Revolution or Fascism?

[DiggerII]

Lately I've been looking at globalization and I think that the future will lead us one of two places. With the domination of corporations throughout much of the third world, it may very well appear that we are on a kind of march toward fascism as most of these corporations make as much if not more than many of the earth's sovereign nations.

however, I think it's really important to recognize that with a global corporate force, we have the emergence of a global labor force that will actually have the numbers for a large scale revolution.

THEN as we live in the age of information and the computer has shrunk the world, will it not be possible to spread the seeds of revolution worldwide?

talk to me comrades, I'd like to know your thoughts.

[Inithias]

yes, it's easier to spread the revolution by computer,
but you have to ask yourself if it would have to same impact as a 'real' revolution

[Phalanx]

The United States and Australia are closer to fascism than seeing a revolution in the near future. I think that certain places in Europe (France, Germany, Greece) are more likely to see revolutions, due to a higher number of workers unionized and student populations that are more concerned with revolution than business majors.

[Ihavenoidea]

Originally posted by [email protected]arch 01, 2007 04:42 pm
yes, it's easier to spread the revolution by computer,
but you have to ask yourself if it would have to same impact as a 'real' revolution
Well there you go!

*starts setting up STARTTHEREVOLUTION.com*

I think we should use technolagy to our advantage, I know a lot of you think technolagy sucks (is it because it was one of the last steps in compleat capitalist moitering/industrialization?), but it aint going no where.

Unless..........

*throws computer out window*

[Fawkes]

I think we should use technolagy to our advantage, I know a lot of you think technolagy sucks (is it because it was one of the last steps in compleat capitalist moitering/industrialization?), but it aint going no where.
I don't think any of us really feel that way.

I think that the more advanced capitalist nations will slowly continue becoming more "fascist" while class consciousness is simultaneously raised.

[Inithias]

Well there you go!

*starts setting up STARTTHEREVOLUTION.com*

I think we should use technolagy to our advantage

I've already made a site, but not with that domain.
It would be a very good thing to make, but I know from experience that you can't do it on your own... If we have some ppl that would want to work on it, it would be super.

Anyone with some pc xp ?

Ini.

[Aurora]

Fascism does not just appear,fascism is brought to existent when the capitalist classes can no longer hold on to power through democratic means.It is reaction to large scale working class organisation.
Fascism what it is and how to fight it (http://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/works/1944/1944-fas.htm) by Leon Trotsky is an great analysis of fascism

[Capcomm]

I don't see how its becoming fascist? :unsure:

But whats going on around the world is a natural process of capitalism, i know most of you are revolutionaries who would love a revolution at the moment, but anyone who understands Marx knows that this is just bogus. As much as many of us might be fascinated by Marx and his ideas, we have to come to the realization that the circumstances are not right, so we just have to go with the flow, and the circumstances will not be right until the technology is right (full automation).

Globalization, the advancement of capitalism, the advancement of technology, Marx understood this as being the guidelines in the process to a communist society, how then can we possibly change this? Globalization is great, technology is great, how can we possibly reject these things? Then a communist society will never be possible, specially if we alter a capitalist society.

[Aurora]

we have to come to the realization that the circumstances are not right, so we just have to go with the flow, and the circumstances will not be right until the technology is right (full automation).
right.... marx never said anything about "waiting until full automation" that is intirely unrealistic and can only happen in a communist society if at all.

Although you might be talking about some reformist approach based around "the tendency of the rate of profit to fall" maybe you think that once full automation is reached exploitation will stop?

[Capcomm]

right.... marx never said anything about "waiting until full automation" that is intirely unrealistic and can only happen in a communist society if at all.

Well im not sure what Marx's exact words were, but he understood that in order for capitalism to cease to exist, or the society in which we live to give way to socialism than communism, the levels of technology have to be so advanced that they produce a surplus to supply everyone's needs. Exactly what you said, it can only happen in a communist society, or let me refrase that , "communism can only happen if full automation is in place"...at least the communism Marx envisioned, if you are thinking about all other kinds , than thats a different story ie. Marxism-Leninism.




Although you might be talking about some reformist approach based around "the tendency of the rate of profit to fall" maybe you think that once full automation is reached exploitation will stop?

Well, im not sure what will really happen when full automation is reached, im just basing my argument on what Marx thought, im being Marx for a second you know what i mean? And he would have said that once full automation is reached people's consciousness will change, people will be set free from the class system etc..and that there will be no more exploitation...meaning that bosses won't have to be bosses and laborers won't have to be laborers anymore....this is when we start getting into the utopian thought, although its true that thats probably what will happen if full automation is in place...now, whether machines will take over the world or not , i can't really tell you....all i know is, that now that i think about it, we will be 100% dependant on machines, which is kinda scary, and as we see in today's world its moving more and more into that direction.

[Inithias]

all i know is, that now that i think about it, we will be 100% dependant on machines

yes idd, but a life without them is possible too, it's just way more harder i guess,
living in the wild.

[Capcomm]

yes idd, but a life without them is possible too, it's just way more harder i guess,
living in the wild.

what does idd mean? lol sorry

anyways, yeah well living in the wild is not one of my plans, or any sane person's plans, plus it's impossible to go back now, unless there is total nuclear annihalation or something lol...living in the wild and stuff would be like what Marx calls "Primitive Communism", which is not something very ideal anyways, you live to get by, yet again not something on my books.

[Inithias]

idd = indeed ;)

well yeah, you need to be kinda freaky to do that ^^
i think you can live in the wild, but not for that long,
a teacher in my school and some friends of him lived 15 days in the jungle without modern technologies or something, he said it was killing him

[Kropotkin Has a Posse]

They just won't call it fascism. I think it'll be more like what they have in Singapore.