Who Takes Biodiversity Seriously?

[Marko]

Should we make efforts to maintain biodiversity on Planet Earth?

Wikipedia lists eight possible benefits.

6.1 Resistance to Catastrophe
6.2 Food and drink
6.3 Medicines
6.4 Industrial materials
6.5 Intellectual value
6.6 Better crop-varieties
6.7 Other ecological services
6.8 Leisure, cultural and aesthetic value

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biodiversity

[kelly-087]

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/...60322175455.htm (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/03/060322175455.htm)

Yes why not? It has many benefits like you listed and for ethnical reasons as well. If a species has been doing fine and was stable until humans came and interfered with them resulting in a declining population it is our duty to help them recover.

But here's a question what about animals that were already dieing off like the panda? Before humans arrived in China they were already dieing out, all we did was make them die off faster. Should we help species that were going extinct that was not caused by humans?

[The-Spark]

i read somewhere that naturally there is only supposed to be 2 species a year that becomes extinct. but now because of industrialization, destroying habitats etc. its climbed up to 60. (this including bugs i believe). Its natural for species to become extinct, so yes maybe we shud let the pandas go, but let them go naturally, not by humans.

[Vargha Poralli]

But here's a question what about animals that were already dieing off like the panda? Before humans arrived in China they were already dieing out, all we did was make them die off faster. Should we help species that were going extinct that was not caused by humans?

I don't know much about Panda but one other Species is the Cheetah. Its genetic pool is very much fucked up now a days that the species may die out because of non diversity. But the major cause of itslef is Human activity - for e.g the Asiatic cheetah which is normally used as an exotic pet by the Indian Maharajahs,Baadshahs,Nawabs and Sultans all died otu because of failure of the species in captive breeding.

As of now we don't have full knowledge about the bio-diversity and the complex relationship between various life species. So saving what we have right now is very very important - even if we have to Terraform other planets we need to do it exactly how it has happened here.

[kelly-087]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 04:04 pm

But here's a question what about animals that were already dieing off like the panda? Before humans arrived in China they were already dieing out, all we did was make them die off faster. Should we help species that were going extinct that was not caused by humans?

I don't know much about Panda but one other Species is the Cheetah. Its genetic pool is very much fucked up now a days that the species may die out because of non diversity. But the major cause of itslef is Human activity - for e.g the Asiatic cheetah which is normally used as an exotic pet by the Indian Maharajahs,Baadshahs,Nawabs and Sultans all died otu because of failure of the species in captive breeding.

As of now we don't have full knowledge about the bio-diversity and the complex relationship between various life species. So saving what we have right now is very very important - even if we have to Terraform other planets we need to do it exactly how it has happened here.
Depends on which Cheetah we are talking about. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheetah

The Cheetah as a whole can recover but the sub-species asiatic cheetah only has about 60 to 100 of them are estimated to exist. But they plan on cloning one to help the species. Would that help the species at all?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acinonyx_jubatus_venaticus

[MarxSchmarx]

Here's how I like to think about the importance of biodiversity to the biosphere. Imagine a jumbo jet and assume a gremlin started tinkering with the thing. Now the gremlin doesn't wasn't the plane to crash, but derives enormous pleasure out of doing what it does.

So it can unscrew a few bolts here and there, probably rip out some electrical wires, and the plane will probably continue to fly fine.

The problem is this. The gremlin knows it can't unscrew all bolts and the plane continue to fly. But the gremlin has at best only a vague sense of what instruments are more important than others, and it doesn't know exactly when it will be that the bolt that we remove will cause the plane to disintegrate. The most prudent thing for the Gremlin to do, if it wants the plane to eventually land safely, is to not fuck with it.

[Vargha Poralli]

Originally posted by kelly-087+August 03, 2007 03:31 am--> (kelly-087 @ August 03, 2007 03:31 am)
Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 04:04 pm

But here's a question what about animals that were already dieing off like the panda? Before humans arrived in China they were already dieing out, all we did was make them die off faster. Should we help species that were going extinct that was not caused by humans?

I don't know much about Panda but one other Species is the Cheetah. Its genetic pool is very much fucked up now a days that the species may die out because of non diversity. But the major cause of itslef is Human activity - for e.g the Asiatic cheetah which is normally used as an exotic pet by the Indian Maharajahs,Baadshahs,Nawabs and Sultans all died otu because of failure of the species in captive breeding.

As of now we don't have full knowledge about the bio-diversity and the complex relationship between various life species. So saving what we have right now is very very important - even if we have to Terraform other planets we need to do it exactly how it has happened here.
Depends on which Cheetah we are talking about. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheetah

The Cheetah as a whole can recover but the sub-species asiatic cheetah only has about 60 to 100 of them are estimated to exist. But they plan on cloning one to help the species. Would that help the species at all?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acinonyx_jubatus_venaticus[/b]
Well the African Cheetah also have the problems too. The Cheetah Genes are so weak that a disease (http://www.cheetah.org/?nd=41)could wipe out the entire population. The Asiatic Cheetah's extinction has worsened the condition as there is not possiblity to cross breed the Two species.



But they plan on cloning one to help the species. Would that help the species at all?


The problem with Cloning is that it does not guarantee the Genetic Diversity. Worse it might do the opposite. But it is too early to predict anything.


MarxSchmarx

The gremlin knows it can't unscrew all bolts and the plane continue to fly. But the gremlin has at best only a vague sense of what instruments are more important than others, and it doesn't know exactly when it will be that the bolt that we remove will cause the plane to disintegrate. The most prudent thing for the Gremlin to do, if it wants the plane to eventually land safely, is to not fuck with it.


To be honest the most damage done by Humans to Planets was by ignorance. But now a days most people have a lot of access to lot of Information about all the damages and consequences of the damages to the environment that is the main reason we are discussing about this stuff in this forum.

Your comparison is not fully wrong or fully correct. The ultimate necessity of maintaining the Bio-Diversity is that we need to learn about it fully. So we can't afford to damage the environment fully.

[MarxSchmarx]

To be honest the most damage done by Humans to Planets was by ignorance. But now a days most people have a lot of access to lot of Information about all the damages and consequences of the damages to the environment that is the main reason we are discussing about this stuff in this forum.

Ignorance is still a problem. For example, we still can't really predict when some invasive species would spread, much less out-compete native species or spread diseases or something. And numerous environmental impact statements and population viability analyses have been proven quite wrong over the years. Moreover, even if we conduct small-scale experiments like removing lions to see what happens to a local savanna, we have little sense of how these processes translate to larger spatial scales.

And finally, as decent as our computer modeling in this field is, we still have a long, long way to go before we can predict what the impact of removing the yellow-bellied gnat catcher on the local species will be.

[kelly-087]

Just one question do you believe its possible to prevent to 6th mass extinction which is currently underway?

[Genosse Kotze]

Originally posted by [email protected] 04, 2007 06:30 am
Here's how I like to think about the importance of biodiversity to the biosphere. Imagine a jumbo jet and assume a gremlin started tinkering with the thing. Now the gremlin doesn't wasn't the plane to crash, but derives enormous pleasure out of doing what it does.

So it can unscrew a few bolts here and there, probably rip out some electrical wires, and the plane will probably continue to fly fine.

The problem is this. The gremlin knows it can't unscrew all bolts and the plane continue to fly. But the gremlin has at best only a vague sense of what instruments are more important than others, and it doesn't know exactly when it will be that the bolt that we remove will cause the plane to disintegrate. The most prudent thing for the Gremlin to do, if it wants the plane to eventually land safely, is to not fuck with it
I see you're a Twilight Zone lover too! That was the one with William Shattner, right?

[Janus]

Should we make efforts to maintain biodiversity on Planet Earth?
Of course, not only do we depend on other organisms for our needs but the success of an environment is also fundamentally measured by its biodiversity.

[Tower of Bebel]

Originally posted by kelly-[email protected] 06, 2007 12:43 am
Just one question do you believe its possible to prevent to 6th mass extinction which is currently underway?
I believe we can not. First there is still capitalism, killing thousands of animals and plants. Second, if we reach the stage of socialism, it will take years to tranform society in an environment-friendly society.