Youthhouse in Copehagen taken over by cops

[Louis Pio]

As people might remember we had a discussion a few months ago about the youthhouse "Ungdomshuset" in Copenhagen, it has now been taken by the cops.

From Indy media denmark (http://indymedia.dk/newswire) : The eviction of Ungdomshuset has begun. The Police has landed on the roof of the house and also entered it from the side by a container. Activists are gathering in the area.



10.38
15 activists have been arrested in Folkets Park on Nørrebro.

10.20
There are burning containers blocking Torvegade at Christiania

10.16
Police is getting ready to clear barricades on Nørrebrogade

10.05
There are events/happenings different places. Activists have spread out. Before the eviction it was said that there would be events everywhere. Among others "Feminists for more "fristeder"" have made blockades 12 different places in town

9.49 Around 100 to 150 activists are trying to build barricades across Nørrebrogade. The Police is removing the barricades by driving into them with their cars. The activists there are angry and frustrated

9.33
Nørrebros Runddel has been cleared for activists. There is reasonable peaceful but there are a lot of activists in the neighbourhood. The athmosphere is tense. So far there has been made around 20 arrests according to Modkrafts reporters

8.41
The police is arresting persons on Runddelen. Activists and the police are pushing against each other

8.34
The Police is clearing Nørrebros Runddel (a few meters from Ungdomshuset) and is starting to arrest people who refuse to move.

8.31
Spokespersons for Ungdomshusets maintain, that the plan when evicted is that the supporters of the house are going to show up in the local areas. Tomorrow there is a protest demonstration at 17.00 from Blågårds Plads and the day after there is a day of different happenings

8.19
Around 100 of Ungdomshusets supporters are trying to break through the barricades the police have made on Jagtvej by Runddelen
There are around 25 of different kind of bigger police vans. And the gathering of people has now officially been asked to leave.

8.15
Assistens Kirkegården (the graveyard/park across from Ungdomshuset) is cleared by the police

8.10
According to sources from Ungdomshusets the police has entered the house around 7.00
It has happened very quickly. It's guessed that it has taken the police around 5 minutes to enter the house through a container on the side of the house from where they have entered through a vindow or the wall and also by deploying cops on the roof.
From Ungdomshuset it is said that: "As long as there isn't a Ungdomshus, there is a fight for a Ungdomshus"
Two ambulances have left Ungdomshuset.
(New information: From Ungdomshuset it is said that the police wasn't that fast this morning as it has earlier been explained to the media. According to sources, that were by the house this morning, it took several attempts before the police succeeded in entering the building. A crane had to lift a container up to the house several times before the police could enter the house. It started a 7.00 this morning but at 8.00 there was still coming loud sounds out from the house which can mean that the police didn't have full controle over the building yet.)



Check that site for updates

You can find pictures here:
pics (http://www.modkraft.dk/hist/hist_06.html)
pics (http://www.modkraft.dk/hist/hist_07.html)
pics (http://www.modkraft.dk/hist/hist_04.html)
pics (http://www.modkraft.dk/hist/hist_08.html)

[Louis Pio]

More pics
pics and sound (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article254678.ece?service=gallery)
pics (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article254394.ece?service=gallery)
pics (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article254429.ece)

Was trying to find videos but the servers overloaded.
Btw it seems the activists tactic have failed, they said trafic and so on would be stopped, the house held for long etc. But there have only been minor incidents. There's a demonstration now at 17.00, gonna go and see how it goes.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 01, 2007 09:16 am
Btw it seems the activists tactic have failed, they said trafic and so on would be stopped, the house held for long etc. But there have only been minor incidents. There's a demonstration now at 17.00, gonna go and see how it goes.
Damn, this is sad news. If I didn't have work today, I'd definitely try to hit the Danish consulate with some folks. Maybe tomorrow.. until then, you've got all my best. Give those bastards hell!!

[Louis Pio]

Ok things have heated up by now. In the Nørrebro area of Copenhagen were the house is situated there have been clashes with cops, brickthrowing, fires and so on. However it seems the cops have been prettey well prepared which they didn't use to be earlier, they quickly cut one of the demonstrations in half cutting of the front and arrest the people throwing bricks while leaving the more peacefull protesters alone, after that it came to more streetfights and I think the only one left are the people who really wan't to fight the cops. The cops are shooting mazegranades all around the neighborhood to disperse crowds, and keep in mind their is only 2 countries using the strongest form of maze= Denmark and Isreal. It's pretty had stuff, tried it myself when younger, it fucks you up.
Seems the organised resistence have been organised pretty badly.
Anyway from my point of view the people organising this whole youthhouse thing has done it the wrong way, still went to support the struggle of course. But left when fighting begun, at this point the fighting is only alienating the mass of people formerly sympathetic to the youthhouse and the struggle can only be won with mass support in my oppinion. The police can now arrest people just if they are close to areas of fighting so on top of the 200-500 arrested untill now we will probably see more, alot of those maybe just passersby.
More pics for y'all pics (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/article255008.ece)
pics (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article254429.ece)
Videos from earlier:
video (http://politiken.dk/poltv/?ExtID=1350)
video of protester getting hit by copcar (http://politiken.dk/poltv/?ExtID=1349)
here you can find to more videos (http://www.ekstrabladet.dk/)

It seems alot of the fighting have moved to Christiania, also young children of imigrants are joining in, not because of love for the youthhouse but because they hate cops.
Things might escalate further, will try to keep you posted

[Louis Pio]

People should look for updates and more pics here, it's in danish but under comments there are many people translating it. Just remember Ungdomshus = youthhouse, that should make it easy for you to browse the site. Indy media Denmark (http://www.indymedia.dk/)

[Djehuti]

100 activists have seized another building, an old school. Violent clashes all over Copenhagen. Quite large local support.

[Louis Pio]

Well there have been local support, however some was lost when protesters made big fires that could have gone seriously wrong in the narrow streets.

It seems around 100 people occupied a new house but police are sure to kick them out soon, danish article and 2 pics (http://politiken.dk/indland/article255090.ece)
Btw what seems to be happening now is that not all rioters are supporters, alot of other people come in cause of their personal agendas, mostly minor criminals. Not saying this to belittle the fight, justs that I know the people who are starting more fights now. Don't really think it's gonna be a plus.

If you want to see how Undomshuset looks like got to this adress and click on "FOTO: Kig ind i Ungdomshuset " scroll a bit down probably (http://www.politiken.dk/)

[Louis Pio]

Ok there's still more fighting, I guess I'll give you an update mañana. Anywyay heres 4 pics of the cops in the house pics (http://ekstrabladet.dk/gallerier/article276380.ece)

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

If they were serious about this shit, everyone should have been confronting the police. Not just some. That's why it failed.

[Louis Pio]

You have a point, however nothing would have been archieved by that. Problem is you have alot of wannabe anarchists who wanna "make there bones" by fighting cops. And they are not very good at it...
If contact had had been established between the workers movment organisation for housing they would have been stronger

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 01, 2007 02:40 pm
young children of imigrants are joining in, not because of love for the youthhouse but because they hate cops.
That's as good a reason as any. Thanks for the updates!

[Enragé]

alot of other people come in cause of their personal agendas, mostly minor criminals. Not saying this to belittle the fight, justs that I know the people who are starting more fights now. Don't really think it's gonna be a plus.


Dont they always say that when shit like this happens?

How on earth do criminals profit in any way by throwing rocks?!


In any case, im not an expert on the situation, but rioting in itself doesnt get us anywhere. Building a (workers') movement to put an end to this system does.

[Keyser]

I have seen that there have been demonstrations and other actions of solidarity for the squatters in Denmark, in other countries such as Germany, Sweden and Austria.

Have there been, or will there be such actions taking place in Britain?

If not, I would urge as many as possible on RevLeft who are in Britain to do just that.

I am looking up for such possibilities at the moment and I will hopefully try and get in touch with people who would be up for that.

[The Grey Blur]

Dont they always say that when shit like this happens?
Who's "they"? Teis said that and seeing as he is on the ground in Copenhagen I would suppose he knows this himself.


How on earth do criminals profit in any way by throwing rocks?!
They would throw rocks because they hate the cops I suppose.


In any case, im not an expert on the situation, but rioting in itself doesnt get us anywhere. Building a (workers') movement to put an end to this system does.
I agree on the first part. But short-term what is the line being followed by Socialists in Denmark Teis?

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 01:42 pm
In any case, im not an expert on the situation, but rioting in itself doesnt get us anywhere. Building a (workers') movement to put an end to this system does.
Exactly. Which is why if they wanted this to be an organized mass movement of workers, they should have carried this out with more consistency in both goals and tactics. It seems like some folks just wanted to fuck shit up and confront cops for the hell of it. This is not the workers' struggle. But then again, plenty of members on this forum considered revolutionary leftists are just about fucking shit up, so what do I know?

[rouchambeau]

I don't see why people are objecting to "fucking shit up". Action that weakens the state is a good thing regardless of whether or not it is part of a "workers' struggle".

I mean, what if we only participated in "workers' struggles"? That would leave a lot of great causes unsupported.

[Enragé]

They would throw rocks because they hate the cops I suppose.

they have nothing to gain by that.
Most likely it will just fuck up their trade, its hard to deal drugs when the city goes up in flames.

"they" are corporate news networks.
"they" always discredit politically motivated riots by coming up with shit like this

[Enragé]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 08:11 pm
I don't see why people are objecting to "fucking shit up". Action that weakens the state is a good thing regardless of whether or not it is part of a "workers' struggle".

I mean, what if we only participated in "workers' struggles"? That would leave a lot of great causes unsupported.
im not against what they are doing in Denmark, ofcourse not

the point is that if its not rooted in a constructive movement it will amount to exactly.. nothing

this all reminds me of the fucking huge squatters' riots (supported by segments of the rest of the population, just like now in denmark) in the 70's and 80's over here in the Netherlands. They were glorious days but it all amounted to nothing
Lets learn from the past.

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 08:11 pm
I don't see why people are objecting to "fucking shit up". Action that weakens the state is a good thing regardless of whether or not it is part of a "workers' struggle".

I mean, what if we only participated in "workers' struggles"? That would leave a lot of great causes unsupported.
This is incredible. Does anyone remember this thread (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showtopic=62242&st=25) where I was crucified for supposedly stereotyping and (according to this member Rochambeau) attacking a "straw-man" when I critiscised Anarchists who agreed with "fucking shit up" without a clear political basis and aim?

Hypocrites. <_<


they have nothing to gain by that.
Most likely it will just fuck up their trade, its hard to deal drugs when the city goes up in flames.
Minor criminals (hoodlums, petty thiefs, burglars) would attack the cops because they see them as their enemies.


"they" are corporate news networks.
"they" always discredit politically motivated riots by coming up with shit like this
It was Teis who said some elements of criminality had joined the rioters, not some corporate news station.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 05:11 pm
I don&#39;t see why people are objecting to "fucking shit up". Action that weakens the state is a good thing regardless of whether or not it is part of a "workers&#39; struggle".

I mean, what if we only participated in "workers&#39; struggles"? That would leave a lot of great causes unsupported.
By the same logic terrorism is fine. We must confine our political action to organized tactics with clear and consistent goals.

Also, criminals certainly have nothing to gain by rioting. If it&#39;s not their struggle, it&#39;s arbitrary lawlessness on their part, which is counter productive to their interests of not being caught by the filth.

[The Grey Blur]

Also, criminals certainly have nothing to gain by rioting. If it&#39;s not their struggle, it&#39;s arbitrary lawlessness on their part, which is counter productive to their interests of not being caught by the filth.
Yeah but they hate the cops and would see a large riot as an easy way of getting back at the pigs while still having the option of escaping when things start getting iffy.

[bcbm]

Exactly. Which is why if they wanted this to be an organized mass movement of workers, they should have carried this out with more consistency in both goals and tactics. It seems like some folks just wanted to fuck shit up and confront cops for the hell of it.

This was a housing struggle and the participants were squatters and their supporters among the left. They "fucked shit up" in retaliation against the selling of the house and the seizure of it by the pigs. There was a long struggle leading up to this that had fairly large support, as I understand it, but the government closed off all legal avenues to the squatters, making this sort of conflict inevitable.

[The Grey Blur]

Yeah I agree. I actually think a well-planned and organised resistance to the pigs could have beaten them back. If they could have humiliated the state they could have bargained and saved the house. Still, we&#39;ll stick to what Teis is saying and see what heppens.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 02, 2007 07:00 pm
Yeah I agree. I actually think a well-planned and organised resistance to the pigs could have beaten them back. If they could have humiliated the state they could have bargained and saved the house. Still, we&#39;ll stick to what Teis is saying and see what heppens.
Yes, a well planned resistance would&#39;ve been great. However, the nature of the seizure made that almost impossible. The pigs set an initial date, and there were huge demonstrations scheduled, with people coming in from all over. Then the pigs moved the date to "sometime in 2007" and left it at that. The demonstrations went ahead, and then the pigs just waited for the right moment to strike. It is hard to have that many people ready on short notice for several months, unfortunately, and that is exactly what the pigs counted on. I hope in the days or weeks to come the movement can coordinate a little more and try to rectify this situation in some manner, whether by reclaiming Ungdomshuset or fortifying another building.

[Janus]

First Christiana and now this? The Danish government seems to be cracking down harder on "subversive" elements more and more.

[Djehuti]

The police have been beaten on the streets over and over again during the last days. The riots costs them over one million dollars every day.

Now the coppers are booting down doors all across Copenhagen, over 400 arrested so far. But we just keep coming. Still thousands of militans in Copenhagen, reinforcemens from Gothenburg on their way...

The police will deport every foreign activits they get their hands on. The danish police are now out of tear gas, but the swedish police are providing them with more...

[Djehuti]

A bus from Oslo is also on their way. They were stoped and checked in Gothenburg by swedish police, but were ultimatly let pass.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

More people is pointless, unless there is organization. I support their ends, but really question their means. I saw a guy on the news on TV today throw a crate at a vacant burning cop car. This is the kind of rubbish that won&#39;t get us anywhere.

[Enragé]

I saw a guy on the news on TV today throw a crate at a vacant burning cop car. This is the kind of rubbish that won&#39;t get us anywhere.

perhaps not, but there&#39;s not anything wrong with it either.

The riots, the protests, the anger must be transformed into a constructive movement, but that is not to say that the riots, the protests, and the anger are wrong in any way (they are only when they alienate other people, which they might be doing, but i have no way of knowing).


But i dont think bringing in more people from the "outside" is a good idea. If you cannnot get enough people on the streets as it is, well then there&#39;s something fundamentally wrong (lack of popular support).

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

"Fucking shit up" with no consistent leftist agenda is arbitrary vandalism.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by Dr. [email protected] 03, 2007 12:05 pm
"Fucking shit up" with no consistent leftist agenda is arbitrary vandalism.
Their agenda and aims are absolutely clear: "Give back the house or supply another one, or we are going to fuck your shit up and make this entire process as painful as possible for all of you bastards." I see absolutely nothing wrong in their strategy or actions, indeed, it is the only recourse they have left with all legal avenues made impossible by the state.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

http://atvs.vg.no/player/index.php?id=7961

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Any updates?

[yippie666]

so let me get this right....there was a youth house.....where teens? young adults? where living and then the cops told them to get out....but they had no where to go.....so they stayed....now theres full scale riots cuz some teens wouldnt leave???

no way in hell thats all that happened.....

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 03, 2007 05:41 pm
so let me get this right....there was a youth house.....where teens? young adults? where living and then the cops told them to get out....but they had no where to go.....so they stayed....now theres full scale riots cuz some teens wouldnt leave???

no way in hell thats all that happened.....
No.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungdomshuset

[yippie666]

Originally posted by black coffee black metal+March 04, 2007 12:06 am--> (black coffee black metal @ March 04, 2007 12:06 am)
[email protected] 03, 2007 05:41 pm
so let me get this right....there was a youth house.....where teens? young adults? where living and then the cops told them to get out....but they had no where to go.....so they stayed....now theres full scale riots cuz some teens wouldnt leave???

no way in hell thats all that happened.....
No.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungdomshuset [/b]
thank you that cleared up MEANY MEANY questions....

[More Fire for the People]

Originally posted by Dr. [email protected] 03, 2007 12:05 pm
"Fucking shit up" with no consistent leftist agenda is arbitrary vandalism.
It destroys the spectacle of state-power.

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by Hopscotch Anthill+March 04, 2007 12:37 am--> (Hopscotch Anthill @ March 04, 2007 12:37 am)
Dr. [email protected] 03, 2007 12:05 pm
"Fucking shit up" with no consistent leftist agenda is arbitrary vandalism.
It destroys the spectacle of state-power. [/b]
That&#39;s patently ridiculous. Pointless destruction only alienates potential support bases among workers and the local population.

If they can beat the cops back or just keep this fight going until it&#39;s too difficult/expensive for the government the youths may have bargaining power. I take great heart from their struggle but fear it may be fruitless without the support of organised labour of some sort.

[More Fire for the People]

I&#39;m sure Hungary &#39;56, May &#39;68, the Watts riots, the LA riots, etc. alienated workers... oh wait.

[Guerrilla22]

COPENHAGEN, Denmark - Anarchists from across northern Europe flocked to join protesters in the Danish capital on Saturday after two nights of riots sparked by the eviction of squatters from an abandoned building that had been a center for young leftists and punk rockers.


More than 500 people, including scores of foreigners, have been arrested since the riots started Thursday. Authorities said more than 200 were arrested early Saturday following overnight clashes in which demonstrators pelted police with cobblestones and set fire to cars.

A school was also vandalized and several buildings damaged by fire early Saturday. One protester was reportedly wounded in the violence, while 25 were injured the night before in what police have called Denmark&#39;s worst riots in a decade.

More scuffles were reported in various parts of the city Saturday night after a day of relative calm. Dozens of police vans patrolled the streets and broke up gatherings of protesters to prevent larger mobs from forming. Police said several of those arrested were carrying Molotov cocktails or firecrackers, but that no major violence was reported.

Police said activists from Sweden, Norway and Germany had joined hundreds of Danish youth in the protests. Sympathy protests were held in Germany, Norway, Sweden and Finland.

Peter Vesterheden, the head of Copenhagen&#39;s prisons, said 25 foreigners had been arrested.

Critics said the demonstrations were misguided because they target a Scandinavian welfare state that ranks among the world&#39;s most egalitarian countries.

"The spoiled kids in the Youth House woke up to reality in Danish society where you have a job and pay rent," Anders Fredrik Mihle of the governing Liberal Party&#39;s youth wing said, referring to the building where the squatters had been evicted.

Like its neighbors, Denmark has a generous welfare system supported by high taxes. Education is free and health services are heavily subsidized. However, leftists have criticized the center-right government for eroding the system with proposed reforms including raising the retirement age and trimming student grants.

The protesters see their fight to keep the "Youth House," a four-story building used by young squatters since the 1980s, as symbolic of a wider struggle against a capitalist establishment.

"This is a display of anger and rage after more than seven years of struggle to keep what is ours," said Jan, a 22-year-old activist who has been coming to the building for the last 10 years. He declined to give his last name, saying that was the norm among people frequenting the building.

The riots were sparked when an anti-terror squad on Thursday evicted the squatters from the red brick building with graffiti-covered walls. Built in 1897, it was a community theater for the labor movement and a culture and conference center; Vladimir Lenin was among its visitors. In recent years, it has hosted concerts with performers like Australian Nick Cave and Icelandic singer Bjork.

As news of the riots spread, sympathizers around Europe rallied support for the protesters. The Danes warned like-minded foreigners Saturday that the borders were tightening after two nights of clashes had turned the normally quiet streets of Copenhagen into a battle zone.

"Solidarity among people has no borders, just like the Spanish civil war or the youth rebellion in the late 1960s. People recognize themselves in such causes," said Rene Karpantschof, a sociology lecturer at the University of Copenhagen and former squatter.

The eviction had been planned since last year, when courts ordered the squatters to hand the building over to a Christian congregation that bought it six years ago. The squatters said the city had no right to sell the building, and they demanded another building for free as a replacement.

Police spokesman Flemming Steen Munch said officers searched more than 10 homes in Copenhagen in an effort to track down activists. Meanwhile, vandals covered Copenhagen&#39;s famed Little Mermaid statue with pink paint, but Munch could not say whether the vandalism was linked to the riots.

Copenhagen residents had mixed feelings about the demonstrations.

"The idea of an alternative society is good," said Berit Larsen, 57, as she watched a peaceful demonstration against the eviction on Saturday afternoon. "We need to have room for everyone but the violence we have seen is not what I consider an alternative way for society."

___

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Originally posted by Hopscotch Anthill+March 03, 2007 09:37 pm--> (Hopscotch Anthill @ March 03, 2007 09:37 pm)
Dr. [email protected] 03, 2007 12:05 pm
"Fucking shit up" with no consistent leftist agenda is arbitrary vandalism.
It destroys the spectacle of state-power. [/b]
if people need vandalism to see the socio-economic detriments of state power, then I don&#39;t see the conditions for revolution really presenting themselves

[yippie666]

anyone have (or know where i could get) the open letter to "troublemaker&#39;s of the world"????

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 03, 2007 10:42 pm
anyone have (or know where i could get) the open letter to "troublemaker&#39;s of the world"????
"Troublemakers of the world - We bid you welcome
We invite everybody who supports Ungdomshuset to come to Copenhagen in December. From the 13th through the 17th their will be actions, workshops, concerts and at least one demonstration.

For seven years we have struggled for a political solution that could remove the eviction threat against Ungdomshuset. These efforts have been in vain.

We are still trying to find a peacefull way to save the house but their is not much to hope for. Though the politicians has spoken a lot they have not done anything. The right wing christian sect whom the politicians gave our house is refusing to sell. In stead the have asked for permission to tear it down.

From just about everywhere there have been statements of support. From local citizens to revolutionary political groups abroad. Dansish labour unions, artists, mucisians and many more have spoken in our favor. We are very greatfull for this support. But so far it has not had an effect on the leadership of the Church that is cruisading against us. They still push for war.

We are still hoping and working for a political solution but from December 14th the question is no longer if we are going to be attacked by the police in an eviction attempt. From that day on it will be a question of when we are attacked.

This is why we are calling all the friends of Ungdomshuset to come to Copenhagen from the 13th of December. Activities are planned untill December 17th but you are welcome to stay longer. We need you.

Hope to see you here&#33;"

[Louis Pio]

Ok things really heated up Friday, around midnight we were standing at a square in Nørrebro were a demonstration had ended suddenly the cops came driving in started to fire maze and clubbed some people, they claim they told the demonstration to disperse but this is always hard to tell since it&#39;s impossible to hear. The people I was with and me quickly retreated to beyond the lines of cops, quite luckily they let us pass. So we had a pretty good view on what was happening ie burning cars, fires and so on.
Later in the night I was at Christiania were there was also lot&#39;s of cops, the fighting had died down around when we arived, but lots of cops everywere.
Yesterday there was a big peacefull demonstration and in the night a few streetfights around Christiania - pushers and stuff you know.

There has been quite a few unproductive instances - a school was trashed with computers, books and stuff thrown on the street, people&#39;s cars and bicycles burned, small stores thrashed, a kindergarden burned etc. It&#39;s of course clear that won&#39;t change a thing, it just opens up for more police repression. And quite frankly are only the doing of a small group. Somehow they seems to lack a coordinated strategy, I think lot&#39;s more would take it to the streets of the unproductive instances ceased. Because the support for a new house and the opposition to the total incompetence of the politicians is quite large, at least in Copenhagen. Don&#39;t really know about the provinces, they are a world apart sometimes. But at least in the youth there are a general feeling that the world is fucked and politicians don nothing for us, which are quite right. That&#39;s what&#39;s getting a uncoordinated expression now, a bit like in france but of course on a much smaller scale.
At this point 643 people has been arrested.
Heres some more pics:
Pics (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article256928.ece?service=gallery) The text you can see on the leaflet says "drop your facist methods and drop your selfchoosen matyrdom", it&#39;s some of the neighbors tired of the thrasings that wrote that.
pics (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article256568.ece)

[Louis Pio]

Here&#39;s the page of ungdomshuset in english Ungdomshuset (http://www.ungdomshuset.dk/en.php3?id_rubrique=4)

The city is calm right now, the police says they expect more fights. I think around two demonstrations have been planned for today. Let&#39;s see how it turns out.
Btw the houssearchs and some arrests now seems to have been done without a searchwarrant. That means the police have put the normal workings of the juridicary system out of work. So you can get arrested just on suspicion, this is first of all happening to alot of non-danes.

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by Hopscotch [email protected] 04, 2007 01:33 am
I&#39;m sure Hungary &#39;56, the Watts riots, the LA riots, etc. alienated workers... oh wait.
Because they were carried out by workers. You have a May 68 situation here where the main rioting force is not workers but youth/students. But they should reach out to workers, just like the 68 students.

[More Fire for the People]

Originally posted by Permanent Revolution+March 04, 2007 08:19 am--> (Permanent Revolution @ March 04, 2007 08:19 am)
Hopscotch [email protected] 04, 2007 01:33 am
I&#39;m sure Hungary &#39;56, the Watts riots, the LA riots, etc. alienated workers... oh wait.
Because they were carried out by workers. You have a May 68 situation here where the main rioting force is not workers but youth/students. But they should reach out to workers, just like the 68 students. [/b]
The May 1968 rioters didn&#39;t just reach out to workers — they were a part of the social factory and a part of the working class [revolutionary subject] itself. There isn&#39;t a mere co-incidence of student and worker anti-capitalism — the two are the one in the same.

[Louis Pio]

Here&#39;s an article we wrote on the subject before the recent events
Denmark: The youth house in Copenhagen – a struggle that cannot be separated from the class struggle (http://www.marxist.com/denmark-youth-house-class-struggle020307.htm)


Denmark: The youth house in Copenhagen – a struggle that cannot be separated from the class struggle
By Andreas Bülow - www.marxist.dk
Friday, 02 March 2007
In the morning hours of March 1, the police in Copenhagen finally raided the “Youth House”, a house that has been occupied for years by a movement of rebellious youth. Thousands of young people have come on to the streets to protest against this and violent clashes and riots have taken place in Copenhagen. It is necessary to understand what methods the movement must use in order to win.

This article first appeared in Socialistisk Standpunkt (www.marxist.dk), the Danish Marxist journal, on January 22. It is therefore written before the latest developments in the case, but it explains the basic position Marxists should take towards this question.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Over the last couple of months a debate has opened up in Copenhagen and all over Denmark about The Youth House, a building that has been occupied for many years by a rebellious youth movement in Nørrebro, a neighbourhood in Copenhagen. This media-attention has been further strengthened by the occupation of another house, Villa-villakula in Copenhagen and the eviction of the occupants by the police towards the end of January.

The Youth House - which by the way is a historic building where the congress of the Second International was held and where both Lenin and Rosa Luxemburg had been - is now threatened with eviction. Discussions have begun in the media about the question of private property and the responsibility of politicians to provide cultural and youth activities. Additionally it has opened up a discussion in the Danish left about which methods and which strategy should be used in order to change society.

Bourgeois policies are responsible
First and foremost it is necessary to understand the origins of this conflict. In many bourgeois papers one can read comments and columns, which for no reason place all of the blame on the youth, portray them as violent criminals and thus try to free the politicians both in Copenhagen and nationally from any responsibility.

The problem is that this conflict around The Youth House has its origins in the frustration of big sectors of the youth with the present policy that is being carried out in Denmark. While Anders Fogh (the Danish prime minister) applauds Bush&#39;s war in Iraq, the welfare state, schools and hospitals are being destroyed. In terms of the labour market and conditions of work, many young people must work under the worst conditions, in many cases without contract, the right to sick leave, etc.

At the same time, there are no proper social and cultural opportunities for young people in local municipalities. In most places, youngsters must go to bars, cafés and dance clubs with extremely high prices, thus benefiting the private owners of the nightlife industry. The policy being carried out is in other words a bourgeois class policy that benefits the capitalists in that sector. The struggle to defend The Youth House and to get more youth houses must therefore be seen in this context. It is an attempt on the part of many young people to challenge this bourgeois policy and find some kind of alternative that makes room for socially and culturally oriented youth houses.

The polemic over Jagtvej 69 (The Youth House)
It is in this light that we must approach the polemic over the building at Jagtvej 69, which has been known as The Youth House since 1982, with music concerts, a popular kitchen, cultural activities, etc. From the beginning the municipal council of Copenhagen promised that the young people could use the building as a youth house. However, they changed their minds in 2000, when the house was sold to a small Christian sect, Faderhuset. Since then Faderhuset has insisted that they own the building and that they want the young occupiers out.

The bourgeois politicians, especially in Venstre (the government party), both in the municipal council of Copenhagen and in the government, have attacked the young people in the house ferociously and prevented any kind of resolution, such as the finding of another useable house. Ritt Bjerregård (the mayor of Copenhagen) has adopted a very vacillating attitude: on the one hand she has excused herself by bringing in the argument about the "right to private property"; on the other hand she has tried to reason and call for dialogue.

However, the fact is that the municipal council promised that the youth could use this house. This decision has since been reversed. The other excuses are very hollow. It is for example incredible that the politicians cannot find a youth house to the Copenhagen youth. Yet the government was very quick to construct a new Opera house for billions of kroner, and there is certainly no hesitation in making special laws every time A.P Møller (the biggest capitalist concern in Denmark) has new building projects. All this shows that the politicians carry out a clear policy - a class policy benefiting the capitalists.

The argument about the "sacred" right to private property is also false. Each time the state builds big projects for common society, for example new railroads, highways or bridges, the government can easily expropriate houses, plots, etc. surrounding the new construction. Compensation is normally given so that the owners can buy a similar building.

Why is this impossible with The Youth House in Copenhagen? A youth house after all, is something that benefits many young people in Copenhagen. Faderhuset is a small religious sect and they could be satisfied with any other building in Copenhagen. The only reason they are sticking so stubbornly to this house in particular is that they are getting media-coverage like never before.

Anarchist methods
Marxists are by no means neutral in this struggle. We think that the main responsibility for this conflict lies with the advocates of a bourgeois policy and with the capitalist system as a whole. We fight against the lies of the bourgeois and their malicious attack on The Youth House and every other cultural community of the youth and the people. We also think that the demand for more youth houses is an important demand that should be taken up as a significant part of the revolutionary struggle.

But at the same time we also think that many of the methods that some of the young autonomists have used in this struggle are wrong, and that their strategy is completely counter-productive to achieving their aims.

Among many autonomist activists there is a an idea which says that the struggle for youth houses can be carried on as a struggle independent of wider political and trade-union struggles, that is to say, isolated from the class struggle. They see occupations of empty buildings as a means in itself. Of course the occupation of some houses can set more focus on the matter and get some media-coverage, but occupations in and of themselves solve nothing. They cannot win the struggle alone, cannot win if they are not part of a more fundamental battle to change society.

It is wrong to think that one can have a small sanctuary where there can be a "sample" of socialism, isolated from the surrounding capitalist world, with its cynical amoral and ruthless strain for profits. The problem is that this is absolutely impossible. If you want to hide yourself in your own little world, away from politics, you can try to close all windows, put a giant locker on the door and hide under the bed. But one day politics will come and knock on your door - and if you don&#39;t open, it will smash open the front door&#33;

This is precisely what has happened with The Youth House, Christiania and every other attempt to create such sanctuaries. When you live in a capitalist society, you will inevitably be submitted to its mechanisms with its exploitation and oppression, whether you like it or not. And the moral and cultural norms that are dominant in society will always affect those who live in it.

All experience shows that it is impossible to make a small "commune" free from capitalism. If the struggle is not carried out as a general fight against capitalism and for the seizure of power nationally and internationally, all projects of that kind are doomed in advance.

At the same time we believe that the concrete tactics employed by some autonomist activists are absolutely counterproductive. For example, on December 16, a demonstration was converted into violence with individual fighting with the police and the smashing of shops along the avenue. There is no doubt that the police carry their part of the responsibility for these acts of violence and that the repression of the demonstration was brutal. But the autonomists played directly into the provocations of the police. These incidents seriously damaged the cause of The Youth House in the eyes of many ordinary people and gave free ammunition to the bourgeois politicians to step up their vicious attacks. Much of the sympathy that The Youth House had won amongst wider layers of the Copenhagen population, for example with important peaceful demonstrations of 4,000 and 5,000 just weeks before, were shattered with these outbursts of individual fighting and violence.

How the struggle can be won

The only way to win this struggle is to turn it into a part of the class struggle. This is a class question and cannot be separated from the class struggle and from those methods and organizations that the working class has used traditionally. Each and every attempt to reduce the struggle to isolated occupations of houses or to street fighting with the police will fail miserably.

What is necessary is to take the demand for more youth houses up in the three workers&#39; parties, in the Social Democratic Party, in the Socialist Peoples&#39; Party, in the Unity-list and also throughout the whole of the trade-union movement, the student and apprentice movements, the renters movement, the organizations of unemployed, etc. These organizations have the necessary strength and mass following to make a wide-reaching campaign in defence of youth rights, including the right to youth houses.

If such a campaign were started, with the calling of big protest demonstrations against the policy of the government, the bourgeois politicians would find themselves seriously threatened. At the same time it would lower Anders Foghs credibility in the Danish population.

In this way it is not only possible to win the struggle for youth houses - which would be an important reform and a victory for the movement - but also to take a big step forward in the struggle against Fogh and his right-wing government and in the struggle to overthrow the capitalist system in Denmark and internationally.

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by Hopscotch Anthill+March 04, 2007 02:44 pm--> (Hopscotch Anthill @ March 04, 2007 02:44 pm)
Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 04, 2007 08:19 am

Hopscotch [email protected] 04, 2007 01:33 am
I&#39;m sure Hungary &#39;56, the Watts riots, the LA riots, etc. alienated workers... oh wait.
Because they were carried out by workers. You have a May 68 situation here where the main rioting force is not workers but youth/students. But they should reach out to workers, just like the 68 students.
The May 1968 rioters didn&#39;t just reach out to workers — they were a part of the social factory and a part of the working class [revolutionary subject] itself. There isn&#39;t a mere co-incidence of student and worker anti-capitalism — the two are the one in the same. [/b]
Whatever. My point is supported by what Teis posted - the youth are losing support through pointless destruction of things like schools, etc.

[Enragé]

good article

[An archist]

I can see a pretty good explanation for the rioting.
There were warnings in the form of youtube videos and lesser rioting before the actual eviction, that made clear to the Danish government that, if they evicted the place, there would be lots and lots of damage, so it would cost serious amounts of money.
Well, that&#39;s vwhat I heard from people anyway.
And all that shit about alienating the working class: to me, it&#39;s just an excuse for doing nothing, the fact is, rioting can sometimes be effective, just not the blind rioting where people destroy everything they see.

EDIT:I heard faderhuset just wanted the building to pull it down, because they see it asa place of sin or something. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

[Enragé]

yes rioting can be effective, when its the translation of the anger of an entire, organised, constructive movement.
If it isnt, its the road to alienation.

Not rioting doesnt mean not doing anything. I say go out and protest, and if the police attack you hit back, smash a bank if you have to, some government building, fine, but dont start torching cars for no reason, and dont think smashing shit will get society to fundamentally change (though if the things smashed are chosen well it can be good propaganda).
And 4.000-5.000 people is not a big march, its a big radicalised core of supporters, but if thats all there is (ever going to be if they alienate the rest of society), they&#39;re fucked.

[Louis Pio]

Smashing schools and burning people&#39;s cars and bikes are not productive in the very least. It&#39;s a sign of many things but not a solution. Sorry but the tactic of many of the anarchists/autonomists have failed. Mass support could have won the fight, not this. Right now it seems that alot of local residents of the nørrebro district have started to react against the people who just wanna fight. Some rioters were caught by local residents who pulled their pants down and fires get stopped by the residents now. And what would one expect? A small group has set their neighborhood on fire, that&#39;s not really anything that get support. Quite luckily it seems alot of the residents are able to distinguish between the broader fight and the actions of a small bunch of proffesional streetfighters who really don&#39;t seem to have much of an agenda other than the thrill of rioting.
I think the article I posted showed quite well how we can win the fight.

Anyway in aswer to your question Faderhuset maybe wanna tear the building down and build a new. It seems the most likely now. And yes they see it as a sinfull place, Faderhuset is an extreme rightwing christian sect that seems to worhship money more than God, they also are quite anti-muslim. However they are not going to have it for themselves. I suspect it will become quite vandalised in the years to come if they choose to stay there.

[More Fire for the People]

Factory workers smash much hated factories during uprisings — why can&#39;t students smash up schoolplaces?

[Louis Pio]

Hmm why? Well I judge these actions by their outcome, not by if it feels "cool" and so on, moral "right" or whatever. However I doubt it to be students during, probably more people around the pushergroups on Christiania. It&#39;s not even an compulsory school but a gymnasium, which means people don&#39;t really need to go there, so why the hell smash it?
Generally things like this will just turn more people against since in the end we end up paying it with our taxmoney.
I think what one needs to ask is "how do we win the fight and gain widest amount of support?", instead of sticking our heads a place were the sun never shines while we destroy everything in our path.

[Louis Pio]

Hmm the cops have used the oppotunity to raid the premises of left groups. Both Socialistisk Ungdomsfront, Rød Ungdom and Internationalt Forum has been raided. Even though their really isn&#39;t much of a link between them and the riots. So much for democracy...

[Phalanx]

Originally posted by [email protected] 04, 2007 09:29 pm
Hmm the cops have used the oppotunity to raid the premises of left groups. Both Socialistisk Ungdomsfront, Rød Ungdom and Internationalt Forum has been raided. Even though their really isn&#39;t much of a link between them and the riots. So much for democracy...
Denmark, a shining example of Scandinavian socialism <_<

[bcbm]

Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 04, 2007 09:53 am
Whatever. My point is supported by what Teis posted - the youth are losing support through pointless destruction of things like schools, etc.
As I understand it, they initially had support outside of autonomist/squatter circles and struggled hard to reach a solution with the government. Unfortunately, the government made that impossible. I agree that there is some "excess," but I think this is the logical outcome of the government&#39;s actions and we should be holding them accountable, not chastising comrades for putting their rage in to action.


I think what one needs to ask is "how do we win the fight and gain widest amount of support?", instead of sticking our heads a place were the sun never shines while we destroy everything in our path.

Yes, but when they leave you with no options and push you against a wall, what do you do?

[Louis Pio]

Well just before the eviction there was the talk of the "jagtvej 69 fond" could buy an old school building as a new youthhouse. The activists said no to this because they wanted to make it an ideological question and get that house for free, the fond has 12 million kr and now seems to go ahead with the plans without the activists.
My point is that some of the tactic of the activists of the youthhouse has been a bit stupid the last couple of years, since they have done everything to put themselves outside the broader fight, being content with building "islands outside of capitalism", that tactic is doomed to fail.

As of today there has been no fights, there was a demonstration earlier for the youthhouse with the slogan "flowers not cooplestones", which sounds better in danish since in danish it&#39;s "blomster ikke brosten". So it seems the more hardcore elements have been bypassed.

[вор в законе]

Originally posted by [email protected] 02, 2007 08:11 pm
I don&#39;t see why people are objecting to "fucking shit up". Action that weakens the state is a good thing regardless of whether or not it is part of a "workers&#39; struggle".
That is precisely why they should stop fucking shit up unless they really are in self defence. Any violent action against the State, when it is not coupled by the masses, eventually only makes the state stronger. We have seen this hundred times, when will some anarchists going to realize this. See what happened in May 1968, see what occurs when a tiny minority of revolutionaries uses force when they know that they can&#39;t match up the state nor the working class is prepared to follow them in their actions. They act as the &#39;&#39;useful idiots&#39;&#39; of the system even though they have honest intentions.

I loath the cops as much anyone does here but the fact remains.

PS: Corrected :D

[Enragé]

when are you anarchists going to realize this

shut up dont generalize

i agree with you.

[bcbm]

My point is that some of the tactic of the activists of the youthhouse has been a bit stupid the last couple of years, since they have done everything to put themselves outside the broader fight, being content with building "islands outside of capitalism", that tactic is doomed to fail.

I don&#39;t disagree, and find that to be a very big problem indeed. It seems they&#39;ve lost some of the spirit that the European youth movements were based on, I guess.


That is precisely why they should stop fucking shit up unless they really are in self defence. Any violent action against the State, when it is not coupled by the masses, eventually only makes the state stronger.

It kills me that your name is Red Brigade. And I don&#39;t think any violent action strengthens the state... I don&#39;t think this rioting will have much of an effect in the long-term, though I bet the state will be more weary to attack the squatters again.

[Louis Pio]

I don&#39;t think this rioting will have much of an effect in the long-term, though I bet the state will be more weary to attack the squatters again.


Hmm the present government is really ideologically motivated, it seems they want to destroy everything that don&#39;t fit their scheme. And in a way this is just more ammunation in their fight. Generally Denmark used to have very wide limits for what you could do, but now it&#39;s all changed. So I don&#39;t think they really care, now I may be a bit conspirationist but I think they even wouldn&#39;t mind a dead cop since it would give them even more ground to crack down hard on any diverging views.

[вор в законе]

Originally posted by black coffee black metal
It kills me that your name is Red Brigade. And I don&#39;t think any violent action strengthens the state... I don&#39;t think this rioting will have much of an effect in the long-term, though I bet the state will be more weary to attack the squatters again.

Look. My emotions tell me &#39;&#39;Shoot the MF&#39;s&#39;&#39;. My mind though tells me that if they start burning cars, shops (banks are excluded :D ) will turn the public opinion, who legitimizes the system, against them despite the fact that most people might even agree with the demands of the protesters. As a result, this unties the hands of the State which will use even more repression against the movement.

I do think though that in case the police uses violence then you should of course defend yourself. Having said that, I have the impression that in this case it was the police that provoked the violence and not the other way around.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by Red [email protected] 04, 2007 08:25 pm
My mind though tells me that if they start burning cars, shops (banks are excluded :D ) will turn the public opinion, who legitimizes the system, against them despite the fact that most people might even agree with the demands of the protesters. As a result, this unties the hands of the State which will use even more repression against the movement.
I don&#39;t think public opinion will be against the state and capital until things get pretty bad for most people, worse than they are now. So, in the meantime, I see no reason to restrain ourselves from fighting those who makes our lives miserable.



I do think though that in case the police uses violence then you should of course defend yourself. Having said that, I have the impression that in this case it was the police that provoked the violence and not the other way around.

I think raiding and capturing a house with armed anti-terrorist teams probably qualifies as violence, yes.

[Louis Pio]

Hmm they started tearing down the house, the people doing it are masked and we can&#39;t get info on what company is doing it since they painted all their machines white.

[An archist]

Originally posted by [email protected] 04, 2007 09:29 pm
Hmm the cops have used the oppotunity to raid the premises of left groups. Both Socialistisk Ungdomsfront, Rød Ungdom and Internationalt Forum has been raided. Even though their really isn&#39;t much of a link between them and the riots. So much for democracy...
yeah, they arrested several people for no reason at all, like an indymedia.nl reporter
http://indymedia.nl/nl/2007/03/42796.shtml (english version below)


oh and here&#39;s pics of the demolition of the building, how can they do this? what&#39;s the point?
http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul...gallery&start=1 (http://politiken.dk/fotografier/billedhjul_foto/article257443.ece?service=gallery&start=1)

EDIT: I completely agree that smashing random stuff like shops, cars and schools is useless, but defending an anarchist meeting place isn&#39;t. Those people have used the place for 25 years&#33; and now it&#39;s sold for the sole reason of being demolished, you&#39;d get pissed off for less then that.
Oh and indeed, the Danish government will probably think twice before risking to get riots like these again.

[Louis Pio]

The reason they are smashing it is that the christian sect who bought it says it was too damaged and they want to build a new house. Guess that house will become the most vandalised house in Copenhagen in the years to come.

The reason why they can arrest people without reason are the new terror laws, our primeminister use every oppotunity to lick Bush&#39;s ass so we have those laws too, so much for the juridicary system...

[Djehuti]

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