Introduction

[dez]

My name is Hugo, and i'm 17 years old.

Leftist ideas are widely 'spread' on brazilian society, as in it is subintended for being righteous, but in fact only few people actually read anything at all and fewer get past the personal opinion sphere. I myself read less than i should.
I don't really like to hold on to ideals, i think it can also be 'opiate'. But i'm a staunch anti fascist.

A friend forwarded me this forum, and i have good expectatives on it.
I hope to find interesting perspectives here.

[The Grey Blur]

Hey, welcome.

[Whitten]

I don't really like to hold on to ideals, i think it can also be 'opiate'.

That's a good attitude, and an example which some people here could stand to learn from.

[apathy maybe]

Indeed. It is good to keep an open mind on all matters. You will find any number of interesting perspectives around here. We have anarchists (like myself), all sorts of Marxists ('true', Leninists, Maoists etc.) and others. Head to learning to get a basic overview, or theory for more indepth discussion.

We have an Anti-Fascism forum down near practice, hope you get something out of that too.

Any questions are welcome.

Oh, and anarchists have more fun :AO:.

[dez]

more fun?

[apathy maybe]

Whoops.

Yes. More fun.

I say that because I am an anarchist, and I have found that at protests and similar, the anarchists seem to have more fun. Also, of the people I meet in real life, the anarchists (or anarchistic) ones tend to be less moralistic and more open to people doing what they want (so long as it doesn't interfere with others). So, it is partly a statement of my personal experience.

And partly simply me mucking around. You see, while not really sectarian, I like taking jabs at the authoritarians. It is meant in good fun.

[The Grey Blur]

I say that because I am an anarchist, and I have found that at protests and similar, the anarchists seem to have more fun.
Here's my own experience:

Anarchist: "Remember Kronstadt!"
Leninist: "Yes, remember Kronstadt - we shot you like fish in a barrel!!!"

:D


I like taking jabs at the authoritarians

...


Originally posted by friendsofdurruti
We would assert that revolutions are totalitarian, no matter who says otherwise

[Led Zeppelin]

The only reason he has more fun is because he's delusional.

And welcome to the forum.

[dez]

"I have found that at protests and similar, the anarchists seem to have more fun. "


People go to protests to make a point, to cause impact, perhaps even to take down a regime. That may imply self defense of that same regime.
Winston churchill himself said that protesters should be machine gunned.
It's not leisure time.
It might be a matter of life and death. And neglecting that is not wise.



"Also, of the people I meet in real life, the anarchists (or anarchistic) ones tend to be less moralistic and more open to people doing what they want (so long as it doesn't interfere with others). So, it is partly a statement of my personal experience."

I know a lot of people like that... Not just anarchists.
But they are stronger on that part, and in that i think they are nice
=D

[apathy maybe]

Personally, I go to protests to have fun. I didn't used to. I used to think that I could change something by going to a protest. But after some of the biggest protests in Australian history, they government still went to war in Iraq. Then other protests similarly didn't do squat.

So now I goto protests to have fun, meet and catch up with people and so on.


Permanent Revolution: The term "Authoritarians" is generally accepted to mean those people who would assert minority control (in the name of the working class sure), such as Leninists. Revolutions are the majority taking power. See the difference? (And even if you don't like my definitions, those are the ones that I use.)

[The Grey Blur]

Sigh.

You don't even know who the friends of Durrutti are, do you?

[Fawkes]

Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 17, 2007 01:40 pm

I say that because I am an anarchist, and I have found that at protests and similar, the anarchists seem to have more fun.
Here's my own experience:

Anarchist: "Remember Kronstadt!"
Leninist: "Yes, remember Kronstadt - we shot you like fish in a barrel!!!"

:D


What was the point in saying that?

Anyway, welcome to the forums.

Also, I thought that that quote was "authoritarian", not "totalitarian". Though, I could be wrong.

[apathy maybe]

Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 18, 2007 12:03 am
Sigh.

You don't even know who the friends of Durrutti are, do you?
Sigh. Yes I do. :rolleyes:

My point is that I was using a different definition. Yes, the revolution will be "authoritarian" in the sense that we will force the people in power to give that power up.

However, anarchists are not supportive of the revolution being "authoritarian" in the sense of a minority taking power and asserting their authority over the majority (à la Leninists).

Can you please grasp the difference?

[The Grey Blur]

Sigh. Yes I do. :rolleyes:
After hastily googling them...


My point is that I was using a different definition...Can you please grasp the difference?
Unfortunately we can't just invent our own personal definitions for words, especially in an argument. We have to go by the broad definition that most would generally attribute to the word. Maybe once your definition makes it into the dictionary this argument will work.


However, anarchists are not supportive of the revolution being "authoritarian" in the sense of a minority taking power and asserting their authority over the majority (à la Leninists).
No, "Leninists" (ie Marxists) support the emancipation of the working-class. As do Anarchists. The best of both sides recognise that this emancipation will be authoritarian in character:


Originally posted by engels+--> (engels)Revolution is the most authoritarian thing there is[/b]


friendsofdurrutti
We would assert that revolutions are totalitarian, no matter who says otherwise

The difference between Anarchists and Marxists is the belief in the need for a state in an immediate post-revolution society. The difference between "Leninism" and orthodox Marxism are the concepts of the vanguard party, democratic centralism and the theory of imperialism. None of which involve "a minority taking power and asserting their authority over the majority".

[dannthraxxx]

welcome to the community...as you can tell from the above posts, revolution has a long way to go.