The Ego

[Lardlad95]

I find that teh US's moral behavior (what little it has) is based solely upon it's own ego.

to make it's self look like it wants the best for other countries when in reality it cares about Syria as much as it cares whether or not I eat a sandwhich for lunch.

And I'm wondering if that is true for humans also

I mean I try and do what is morally right in my opinion but in the end i always question whether or not I'm doing it to appease my own ego.

Has anyone else found this to be true for themselves

not saying that you only do it for your ego but you question your subconcious or interiror motives

[Conghaileach]

Imperialists always hide behind a facade of altruism.


As for everybody, well the idea of the ego came from Freud. He said that personality was made up of three components - the id, ego and supergo.

The id is our selfishness. "I want that."
The ego is bascially "I know how to get it." (Hence why people called egotistic are those who think they can get whatever they want.)
The superego is the conscience "Should I take it?"

I think most of us do what our conscience will allow us to.

[Lardlad95]

Well what I really mean is do we do things to stroke our own ego? in the guise of selflesness?

THe point is whether or not we are really helping out people because it eases our minds...

I mean think no one thinks about oters 100% of the time

if we did we wouldn't be subject to pain......

Our own needs and emotions will find their way to the surface no matter how much we repress them

and a big part of our own feelings are perception, especially how we are percieved

and no matter how much anyone denies it everyone at some point or another dwellson what other's say about them

[Panamarisen]

Lardlard, remember our ego is not for fun, neither for free... I mean, it´s NECESSARY! Not only under biological reasons, but existencialist ones.

Not Christian in itself, but Catholic and Judeo-Christian philosophy have taught us to believe that ego and the such are "bad" for us (!!!).

Ego is imperative! Ego is necessary! Why? -you may ask. Well, because IF YOU DON´T CARE ABOUT YOURSELF, YOU WON´T BE ABLE TO CARE ABOUT OF ANYBODY ELSE! We don´t have -and we must not- bury underground who we are and what we want/expect from life and ourselves. If we do so, we are all fucking zombies...


¡HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Panamarisen on 10:19 pm on Jan. 17, 2003
Lardlard, remember our ego is not for fun, neither for free... I mean, it´s NECESSARY! Not only under biological reasons, but existencialist ones.

Not Christian in itself, but Catholic and Judeo-Christian philosophy have taught us to believe that ego and the such are "bad" for us (!!!).

Ego is imperative! Ego is necessary! Why? -you may ask. Well, because IF YOU DON´T CARE ABOUT YOURSELF, YOU WON´T BE ABLE TO CARE ABOUT OF ANYBODY ELSE! We don´t have -and we must not- bury underground who we are and what we want/expect from life and ourselves. If we do so, we are all fucking zombies...


¡HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!

so denying moral reasons and doing things simply for one's own image is a good thing?

[Panamarisen]

Sorry, Lardlard, but I´m not saying anything like that!

What I´m trying to say is that if you care about yourself, THEN you´ll be able to care about the other one... THEN you´ll be able to understand the other one, not BEFORE you do it. I mean, care for YOURSELF AS you would do for the other one. You are not less -nor more- important than the other one, and that´s the reason why.

Don´t know how to express myself better, Lardlard, sorry!


¡HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Panamarisen on 11:38 pm on Jan. 17, 2003
Sorry, Lardlard, but I´m not saying anything like that!

What I´m trying to say is that if you care about yourself, THEN you´ll be able to care about the other one... THEN you´ll be able to understand the other one, not BEFORE you do it. I mean, care for YOURSELF AS you would do for the other one. You are not less -nor more- important than the other one, and that´s the reason why.

Don´t know how to express myself better, Lardlard, sorry!


¡HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!


but I'm talking about when that caring about one;s self goes to far

[Panamarisen]

Well, there we are to avoid anybody to go further..., I mean, each one of us! And I understand it´s not THAT easy to do.


¡HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!

[MJM]

Doing things for the one instead of the many is the failure or problem with the ego. Self preservation is good, but giving yourself for the good of all is better. Not to dismiss the individual because even the martyr is an individual, it could even be the greatest act of individualism of all.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from MJM on 3:08 am on Jan. 18, 2003
Doing things for the one instead of the many is the failure or problem with the ego. Self preservation is good, but giving yourself for the good of all is better. Not to dismiss the individual because even the martyr is an individual, it could even be the greatest act of individualism of all.

But does teh martyr die to make himself a martyr or because he does it truly for the cause?

[Conghaileach]

I'd say that someone doing it just for the image would never martyr himself. He wouldn't live to hear people sing his praises afterall, which is what it's usually all about.

I believe that you'd have to be dedicated to a cause in order to be willing to die for it.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from CiaranB on 10:55 am on Jan. 19, 2003
I'd say that someone doing it just for the image would never martyr himself. He wouldn't live to hear people sing his praises afterall, which is what it's usually all about.

I believe that you'd have to be dedicated to a cause in order to be willing to die for it.

but do martyrs ever consider that they will recieve praise after they are dead?

[Weatherman]

I believe that people's ego, or how greedy they are is not static. That is to say, I was more greedy 5 years ago than I am now. This is a good thing. To be selfless is to show others how much you care about them, which in turn makes them less greedy. If everyone was selfless we would all be equal, there would be no need to die for the other person. Like money, greed is unevenly distributed. The leaders in some of the most powerful nations are also the most greedy, they also are very rich.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Weatherman on 9:07 am on Jan. 21, 2003
I believe that people's ego, or how greedy they are is not static. That is to say, I was more greedy 5 years ago than I am now. This is a good thing. To be selfless is to show others how much you care about them, which in turn makes them less greedy. If everyone was selfless we would all be equal, there would be no need to die for the other person. Like money, greed is unevenly distributed. The leaders in some of the most powerful nations are also the most greedy, they also are very rich.

but the ego and greed don't necasarrily fall hand in hand

I can be egotistical without being greedy

most people who are egotistical are greedy but that doesn't have to be true

[TheFriendlyBolshevik]

ahh the pleasure principle. would it help you guys to know that freud failed to scientifically prove teh existence of the id,ego and superego? no?

well then. I'd have to say from what i've seen of bush's plans for iraq i'd have to say he's kicking up this fuss to appease himself. At least clinton had monica to do that for him. hmmm. i urne for the old days.

ahh...i forgot what i was ranting about... oh well...

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from TheFriendlyBolshevik on 1:13 am on Jan. 22, 2003
ahh the pleasure principle. would it help you guys to know that freud failed to scientifically prove teh existence of the id,ego and superego? no?

well then. I'd have to say from what i've seen of bush's plans for iraq i'd have to say he's kicking up this fuss to appease himself. At least clinton had monica to do that for him. hmmm. i urne for the old days.

ahh...i forgot what i was ranting about... oh well...

Marx also failed to prove that calss struggles will eventually result ina proletarian revolution on a massive scale

yet I see you are steady being a communist

In this disscussion we are assuming that Frued was right

[TheFriendlyBolshevik]

actualey i live by the scientific method.

i don't see why someone can't be a communist without being a marxist. yah Karl Marx didn't prove that we will definitly become a communist society, but it's a goal i shoot for. that's what makes me a communist.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from TheFriendlyBolshevik on 7:46 pm on Jan. 23, 2003
actualey i live by the scientific method.

i don't see why someone can't be a communist without being a marxist. yah Karl Marx didn't prove that we will definitly become a communist society, but it's a goal i shoot for. that's what makes me a communist.

oK i see your point but can we stay on topic?

[KickMcCann]

Quote: from TheFriendlyBolshevik on 7:46 pm on Jan. 23, 2003
i don't see why someone can't be a communist without being a marxist.

Actually, the idea and practice of communal living, along with socialism existed long before Marx did. He just gave it his own personal touch, creating Marxism. Marxism is now seen as the beginning of socialism/communism because his ideas overshadowed those before him.

[firstpunklasthippie]

This is interesting, Ill give it some thougt & Ill get bacl to you.
I know the U$ doesnt care bout the countries they "help" but thats the idea get more allys, become more powerful.
As for us well Im not sure, I know I feel better when I help others but I dont help others to make myself feel better.
For example: I see a busker, I dont give them money cause Ill feel good & if you like, the universe will be kind to me. Id give the money cause they are good. So with that in mind a hardly give buskers money (gawd im funny & very sarcastic)