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joser03
7th April 2007, 09:24
Para mis hermanos y hermanas. Hasta La Victoria Siempre.

I was hoping I could post the video here, but I can't. The video is good. The lyrics... better.

Poverty of the Philosophy Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7Vl0peys90)

Immortal Technique - The Poverty of Philosophy

Most of my Latino and black people who are struggling to get food, clothes and shelter in the hood are so concerned with that, that philosophising about freedom and socialist democracy is usually unfortunately beyond their rationale. They don't realize that America can't exist without separating them from their identity, because if we had some sense of who we really are, there's no way in hell we'd allow this country to push it's genocidal consensus on our homelands. This ignorance exists, but it can be destroyed.

Nigga talk about change and working within the system to achieve that. The problem with always being a conformist is that when you try to change the system from within, it's not you who changes the system; it's the system that will eventually change you. There is usually nothing wrong with compromise in a situation, but compromising yourself in a situation is another story completely, and I have seen this happen long enough in the few years that I've been alive to know that it's a serious problem. Latino America is a huge colony of countries whose presidents are cowards in the face of economic imperialism. You see, third world countries are rich places, abundant in resources, and many of these countries have the capacity to feed their starving people and the children we always see digging for food in trash on commercials. But plutocracies, in other words a government run by the rich such as this one and traditionally oppressive European states, force the third world into buying overpriced, unnecessary goods while exporting huge portions of their natural resources.

I'm quite sure that people will look upon my attitude and sentiments and look for hypocrisy and hatred in my words. My revolution is born out of love for my people, not hatred for others.

You see, most of Latinos are here because of the great inflation that was caused by American companies in Latin America. Aside from that, many are seeking a life away from the puppet democracies that were funded by the United States; places like El Salvador, Guatemala, Peru, Columbia, Nicaragua, Ecuador and Republica Dominicana, and not just Spanish-speaking countries either, but Haiti and Jamaica as well.

As different as we have been taught to look at each other by colonial society, we are in the same struggle and until we realize that, we'll be fighting for scraps from the table of a system that has kept us subservient instead of being self-determined. And that's why we have no control over when the embargo will stop in Cuba, or when the bombs will stop dropping in Vieques.

But you see, here in America the attitude that is fed to us is that outside of America there live lesser people. "Fuck them, let them fend for themselves." No, Fuck you, they are you. No matter how much you want to dye your hair blonde and put fake eyes in, or follow an anorexic standard of beauty, or no matter how many diamonds you buy from people who exploit your own brutally to get them, no matter what kind of car you drive or what kind of fancy clothes you put on, you will never be them. They're always gonna look at you as nothing but a little monkey. I'd rather be proud of what I am, rather than desperately trying to be something I'm really not, just to fit in. And whether we want to accept it or not, that's what this culture or lack of culture is feeding us.

I want a better life for my family and for my children, but it doesn't have to be at the expense of millions of lives in my homeland. We're given the idea that if we didn't have these people to exploit then America wouldn't be rich enough to let us have these little petty material things in our lives and basic standards of living. No, that's wrong. It's the business giants and the government officials who make all the real money. We have whatever they kick down to us. My enemy is not the average white man, it's not the kid down the block or the kids I see on the street; my enemy is the white man I don't see: the people in the white house, the corporate monopoly owners, fake liberal politicians those are my enemies. The generals of the armies that are mostly conservatives those are the real Mother-Fuckers that I need to bring it to, not the poor, broke country-ass soldier that's too stupid to know shit about the way things are set up.

In fact, I have more in common with most working and middle-class white people than I do with most rich black and Latino people. As much as racism bleeds America, we need to understand that classism is the real issue. Many of us are in the same boat and it's sinking, while these bougie Mother-Fuckers ride on a luxury liner, and as long as we keep fighting over kicking people out of the little boat we're all in, we're gonna miss an opportunity to gain a better standard of living as a whole.

In other words, I don't want to escape the plantation I want to come back, free all my people, hang the Mother-Fucker that kept me there and burn the house to the god damn ground. I want to take over the encomienda and give it back to the people who work the land.

You cannot change the past but you can make the future, and anyone who tells you different is a Fucking lethargic devil. I don't look at a few token Latinos and black people in the public eye as some type of achievement for my people as a whole. Most of those successful individuals are sell-outs and house Negros.

But, I don't consider brothers a sell-out if they move out of the ghetto. Poverty has nothing to do with our people. It's not in our culture to be poor. That's only been the last 500 years of our history; look at the last 2000 years of our existence and what we brought to the world in terms of science, mathematics, agriculture and forms of government. You know the idea of a confederation of provinces where one federal government controls the states? The Europeans who came to this country stole that idea from the Iroquois lead. The idea of impeaching a ruler comes from an Aztec tradition. That's why Montezuma was stoned to death by his own people 'cause he represented the agenda of white Spaniards once he was captured, not the Aztec people who would become Mexicans.

So in conclusion, I'm not gonna vote for anybody just 'cause they black or Latino they have to truly represent the community and represent what's good for all of us proletariat.

Viva la revolution!

Pirate Utopian
7th April 2007, 15:03
*waits for the anti-IT team to jump in on this*
i'll start.... IT is a homophobe!

Red October
7th April 2007, 16:46
in about an hour this is going to turn into a big fucking debate over whether IT is a homophobic mysogynist baby eater.

SanPatricio'sSoul
7th April 2007, 19:04
CHE GUEVARA T SHIRTS $8.99 HOORAYY SWEATSHOP LABOR

I basically have given up hope of hearing this dude on a new album anytime in my teen years

abrupt
7th April 2007, 19:09
Originally posted by Red [email protected] 07, 2007 03:46 pm
in about an hour this is going to turn into a big fucking debate over whether IT is a homophobic mysogynist baby eater.
ill give it 2 days to be ful blown. it seems slow latley.

ill end it with, he needs to change the way he writes some of his lyrics. i am a fan, i understand where he is coming from but i dont agree with the homophibia in a few lines.

but if you look at it like this, he is someone that is puttin kids on to the left. then they learn some of his lyrics are homophobic, and they have (because of him) become socialists/communists/anarchists what have you.

he is a gateway for a lot of the new left. he points out with detail of government corruption, and leaves them with the left wing for answers.



Shortened (as ive said many times):

he is a great artist, he is a gateway to new thinking, refreshment to current hip hop, he puts people on to the left (or wanting answers to the questions he asks).

but he needs to stop the homophobic comments.




now its been said leave it alone

Suburban_Guerrilla
7th April 2007, 19:09
IT is awesome (I happen to be listening to him at the moment). :D

I can't imagine anyone disliking his ideas, or frankly, his music.

Sentinel
7th April 2007, 20:43
Originally posted by [email protected] 07, 2007 07:09 pm
IT is awesome (I happen to be listening to him at the moment). :D

I can't imagine anyone disliking his ideas, or frankly, his music.
Is that so? I reckon you must have missed the following comments by 'IT' then:


You get no props in hip-hop like feminine men


But half of y'all are faggots tryin to pick up a tranny


So if I catch you bluffing, faggot, you less than nothing


And your crew is full of more faggots than Greek mythology


you coffee shop revolutionary son of a *****
but you know what the fuck I think is just pathetic and gay
when niggaz speculate what the fuck 'Pac would say



why you trying to be hardcore, you fucking homo-thug
and don't be sensitive and angry at the shit that I wrote
cuz if you can take a fucking dick, you can take a joke


cuz you got jealousy in ya voice like star scream
and that's the primary reason that I hate ya faggots


Immortal Technique: insinuate degenerate fags

Either that, or maybe you don't know what the fuck homophobia means? Because if you don't consider those quotes homophobic, if you find them acceptable or even 'awesome', please stop posting here.

I agree fully with what our Discrimination mod black rose posted in another thread (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=63483&hl=immortal%20technique&st=0) about this fucking bigot:


It's amazing how much homophobia and sexism revolutionaries are willing to ignore as long as there's a good beat and flow to bop along to.

This shit is a joke, and every motherfucker who comes in here and plays down IT's homophobia and sexism, every single one of you is nothing but a fake.

If you really cared, if you really cared about fighting prejudice in all forms, homophobia, sexism, racism - whatever form; you'd think a little more critically about Immortal Technique and his lyrics - it doesnt take an in-depth analysis, you just have to stop running from the facts and ditch this apologist shit, its' hypocritical.

For supposed revolutionaries to talk up someone who alienates your comrades with thoughtless shit like, ''But half of y'all are faggots tryin to pick up a tranny' is absurd.

What a fucking revolutionary, and people who defend that shit are no better; you're not comrades of mine, fuck you!

The Grey Blur
7th April 2007, 22:54
Where in this song does he use homophobic language you stupid stupid petty minded internet warriot twat.

Sentinel
8th April 2007, 01:24
Where in this song does he use homophobic language you stupid stupid petty minded internet warriot twat.

I don't recall saying he did. What I did was to reply into this post:


IT is awesome (I happen to be listening to him at the moment).

I can't imagine anyone disliking his ideas, or frankly, his music.

I am a queer man and take offense from raging homophobia like that of 'Immortal Technique', as well as 'communists' apologising for it, because that shit undermines my position in society. Is that so hard to understand?

I guess it really is, because there is a problem we have had on this board as long as I've been a member: the belittling and ignorance of homophobia, a total unability of recognising the nature of homophobia in society and a total lack of solidarity and empathy towards it's victims by some members, and in turn the acceptance of that by too many others.

If, say, a white artist was making songs and comments as racist against blacks or jewish people as Immortal technique's are contemptful against homosexuals, but then an occasional 'good' or progressive song, would you rush into his defense like this? No, because the existence of racism you seem to be capable of comprehending.

Good, but now answer this question:

Why is homophobia not 'as bad' as racism? Why can someone who is a raging homophobe still be a 'good guy'? Why are you not willing to support the same zero tolerance for expressed contempt (and in 'Immortal techniques' case, outright hatred) towards homosexuals as we all do in the case of racist hate speech?

No matter how much I contemplate it I can't see any other possible reason than lacking social consciousness at best, but most likely your own closet homophobia. I sometimes wonder if I'd be like you guys was I straight.. I hope to the non existant God I wouldn't.

I pity you.

Hate has a tendency to accelerate if unhindered in a society, and hate speech if accepted is station one on the train to violence towards and killing of members of the minority it's directed against.

That's why I do anything in my power to stop that kind of talk and behavior on my workplace, in my freetime, and even on the fucking internet. But, thankfully, I have never had to do it among comrades in real life (yeah I noticed your ad hominem flame, which was utterly ridiculous considering that you know absolutely zip about my life outside this forum).

And that gives me a little hope at least.

Btw, I just realised it's saturday night. So if that was drunken posting from your part I'm ready to forgive it, but only if you were too drunk to remember writing it at all when you wake up tomorrow and apologise humbly. :)

metalero
8th April 2007, 03:53
If IT uses those homophobic lines Sentinel pointed out he's contradicting himself. Anyway the guy doesn't seem the kind of one who wouldn't understand the problem with homophobia and revolutionary politics if explained.

joser03
8th April 2007, 06:34
I didn't realize IT was a homophobe. The only songs I've heard of his were all anti-government and all. I still really enjoyed the song and the messages in it. And he has a few really good songs. But if he's an asshole like that, I can't and won't support him. I'll just steal his songs from online. For me, being a revolutionary means bringing equality to all people, regardless of ethnicity, skin color, sexual orientation, age, sex, and I guess... even religion.

Pirate Utopian
8th April 2007, 13:27
Also his politics are mostly paranoid conspiracy bullshit

Jazzratt
8th April 2007, 13:36
Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 07, 2007 09:54 pm
Where in this song does he use homophobic language you stupid stupid petty minded internet warriot twat.
Why does it matter whether or not he says anything homophobic in this particular song? Does he suddenly cease being homophobic for the song's duration just because he's managed to go however many lines without calling someone a fag? I thought you were somewhat smarter than this but it turns out you're just a brain-dead ****, either that or, as sentinel said, blind drunk - given your misspelling of "warrior" this is more likely. The question you posed, however, shows you're really quite ignorant - if Fred Phelps made a sermon in which he refrained from mentioning Sodom or Gomorrah and managed not to say "God Hates Fags" would you be defending him by saying "Where in this sermon does he use homophobic language". IT is a ****, he's homophobic and can fuck off.

Black Dagger
8th April 2007, 14:23
Originally posted by jazzrat
either that or, as sentinel said, blind drunk - given your misspelling of "warrior" this is more likely.

Well to be fair he typed &#39;warriot&#39;, and &#39;t&#39; is only one key to the right of &#39;r&#39; <_<

Red October
8th April 2007, 15:42
i used to really like IT, but he gets really old after a while. he seemed really cool for a little bit, but then all his macho conspiracy theory bullshit turned me off of him.

Xilo
16th April 2007, 08:02
Its his ideas and his words... stop thinking that posting opinions here that IT would read it.

Chicano Shamrock
16th April 2007, 09:30
Let&#39;s not get into this again. It is a good speech that has probably moved some people into thinking like a leftist. It is sad that he ruins his revolutionary image by being sexist. He talks shit about the white man but doesn&#39;t realize that participating in sexism is participating in the white man&#39;s system.

Black Dagger
16th April 2007, 09:49
Originally posted by [email protected] 16, 2007 05:02 pm
Its his ideas and his words... stop thinking that posting opinions here that IT would read it.
I doubt that ANYONE who posted in this thread thinks that IT is going to read what they have to say, so what point are you trying to make?

Yes these are &#39;his ideas and his words&#39; - and this thread is a platform for ours... and i&#39;ll be fucked if im gonna give this bigoted fool a free pass on sexism and homophobia - he like EVERYONE is accountable for his ideas and words.

R_P_A_S
16th April 2007, 10:11
i remember when i first head that... tech is what got me to read. cus I was like .. what the fuck is this guy talking about?

Tekun
16th April 2007, 11:36
There should be an IT sticky in the music subforum relating to the majority&#39;s distaste for him, that way we don&#39;t get the same old repetive arguments in favor or against him in every new thread that pops up
It would also prevent ppl from starting new threads on the guy, after all therez about 15 or so threads on this character