms of authority chould not be conflated with centralized authority.

[Whitten]

Revolution is an action of imposing absolute authority. It may be a large body of people holding that authority but it is still the most authoritarian action one can take.

[Dean]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31, 2007 09:41 am
Revolution is an action of imposing absolute authority. It may be a large body of people holding that authority but it is still the most authoritarian action one can take.
"One" doesn't take it; a mass of people do, and it is that mass changing their own social activity that constitutes that revolution. It is certainly less authoritarian than one actually going and controlling the rest of society.

[Whitten]

Originally posted by Dean+August 31, 2007 11:28 am--> (Dean @ August 31, 2007 11:28 am)
[email protected] 31, 2007 09:41 am
Revolution is an action of imposing absolute authority. It may be a large body of people holding that authority but it is still the most authoritarian action one can take.
"One" doesn't take it; a mass of people do, and it is that mass changing their own social activity that constitutes that revolution. It is certainly less authoritarian than one actually going and controlling the rest of society. [/b]
The mass changes its own social relations, yes, but more importantly it forces them on external classes. One class takes absolute authority over another.

[Dr Mindbender]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31, 2007 09:41 am
Revolution is an action of imposing absolute authority. It may be a large body of people holding that authority but it is still the most authoritarian action one can take.
Capitalism is a minority imposing its will (through financial means) onto the majority. How is that morally more defendable than a majority rule?

[Dean]

Originally posted by [email protected] 01, 2007 12:17 pm
The mass changes its own social relations, yes, but more importantly it forces them on external classes. One class takes absolute authority over another.
One class doesn't take absolute authority over the other, even in the dictatorship of the proletariat... it only takes authority necessary to oppress the upper classes to the same level of the proletariat. That'vague, uncertain authority, but not absolute, and it is certainly not a "more authoritarian social order" than a centralized class government. Engels can say what he wants, authority is greater when put in the hands of few because it comprises power over a much larger group of people, and much more share of that power per person that is in control of it.

[RGacky3]

no.

Then don't post asshole.


Revolution is an action of imposing absolute authority. It may be a large body of people holding that authority but it is still the most authoritarian action one can take.

I disagree, there are different types of revolutoins and a revolution can be just as much about dismantling and undermining authority as it is taking and imposing authority.

I'm listening right now.
I'm not a big fan of his speach style, being all angry, cussing a lot.
But I agree with what he's saying totally. Something that Americans don't understand when they say they have the best country in the world. Well, its not that America is so great, its that they have raped and pillaged (along with many Eurpean Powers) other countries, with the aid of the local elites.

Its interesting when he talks about the Chiapas Uprising, I would'nt think that the RCP would support that, seeing as its basically libertarian Socialist movement.

The Immigration issue in America is a powerful one, I know many illigal immigrants, and the suffering they go through just to try give their family a decent life is amazing and horrible, and more people should recognize that, but I do not at all believe that emancipation comes from a guy or a party, it can only come from the people organizing themselves.

I like his song too :P.

[OneBrickOneVoice]

im still interested in the capitalist response to the ideas he puts forward here

[Axel1917]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 04:28 am
im still interested in the capitalist response to the ideas he puts forward here
You will probably just be accused of lying or something like that.

[Hiero]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31, 2007 04:03 am
Bob Avakian likens himself to a god, the RCP and RCYB act like a bunch of stalinists toward this guy. It's almost like a cult of personality, when the revolution comes, stalinists and authoritarians like Avakian will have to be put up against the wall and shot right next to the capitalists and the reactionaries.
Trolling is not allowed on this forum. The topic is not about Bob Avakian, it is about why people come to the US. I don't really like Bob Avakian, but what is right is right, and Bob Avakian is right on this topic.