The primitivist solution to global warming

[De Smidse]

In my opinion, there is no stopping. The thing to do is just wait untill it goes wrong. Then fight out a war to bring down the number of people on this planet.
Finally start a new society without industrialisation and institutions.

[RedAnarchist]

Originally posted by De [email protected] 26, 2007 01:02 pm
In my opinion, there is no stopping. The thing to do is just wait untill it goes wrong. Then fight out a war to bring down the number of people on this planet.
Finally start a new society without industrialisation and institutions.
So, you want a primitivist society found mainly in shitty movies?

We don't need a war to fight global warming.

[De Smidse]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26, 2007 01:07 pm
So, you want a primitivist society found mainly in shitty movies?
In my opinion industrialisation can only be realised by bureaucracy and capitalism. Since I'm not in favor of that I had to make a choice.

As for global warming, finding alternatives doesn't help on the long term. Since the number of people will still be growing and thus the amount of energy that is used also.
As we say in Holland: 'Mopping with the tap open'.
Massconsumption always leads to disbalance

[RedAnarchist]

Originally posted by De Smidse+February 26, 2007 02:25 pm--> (De Smidse @ February 26, 2007 02:25 pm)
[email protected] 26, 2007 01:07 pm
So, you want a primitivist society found mainly in shitty movies?
In my opinion industrialisation can only be realised by bureaucracy and capitalism. Since I'm not in favor of that I had to make a choice.

As for global warming, finding alternatives doesn't help on the long term. Since the number of people will still be growing and thus the amount of energy that is used also.
As we say in Holland: 'Mopping with the tap open'.
Massconsumption always leads to disbalance [/b]
Would you consider yourself a primitivist?

[De Smidse]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26, 2007 02:31 pm
Would you consider yourself a primitivist?
Yes, I'm an anarcho-primitivist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-primitivism) actually and I'm also a nationalist (NOT a fascist). So it's going to be a tough time for me on these forums.

But let's not ruin this topic. I'll just let you people talk about the alternatives on global warming.

The main problem is as said, that the government is doing shit about it and the industries are the main poluters.
The diffussion of responsibility on the markets is noticable. Besides being capitalists, the slight feeling of responsibility that the organisations have is diminished because no one else responses to the problem.
Pretty shitty situation, what can we do about it?

[Ol' Dirty]

Originally posted by De Smidse+February 26, 2007 09:50 am--> (De Smidse @ February 26, 2007 09:50 am)
[email protected] 26, 2007 02:31 pm
Would you consider yourself a primitivist?
Yes, I'm an anarcho-primitivist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-primitivism) actually and I'm also a nationalist (NOT a fascist). So it's going to be a tough time for me on these forums.

But let's not ruin this topic. I'll just let you people talk about the alternatives on global warming.

The main problem is as said, that the government is doing shit about it and the industries are the main poluters.
The diffussion of responsibility on the markets is noticable. Besides being capitalists, the slight feeling of responsibility that the organisations have is diminished because no one else responses to the problem.
Pretty shitty situation, what can we do about it? [/b]
Dude, you're restricted for a reason. Don't post here.

*reported.

[Sentinel]

Then fight out a war to bring down the number of people on this planet.

Calling for genocide is not allowed in Sciences & Environment. Frankly, I think we should ban primitivists instead of merely restricting them, but these are the current rules. I have therefore split this from the global warming thread in S&E so that those willing can continue debating this nutball on this issue.

Cappies, please don't mistake this guy as any kind of leftist.

[Fawkes]

Originally posted by De [email protected] 26, 2007 08:02 am
In my opinion, there is no stopping. The thing to do is just wait untill it goes wrong. Then fight out a war to bring down the number of people on this planet.
Finally start a new society without industrialisation and institutions.
How the fuck are you ever going to get people to support this? You think that people will go along with an ideology that would see if not themselves, many of their friends killed?

[Severian]

Originally posted by De [email protected] 26, 2007 07:02 am
In my opinion, there is no stopping. The thing to do is just wait untill it goes wrong. Then fight out a war to bring down the number of people on this planet.
Why oppose global warming if you don't care about people? (Which obviously you don't if you're calling for killing off most of us.)

Global warming's good for a lot of species - especially insects! Warmer climates generally have higher biomass and higher species diversity. More CO2 in the air is good for plants.

All that carbon dioxide is being taken out of lifeless fossil fuel deposits and being put back in the biosphere. Where's the bad?

Unless you care about people and preserving civilization and enabling social progress.

[ichneumon]

ACTUUUALLLYY....


the question is, why overthrow capitalism if it will destroy itself? i, personally, can "prove" that capitalism is responsible for the emergence of new diseases, the evolution of resistant diseases and that it inherently leads to a population-crashing pandemic.

so, *morality aside*, how is it better to overthrow the system than to just wait for it to self destruct? after the floods and famines and plagues, people would NEVER AGAIN let global capitalism recur, anymore than japan will build nuclear weapons. it's a fact that people learn from suffering, not from reading about crap. northamericans have never suffered - why should they care? how can you really expect them to embrace communism and global socialism, not to mention sustainable economics?

[btw, i'm playing a bit of the devil's advocate here, so don't get all nuts with the BANNED stamp]

[redcannon]

why haven't we banned this stupid primitivist yet? restricting people doesn't do shit. besides, i'm sure he'd chose to eliminate people that aren't euros, as he is so fuckin proud of the Dutch and germanic peoples.

[BlakSheep]

How the hell did you think you could come and talk about genecide as a solution? What on earth gave you this "ideology" if you want to call it that? Do you agree with what Cambodia did, killing beautiful people,people who wore glasses, crippled people, to level society? Would you do the same? If you do have opinions like these, either talk about them in this Opposing Igeologies, or keep them to yourself.

[Fawkes]

No, don't talk about them in OI. OI is not for genocidal, anti-human fuckwits like this guy. This person needs to be banned.

[Sentinel]

Agreed, although we must remember that while this guy is unusually open and straight forward about his intentions, all primitivists are striving for the same end goal.

Well, minus the anarcho-nationalism perhaps. :lol:

[Fawkes]

Just out of curiosity, are there any other primmies on here that post relatively regularly?

[Comrade J]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27, 2007 02:11 am
Just out of curiosity, are there any other primmies on here that post relatively regularly?
http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showuser=14637

[Jazzratt]

Originally posted by Comrade J+February 27, 2007 06:24 pm--> (Comrade J @ February 27, 2007 06:24 pm)
[email protected] 27, 2007 02:11 am
Just out of curiosity, are there any other primmies on here that post relatively regularly?
http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showuser=14637 [/b]
:wub: We were all thinking it :D

As for a serious answer to your question: no, not really. The few primitivists we get visiting this board tend to get annoyed at being restricted and leave or just get bored of being constantly bombaraded with (deserved) abuse.

[Sentinel]

There is one I think of, but saying his name might summon him, so shhh.

But yeah, most of them have thankfully disappeared following their restriction. As a matte of principle I think we should ban them, but as long as they go away I'm fine..

[Publius]

In my opinion, there is no stopping.

Because, of course, you're a noted climatologist.



The thing to do is just wait untill it goes wrong. Then fight out a war to bring down the number of people on this planet.

This is a 'solution' to the problem of global warming in the same way shooting yourself in the face would be a 'solution' to a runny nose.



Finally start a new society without industrialisation and institutions.

Just save everyone the trouble and start living life as a house cat. Lead by example. Or rather, don't lead example. You know what I mean.

[Severian]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26, 2007 02:19 pm
so, *morality aside*, how is it better to overthrow the system than to just wait for it to self destruct? after the floods and famines and plagues, people would NEVER AGAIN let global capitalism recur, anymore than japan will build nuclear weapons.
How do you figure that? Hell, what makes you so sure Japan will never build nuclear weapons? It's undergoing a definite imperialist resurgence in other respects, as well as running plenty of nuclear power plants. The possibility of a Japanese nuclear arsenal is very openly discussed in the capitalist media as one possible reaction to a nuclear north Korea.

Back on track: Conscience and idealism can't by themselves divert the course of world history. If civilization collapses/gets nuked back to the Stone Age, and humanity survives, we'll have to fight our way back up through roughly the same stages of social evolution all over again. And why would you want to get stuck permanently in slavery or feudalism?

Seems to me like a pretty good reason to fight for socialist revolution as the alternative to collapse and barbarism. (To paraphrase Rosa Luxemburg.)

[Black Dagger]

Originally posted by Comrade J+February 28, 2007 04:24 am--> (Comrade J @ February 28, 2007 04:24 am)
[email protected] 27, 2007 02:11 am
Just out of curiosity, are there any other primmies on here that post relatively regularly?
http://www.revleft.com/index.php?showuser=14637 [/b]
You are very confused.

[KC]

Pretty sure that was a joke.

[Black Dagger]

For some people, maybe; try askin' vanguard1917 what he thinks :rolleyes:

[Zero]

Originally posted by black [email protected] 01, 2007 07:53 am
For some people, maybe; try askin' vanguard1917 what he thinks :rolleyes:
Shh, sometimes it's easier for people to slap a label on others and ostricise them rather than try to engage them :lol: .