How do wars benefit capitalism?

[Goatse]

OK, Berkman says that wars are fought because of capitalism because they benefit the capitalists... I quite believe him, but he never really explained how they do this. Can anyone explain this to me? Thanks.

[JazzRemington]

Well, war means more weapons, equipment, food, etc. need to be made. This provides demand for factories to produce these things, which in turns leads to higher employment levels, income from the government buying the goods from the capitalist, and profit levels.

In sum, war creates an economic drive based on its needs.

[Goatse]

OK thanks.

[Black Dagger]

This article may help you (and it provides examples):

http://libcom.org/library/war-globalisatio...silvia-federici (http://libcom.org/library/war-globalisation-reproduction-silvia-federici)

[Guerrilla22]

A better question would be: is there anyway that wars don't benefit capitalism?

[RebelDog]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 09:27 pm
Well, war means more weapons, equipment, food, etc. need to be made. This provides demand for factories to produce these things, which in turns leads to higher employment levels, income from the government buying the goods from the capitalist, and profit levels.

In sum, war creates an economic drive based on its needs.
All this is true but there is another dynamic in that war gains new territories, new resources and new markets. Ruling classes can get richer from wars and smash other country's means of production and weaken or subjugate rivals. There is also the wars that capitalists fight which are not necessarily for direct economic gain, for example the wars against ideological rivals, ie, communism. The worlds capitalist elite must do all it can to stop a country carrying out a successful socialist revolution and providing an example and inspiration for other proletarians around the world, most importantly the proletarians in their own countries. Thats why there are almost always grand international coalitions against proletarian revolt. The grand masters of capitalism, the US, are always involved in international anti-working class activities.


A better question would be: is there anyway that wars don't benefit capitalism?

The only ones I can think of is a war against capitalism or a destructive nuclear war which will not benefit anyone.

[BreadBros]

Wars benefit capitalists because traditionally they involve two competing powers fighting each other. If you win, it means your rival is out meaning more potential for wealth + power. It benefits capitalism because this reduction in conflict means more efficiency in generating profit. As others pointed out they also have the effect of driving economic production in capitalist countries. Think of the US: at the end of the intial New Deal reforms there were still nearly 10 million unemployed Americans! It was really the industrialization brought on by World War II that revived the US economy, not mere policy.

This is in relation to wars between powers of equal strength, inter-imperialist conflict if you will. That hasn't really happened since World War II however, and its unclear if it will continue to happen or not. Today most wars are uneven, Western countries invading weaker ones. The profit motive in these is even easier to see: main example would be that American corporations have a lot of money to make off of Iraqi oil!

[Goatse]

Thanks for the very clear responses guys.

[StartToday]

Originally posted by [email protected] 01, 2007 08:24 am
A better question would be: is there anyway that wars don't benefit capitalism?
This is actually a very good question, and one I ask myself frequently. Does anyone have an answer?

[CNT-FAI]

They may not benefit the country that loses.

War is an engine of capitalist power, but on the other hand it is impossible to calculate the economic, human, & cultural LOSSES & what might have been achieved if the destruction of war had not taken place. A regime may achieve its war aims & yet be devastated, as in the case of Vietnam. There is no way to know how much further we might have progressed if we were not a vicious imperial power, even tho we often "win".

War also has other functions which are sometimes neglected, for example social control. The US ruling elites have kept the people living in fear since 1941; there's always a new enemy & a new threat. Behaviorally fear interrupts thinking & causes people to go to old learned behaviors such as unquestioning obedience to authority.

They become incapable of dealing with the situation & find themselves the victims of conditioned reactions. (Unfortunately this also happens in the realm of politics, where we may cling to outdated/non-relevant belief systems because we feel comfortable with them even tho they don't work.)

[Organic Revolution]

Wars benefit capitalism because of creating markets in 'liberated' countries.

[CNT-FAI]

They also ensure cheap labor, as in the maquiladoras. However, war is not necessary for trade, as we see strikingly in the unholy partnership between the US bosses & Stalinist China. In that case the trade is mostly coming the other way - Stalinist China accounts for the bulk of the US trade deficit.

[Goatse]

Stalinist China?

[CNT-FAI]

You can Google search China in Amnesty International & Human Rights Watch for any given year.

I don't really see how some people who denounce the horrors of capitalism can justify regimes that are even worse, just because those regimes have a socialist or communist label.

[ComradeR]

No leftist defends the modern capitalist China. If your going to use the word "Stalinist" to describe an authoritarian capitalist state like that then the word holds no meaning.

[Goatse]

I don't really see how some people who denounce the horrors of capitalism can justify regimes that are even worse, just because those regimes have a socialist or communist label.

Sorry, was that aimed at me? Just to confirm I abhor the PRC.

[R_P_A_S]

Originally posted by [email protected] 01, 2007 05:28 pm
Think of the US: at the end of the intial New Deal reforms there were still nearly 10 million unemployed Americans! It was really the industrialization brought on by World War II that revived the US economy, not mere policy.

how exactly did world war II bring industrialization to the U.S.?

[( R )evolution]

I think he is saying how when WW2 occurred you started to have factories being set up and people began to get employed in factories that supported the war such as bullets, rifles, parts to ships, planes, weapons. Shit that was needed for war. This was a driving force in getting America out of the great depression because we must remember that America did not have economic difficulties, they had food to feed people but they had too much and shit which caused massive unemployment but with WW2 on the rise people began to be employed by the government or private parties which manufacture the tools for war. I am sure you have seen the pictures of women working in the factory building wings of a plane.

[Severian]

I don't think war itself necessarily benefits the capitalists. It is, inherently, an unproductive and destructive use of resources. And they do draw their profits from production.

It's said that war stimulates the economy, but the same stimulus could be achieved by spending money on any other unproductive purpose. The bosses don't do that at the drop of a hat. Because unproductive spending runs up debt, which is an economic drag that will do great damage in the long run. War is the main source of the tremendous U.S. government debt.

Additionally, the aftermath of war is a great producer of revolutions. It's politically risky for the upper class.

The political goals achieved through war may benefit capitalists......like anyone else, they wage war to achieve a goal. As Clausewitz said, it's the continuation of politics by other means.

Their goals often include new markets and fields of investment, including taking them away from some other group of capitalists.

[redcannon]

a great song that summerizes this is "kinky sex makes the world go round" by the Dead Kennedys. It makes a lot of sense, and is quite petrifying

[RNK]

Yeah, basically, capitalists profit from war in two ways. The first way is in the industrial sector. Manufacturing companies who get contracts from the government to build their weapons, or maintain their equipment, or check their payrolls, whatever. Secondly, capitalists make money by exploiting the new market which erupts in the aftermath of the war. In Iraq's case, Halliburton moved in post-invasion and has made billions of dollars re-building Iraq's oil infastructure. Essentially, the US government spent billions going in and shattering everything, and then got the Iraqis to pay a private US company to rebuild what they destroyed.

[Lenin II]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 08:18 pm
OK, Berkman says that wars are fought because of capitalism because they benefit the capitalists... I quite believe him, but he never really explained how they do this. Can anyone explain this to me? Thanks.
Capitalism NEEDS war. It needs it to expand territories, open new free markets, steal cheap raw materials, suppress opposition at home, pacify rebellious populations abroad, boost nationalism, allow for stronger government control, make profits for armament corporations…
They use their propaganda to incite fear. It is in their interest to keep war hysteria in continuous surge, as it leads to belligerent nationalism and witch hunts for those less patriotic. It lends power to the leaders to take away whatever they want in the name of victory, and those that disapprove are labeled as traitors. Acts such as raping, looting, the slaughter of children and families, the reduction of whole races and populations to slavery and poverty and the punishment of political prisoners by torture are looked upon as atrocities when committed by the designated enemy but as virtuous and patriotic when committed by their own.

In the suburbs of capitalist society “war” means nothing more than statistics and news reports, the occasional speech. No high-minded principle or objective has ever been involved. The idea that we “liberated” Iraq from its dictator for human rights reasons is insulting. The United States has long supported brutal tyrants around the world, from Latin America to Haiti to Israel and even Cambodia’s Khmer Rouge.

Capitalism is a predatory social system. The capitalist class and its political parties couldn’t care less if the government of Iraq (or any other country) is democratic or fascist so long as its government will deal with us.

[yantski]

The one thing that I have always struggled with regarding the Military-Industrial Complex is: how does an economy reap the benefits of war when the money paying for the war comes from taxes? To me, it's like taking marbles from the bottom of a pile and adding them to the top and saying that if we keep doing that, the pile will grow.

I think war has an economic burden hidden somewhere. Somewhere along the line someone is suffering economically. I think that is the case for all capitalist ventures. Someone must ultimately pay for the wealth of others.

If that is the case, who is bearing the economic burden of the war in Iraq? Is it the American people? The Iraqi people?

[spice756]

The one thing that I have always struggled with regarding the Military-Industrial Complex is: how does an economy reap the benefits of war when the money paying for the war comes from taxes? To me, it's like taking marbles from the bottom of a pile and adding them to the top and saying that if we keep doing that, the pile will grow.


Wars make jobs , all the factories making uniforms , boots/hats , jeeps , tanks , planes , weapon and so on.People have jobs and capitalist make money.And the economy does very good.But the goverment has high deficit.

It is like the prison industrial complex you got factories making parts for the construction of prisons ,building of prisons , surveillance technology,clothing , food that you need in prisons .You need prison guard and people working in prison .

It makes jobs and lots of money .But the goverment has a big deficit.

[spice756]

War also has other functions which are sometimes neglected, for example social control. The US ruling elites have kept the people living in fear since 1941; there's always a new enemy & a new threat. Behaviorally fear interrupts thinking & causes people to go to old learned behaviors such as unquestioning obedience to authority.



The conservative ,ultr conservative ,fascism do that they pump war like frame of mind in people.Fear this enemy now fear this enemy so on. Always have guns and go to wars .And enemy has to be wipe out so on.

They brainwash the people to have this fear all the time to support wars for US political or economic interest or imperialism interest .The US is not going to allow a communist country or anti-US imperialism country .





They become incapable of dealing with the situation & find themselves the victims of conditioned reactions. (Unfortunately this also happens in the realm of politics, where we may cling to outdated/non-relevant belief systems because we feel comfortable with them even tho they don't work.)


A conditioned reactions what? The US conservative people support war do to the brainwash going on with the media pumping this war like frame of mind .Fear the enemy now this enemy so on.