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PRC-UTE
31st December 2006, 01:19
An Gl髍 / The Voice
News sheet of Belfast Republican Socialist Youth Movement
January 2007
Circulation: 400

- Brit police never acceptable
- Maghaberry Prison protest continues
- Assets Recovery Agency, a question of money
- Support the Turkish death fast
- Ard Fheis rejects any move towards INLA decommisoning
- Volunteer Davy McNutt RIP

http://www.rsym.org/pdf/magazines/anGlor1.pdf

The Grey Blur
31st December 2006, 22:40
Will you guys be selling this at demos?

EDIT: Oh and you misspelled 'challenge' on the front page

SECOND EDIT: What's with constantly using 'Our People'? It sounds a bit nuts...

The Grey Blur
7th January 2007, 22:11
Response?

PRC-UTE
7th January 2007, 23:53
I'm not in the RSYM and I have nothing to do with An Gl髍. You can contact them direclty if you have questions, seems more appropriate than on a forum.

Yes, I got your PM as well. I see you're very curious about our movement and activities...

The Grey Blur
8th January 2007, 08:08
Yes I am a spy for the Provisional Republican Movement. :rolleyes:

I just want a copy of An Gl髍 and explained to me why the RSYM are using such a general term as 'our people' instead of just 'the working class'.

PRC-UTE
9th January 2007, 01:26
You're just a liberal who likes to waste peoples time.

The Grey Blur
9th January 2007, 20:16
:lol:

The revolution shall be built on ad hominems!

scourge of the anarchotrots
9th January 2007, 22:12
Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 08:16 pm
:lol:

The revolution shall be built on ad hominems!
then why were you after slabbering about the irsp posters with an ak on them? :lol:

The Grey Blur
9th January 2007, 22:23
Originally posted by scourge of the anarchotrots+January 09, 2007 10:12 pm--> (scourge of the anarchotrots @ January 09, 2007 10:12 pm)
Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 08:16 pm
:lol:

The revolution shall be built on ad hominems!
then why were you after slabbering about the irsp posters with an ak on them? :lol: [/b]
:huh: That was about 5-6 months ago...and I don't actually see your point...

can't be bothered to log in
9th January 2007, 23:21
Originally posted by Permanent Revolution+January 09, 2007 10:23 pm--> (Permanent Revolution @ January 09, 2007 10:23 pm)
Originally posted by scourge of the [email protected] 09, 2007 10:12 pm

Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 08:16 pm
:lol:

The revolution shall be built on ad hominems!
then why were you after slabbering about the irsp posters with an ak on them? :lol:
:huh: That was about 5-6 months ago...and I don't actually see your point... [/b]
Ok, I'll spell it out for ya.

Like all other liberals, you hate to see workers armed...

The Grey Blur
9th January 2007, 23:24
Originally posted by can't be bothered to log in+January 09, 2007 11:21 pm--> (can't be bothered to log in @ January 09, 2007 11:21 pm)
Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 10:23 pm

Originally posted by scourge of the [email protected] 09, 2007 10:12 pm

Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 08:16 pm
:lol:

The revolution shall be built on ad hominems!
then why were you after slabbering about the irsp posters with an ak on them? :lol:
:huh: That was about 5-6 months ago...and I don't actually see your point...
Ok, I'll spell it out for ya.

Like all other liberals, you hate to see workers armed... [/b]
:lol: So the INLA were a mass workers militia then?

PRC-UTE
9th January 2007, 23:52
Originally posted by Permanent Revolution+January 09, 2007 11:24 pm--> (Permanent Revolution @ January 09, 2007 11:24 pm)
Originally posted by can't be bothered to log [email protected] 09, 2007 11:21 pm

Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 10:23 pm

Originally posted by scourge of the [email protected] 09, 2007 10:12 pm

Permanent [email protected] 09, 2007 08:16 pm
:lol:

The revolution shall be built on ad hominems!
then why were you after slabbering about the irsp posters with an ak on them? :lol:
:huh: That was about 5-6 months ago...and I don't actually see your point...
Ok, I'll spell it out for ya.

Like all other liberals, you hate to see workers armed...
:lol: So the INLA were a mass workers militia then? [/b]
Nah, they wouldn't've lasted five minutes if they were a mass militia. That woulda been suicidal.

They certainly were almost entirely working class... much more so than the trendy left ever has been.

The Grey Blur
10th January 2007, 16:43
A mass worker's militia is the most effective and democratic form of anti-beurgeois militarism. The INLA couldn't be one as they were self-appointed guardians of the Catholic working class. This undemocratic flaw is evident in how they degenerated; splits and violent feuds.


They certainly were almost entirely working class... much more so than the trendy left ever has been.
:rolleyes:

While that is both incorrect and irrelevant I have to say I'm surprised by this hostility to simple questions. After all you "also encourage any criticism that people might have in regards the political nature or structure of the IRSP".

PRC-UTE
10th January 2007, 19:55
Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 10, 2007 04:43 pm
A mass worker's militia is the most effective and democratic form of anti-beurgeois militarism. The INLA couldn't be one as they were self-appointed guardians of the Catholic working class. This undemocratic flaw is evident in how they degenerated; splits and violent feuds.

I think you mean bourgeois.

Those two aren't logically related, ie fueds and splits to being an underground army. It's also not true to say that an underground armed force is counterposed to mass struggle. Look at the examples of the Bolsheviks, Cubans, Spanish Anarchists, etc.




They certainly were almost entirely working class... much more so than the trendy left ever has been.
:rolleyes:

While that is both incorrect and irrelevant I have to say I'm surprised by this hostility to simple questions. After all you "also encourage any criticism that people might have in regards the political nature or structure of the IRSP".

Irrelevant? You said we weren't a workers militia... yet the irps have always been overwhelmingly working class, unlike your political tendency. Don't throw stones if ya live in a glass house mucker :lol:

The Grey Blur
10th January 2007, 22:54
I never said you weren't largely constituted of working-class Catholics, I said you weren't a workers militia - there's a difference.

It's irrelevant in that it doesn't matter how many working-class members you have, how much weapons you fire into the sky or how many flags you can wave - if your political line is ineffective then you are doomed. DOOMED I TELLS YE


Those two aren't logically related, ie fueds and splits to being an underground army
Then why did the feuds and splits occur in the INLA? To my understanding it was a lack of political education, the lack of internal communication and the neccessarily undemocratic mode of operation of your 'underground army'.

Also, maybe you should come along to a Socialist Youth meeting where there's twenty young people who have just worked their asses off all week trying to get a disinterested and apathetic youth interested in working-class politics and call us 'trendy leftists'.

PRC-UTE
11th January 2007, 00:33
Originally posted by Permanent [email protected] 10, 2007 10:54 pm
I never said you weren't largely constituted of working-class Catholics, I said you weren't a workers militia - there's a difference.




You know yourself.

And I'm so grateful you can explain these differences to me. I never woulda known that, sure.


It's irrelevant in that it doesn't matter how many working-class members you have, how much weapons you fire into the sky or how many flags you can wave - if your political line is ineffective then you are doomed. DOOMED I TELLS YE


The IRSP recognised that armed struggle ceased to be a useful tactic some time ago. In line with changing conditions, we changed our tactics. We tried to push mass struggle, but the provos rejected it. True to form, you agreed with SF just yesterday that the only options available were either armed struggle or the GFA sellout. So don't lecture me about an inneffective political line, fuck :lol:

This is what I mean about you- scratch the surface of your lefty veneer and you're still a shinner.



Those two aren't logically related, ie fueds and splits to being an underground army
Then why did the feuds and splits occur in the INLA? To my understanding it was a lack of political education, the lack of internal communication and the neccessarily undemocratic mode of operation of your 'underground army'.


The central leadership who were capable of maintaining discipline with the various factions were murdered by the Sticks, Loyalists and SAS (Costello, Daly, Bunting, etc). Then to keep pace with the PIRA, militarists within the INLA recruited people who were apolitical physical force types. When criminal elements who should have never been allowed into the RSM were purged, they formed together to detroy the RSM. That's it in a nutshell. Today we're free of those problems, so being an underground army isn't the inherent problem was my point. The critical issue is that we have politics in command- the army is subordinate to the party, and the party is a mass democratic organisation for shaping policy. I know because I take part in it.


Also, maybe you should come along to a Socialist Youth meeting where there's twenty young people who have just worked their asses off all week trying to get a disinterested and apathetic youth interested in working-class politics and call us 'trendy leftists'.

You make a lot of assumptions about me. Let's just say I know your group better than you think.

Coggeh
11th January 2007, 14:36
Republican socialism is just stupid ... We are all workers of the world let not our nationality divide us in a global class war

PRC-UTE
13th January 2007, 22:55
Originally posted by [email protected] 11, 2007 02:36 pm
Republican socialism is just stupid ... We are all workers of the world let not our nationality divide us in a global class war
it's just stupid. well that's an earth shattering contribution mate.

in the meantime, our comrades oppressed by imperialism just wait until the first world workers decide to unite with em?

(It's usually the opposite, btw. Defeats of imperialist forces usually encourage rebellions of workers in the first world.)

but anyway, your one point you made was a strawman. in practice republican socialists have been very internationalist. Me, I've got contacts in probably a dozen countries now. The RSYM has expressed sympathy, solidarity and support for fellow workers all over the world. In practice the IRSM has offered real assitance to fellow revolutionaries across the globe.

Coggeh
14th January 2007, 11:24
Ya but in just the basis of Northern Ireland The IRSP is too removed from the prodestant working class.