The "Immigration problem"

[Goatse]

OK, my parents have some moderate leftism in them. They both despise Blair and their views on taxation are fairly leftist... my dad more so than my mother. There is one thing, however, that really gets to me...

Basically, they think immigrants are coming here, then scrounging off the system. While this might be true for a few of them... it's also true for a lot of Brits. Anyway, they seem to think the solution would be to kick all immigrants out of the country. What am I supposed to say to that?

Also, another similar thing... my mother seems to think all muslims = terrorists. They seem to buy into the whole "Muslims are trying to take over the world!" crap. If I ever point out that the USA and the UK recently invaded Iraq, that the US has bombed countless countries, launched dozens of coups (or at least attempts) and tried to assassinate their opponents, they just get angry at me for being "deliberately controversial" or just smile at me and say "You've got a lot to learn." (Once they were talking about Saddam being hanged, and I said Bush should be next... and they just said "You wouldn't be saying that if you lived in Iraq!" which makes no sense, since things are much worse since Bush fucked up the country. I mentioned this and they just did the annoying smile.) How am I supposed to convince them that not all Muslims are evil terrorists trying to dominate the world?

[Knight of Cydonia]

muslims = terrorists..."Muslims are trying to take over the world!"
:D absolutely wrong,i'm a muslim, and i'm not a terrorist, and i'm not trying to take over the world ;)


How am I supposed to convince them that not all Muslims are evil terrorists trying to dominate the world?

just tell them: did they ever heard that Indonesia was the only country with the biggest muslim religious citizens? well, Indonesia is the country with the most muslim citizens in Asia, and the world maybe :P and we indonesian muslims not trying and not even think about taking over the world.

Edit: oh and i forgot to add this, we aren't terrorist, and there is no such things like that in muslim history.we indonesian muslims will only use violence when it's concern about religious things i.e when someone from different religion do some abusive things on muslim, or they're humiliating muslim.

and i guess you ever heard about the "Pesantren" things that George fuckin'Bush ever mention and suspicious that the Pesantren is terrorist lair, no that's a big lie and that's a big bullshit. Pesantren is a place to study anything about islam, no other than that. :)

[Jazzratt]

Doesn't sound like they could be persuaded by a logical argument so this whole thing might be a hiding to nothing. It seems more of an issue of how they react to you as opposed to your arguments and that is a much harder thing to deal with. I've already assumed you're resonably articulate in these discussions but it might be a good idea to present these facts with the source you have for them, which is hard to do in a daily conversation but if you start something with "I read in x that..." (where x is near enough anything except, say,. NUTS magazine) then 9 times out of 10 they'll probably be more ready to listen.

I probably wouldn't try to bring it up yourself or anything though - wait until they're in the mood to talk politics and then tell them why they're wrong. Remind them that though you may have a lot to learn about certian things, you have learned a lot through politics - maybe mention you discuss with people older and wiser (ostensibly :lol: ) on the intwernet if that may help persuade them.

Good luck comrade.

[Ander]

I suggest you tell them that their views on muslims and immigrants offends you and that you don't understand why they think that way. Ask them to explain but only if they will listen to what you have to say in return. Then explain to them the fallacy of an entire religion based on terrorism and show them why and how they are wrong. Use facts and evidence to support your case. I suggest using the media because if you start pulling stuff from socialist websites they might think it's propaganda and won't pay attention.