Religious conflict in Indonesia

[RedStarOverChina]

An exmaple of religion bring the worst out of humans.

Comments and a little background information would be appriciated.

Again, the video is EXTREMELY graphic. Don't say I didn't warn you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Bo-ZRb1Edg

[RedStarOverChina]

Gosh I can't finish watching this.

[Knight of Cydonia]

who said is was religion conflict? it was a tribe conflict. it didn't bring the religion for the first time but as it growing bigger, there's some provocator that won't to see this matter to be done.

and for us Indonesian, that Poso conflict is a past that has to forgot and wish never to happen again.

[RedStarOverChina]

who said is was religion conflict? it was a tribe conflict. it didn't bring the religion for the first time but as it growing bigger, there's some provocator that won't to see this matter to be done.


Ok what I know is that the video is in Arabic---and it speaks of Holy War.


and for us Indonesian, that Poso conflict is a past that has to forgot and wish never to happen again.

Well, it's kind of hard to do that with religion still around.

It's going to happen again.

Put an end to religion now. Just end it, man.

[Knight of Cydonia]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19, 2006 07:34 am

who said is was religion conflict? it was a tribe conflict. it didn't bring the religion for the first time but as it growing bigger, there's some provocator that won't to see this matter to be done.


Ok what I know is that the video is in Arabic---and it speaks of Holy War.


and for us Indonesian, that Poso conflict is a past that has to forgot and wish never to happen again.

Well, it's kind of hard to do that with religion still around.

It's going to happen again.

Put an end to religion now. Just end it, man.
ok,is in Arabic, but not just because is in Arabic and speak Holy War can make it's a religion conflict.

and how come we put an end to religion?being an atheist?you can't told Indonesian people to being an atheist.

[Bright Banana Beard]

where can I learn more about this? Damn and please stop genociding in Darfur! Those people are target just because they black.

[Knight of Cydonia]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19, 2006 07:53 am
where can I learn more about this? Damn and please stop genociding in Darfur! Those people are target just because they black.
you can learn it from Indonesian people ;)

and it's not a racist conflict, where the hell isDarfur anyway?

[RedStarOverChina]

ok,is in Arabic, but not just because is in Arabic and speak Holy War can make it's a religion conflict.

People simply don't kill eachother in THAT MANNER in tribal disputes! They need religion to justify it!

Shit my hand is still shaking from watching the video.


and how come we put an end to religion?being an atheist?you can't told Indonesian people to being an atheist.
All nations will have to cross that bridge.

Unless they really like parading around with other peoples' heads.

[Knight of Cydonia]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19, 2006 07:58 am
People simply don't kill eachother in THAT MANNER in tribal disputes! They need religion to justify it!

Shit my hand is still shaking from watching the video.


you didn't know about Sambas? the conflict between Maduranese and Dayak tribe. they don't need a religion to kill each other in that manner. Especially for Maduranese people, even if they got stuck in conflict between them just because a women, they sure do will have that manner.

[RedStarOverChina]

you didn't know about Sambas? the conflict between Maduranese and Dayak tribe. they don't need a religion to kill each other in that manner. Especially for Maduranese people, even if they got stuck in conflict between them just because a women, they sure do will have that manner.
I used wikipedia and didn't find out much about these peoples.

I admit it is hard for me to understand that region: I googled Maduranese and the phrase "head hunters" appeared.

So I give up. Do you have anything to add? And information at all? like what religion do they follow and stuff.


I still believe religion is largely responsible for the conflict...Some of the people parading with heads were wearing Green bandanas with arabic written on them.

[Knight of Cydonia]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19, 2006 08:15 am

you didn't know about Sambas? the conflict between Maduranese and Dayak tribe. they don't need a religion to kill each other in that manner. Especially for Maduranese people, even if they got stuck in conflict between them just because a women, they sure do will have that manner.
I used wikipedia and didn't find out much about these peoples.

I admit it is hard for me to understand that region: I googled Maduranese and the phrase "head hunters" appeared.

So I give up. Do you have anything to add? And information at all? like what religion do they follow and stuff.


I still believe religion is largely responsible for the conflict...Some of the people parading with heads were wearing Green bandanas with arabic written on them.
for the religion, Maduranese are mostly moslem and Dayak tribe is pagan or something like that,whatever. there's a lot of Maduranese in my city (Surabaya)but for Dayak they lived far away from my city and my island (Java Island).

and for that green bandanas people, it's those (morrons) people who called them self Laskar Jihad who's interfere in a conflict that they even don't understand what's it all about. (yeah maybe those morron just like parading with other people's head :lol: )

EDIT: and here's some info if you want to know about Sambas conflict
http://www.idp.ntnu.no/Conference/Default....cript&offset=20 (http://www.idp.ntnu.no/Conference/Default.asp?page=literatur&literaturid=1715854813&mm=1995605732&sm=1124142384&ct=script&offset=20)

[Knight of Cydonia]

here's some article:

Ethnic conflict.

An area where Coleman’s criteria hardly exist is Sambas (West Kalimantan). In this kabupaten (county) there were some different ethnics and religions. The East coast is dominated by the Melayu-Moslem people, the highlands and forests in the West is the habitat of the Dayak-animist and Dayak-Christian people. There are also a big number of Chinese-Confusian and Christian people and some other migrants, mostly Moslem, from the islands of Java, Sulawesi and Madura.

In the history of Sambas, since 1933 there have been 11 times of bloody violence between the Dayaks and Madurese, killing hundreds of people. But one of the most bloodiest conflict was between the Melayu people and the Madurese in 1999. The conflict ended by ethnic cleansing and almost all Madurese in Sambas were either killed or left the county and live as refugees in other areas or cities, including in Pontianak, the capital of West Kalimantan, creating lots of new problems in the concerned areas (the refugees occupy public facilities, living in a very poor condition, lack of clean water, no jobs, no education for the children, lack of health facilities etc.) (Kunarto, 1999c; Sihbudi et al., 2000).

The government and the police failed to prevent more serious conflict, although after each conflict they managed to convince the conflicting parties to sign peaceful agreements. In reality, each agreement was violated by the Madurese and the conflict started again. According to an Indonesian anthropologist, it was always the Madurese (particularly in Sambas) who started a conflict because their violent way of life and their tendency to solve problems by force (they always carry sharp weapons as part of their traditional dress accessories). They also isolate themselves from the rest of the community by being exclusive (exclusive living area, exclusive mosques and religious schools using the Madurese language instead of Bahasa Indonesia). Then it is logical that there are no more sense of humanism among the Dayaks and the Melayu people if it concern the Madurese. As it was mentioned earlier, the Dayaks see the Madurese as wild boar, and the Melayu people view them as dogs. On the other hand, the Madurese perceive the Dayaks as kafir (sinful non-Moslems) and the Melayus as hollow chips. By looking into each other as inhumane, there is no more psychological barrier in doing inhuman violence against each other. Some third parties (Jakarta politicians, Moslem fundamentalist, Madurese organizations etc.) efforts to intervene the ethnic conflict and shift it into a religious one didn’t succeeded since the core issue is ethnical, not religious (Suparlan, 2000).

Another example of ethnic violence happened in Java. On January 30, 1997, on a day in the Moslem fasting month, an old Chinese lady, Kim Chen, shouting dirty words to some youths who were hitting the drum of a nearby mosque in doing the tradition of waking up people at very early in the morning to get their early breakfast (sahur) before fasting days. Kim Chen who live in a neighborhood in Rengasdengklok (West Java) was disturbed and by some reasons get angry to her neighbors. Unfortunately, this small incidence at 03.00 developed into serious violence against Chinese properties in the small town, starting at 06.00 when people from neighboring villages came in. The situation was under control again after additional police personnel have been summoned to back up the local police (Kunarto, 1999c).

but i don't want other people to have assumption that Indonesian people is bad, so they don't want to go to Indonesia. we Indonesian people still well known as having friendly, peaceful and helpful population. :lol:

[The Feral Underclass]

I couldnt finish watching it either. I can cope with pictures of dead bodies, but mutilated images of children is just too much.

I don't really care what the cause of any of that is, there is just simply no justification to treat a child in that manner.

Any human who can hack up a kid has simply gone off the edge and has removed themselves firmly from humanity in any sense of the word.

[Vargha Poralli]

Another example of ethnic violence happened in Java. On January 30, 1997, on a day in the Moslem fasting month, an old Chinese lady, Kim Chen, shouting dirty words to some youths who were hitting the drum of a nearby mosque in doing the tradition of waking up people at very early in the morning to get their early breakfast (sahur) before fasting days. Kim Chen who live in a neighborhood in Rengasdengklok (West Java) was disturbed and by some reasons get angry to her neighbors. Unfortunately, this small incidence at 03.00 developed into serious violence against Chinese properties in the small town, starting at 06.00 when people from neighboring villages came in. The situation was under control again after additional police personnel have been summoned to back up the local police (Kunarto, 1999c).



This is the place where the country I live India does loads better.A few years back here most Muslims celebrated Ramzan a day before its official ending because the official ending came on Friday making it impossible for their Hindu friends to join them in celebrations since all Hindus(even sects which allow eating meat) don't take any meat on Friday(auspicious and sacred day for them).And many churches(CSI - a protestant group) allow Hindus to come and worship there without christianising.

But this harmony is severely tested in many occasions both by Hindu(Gujarat Pogroms,Graham Steins case,Babri Masjid Demolition and whole Ram Janma Bhoomi Issue) and Muslim (Bombing of various cities for about 12 years from 1993 recently in Mumbai and Thane,Attack on the Indian Parliament,Various Bombings in Hindu Temples throughout India)Fundamentalists. But majority of us in both sides do not fall victim to that Hate mongering by those idiots.


I couldnt finish watching it either. I can cope with pictures of dead bodies, but mutilated images of children is just too much.

I don't really care what the cause of any of that is, there is just simply no justification to treat a child in that manner.

Any human who can hack up a kid has simply gone off the edge and has removed themselves firmly from humanity in any sense of the word.

Is it really that bad.After reading your post I decided not even to open it in my browser. :(