Anti-Flag

[cb9's_unity]

Anti-Flag has probably been one of the more inspiring bands that i have listened to but now i realize i have no clue what political beliefs they follow. Usually they make very pointed attacks at the government but i've never heard a song where they suggested what exactly to do.
I know there not anarchists as they make that very clear in there songs but what else could they be, communists, socialists or just very angry liberals. I tried to find what they are but if any of you know that would be cool. :D

[Angry Young Man]

I used to think they were radical, but they use words like "liberty" and "democracy". I was listening to "Blood and Empire" and I heard the latter and was disturbed for a while, but reconciled myself that they may be singing about true democracy.

[Phalanx]

Liberty and democracy are words capitalists corrupted. But they're ideals we pursue nonetheless.

[Pawn Power]

Originally posted by cb9'[email protected] 14, 2006 02:39 pm
heard a song where they suggested what exactly to do.
I know there not anarchists as they make that very clear in there songs but what else could they be, communists, socialists or just very angry liberals. I tried to find what they are but if any of you know that would be cool. :D
Liberals, but not very angry. I was at a show where they played at a while back, it was the summer before the 2004 election and they told the audience to vote. Thats when I knew their politicts were a joke just like their music.

[which doctor]

They are money-makers.

[OneBrickOneVoice]

they make good music and i like the song "culture revolution" but they're probably not as revolutionary as I thought if they told an audience to vote like you said Pawn Power

[Angry Young Man]

Originally posted by Tatanka [email protected] 15, 2006 11:41 pm
Liberty and democracy are words capitalists corrupted. But they're ideals we pursue nonetheless.
I thought, with the connotations I have of the word "liberty", that it is negative freedom, the kind of which JS Mill pursued, ie being free to accumulate as much as possible with no intervention. It has its uses, but only in social issues like sexual orientation.
What I do believe we chase is autonomy or positive freedom, ie freedom from want, from starvation, and in the true Marxist/anarchist case, a state or a despot (sorry, Josef x).

[Enragé]

Anti-flag are social democrats, perhaps radical social democrats.

If you listen to their older records, and some of the songs they made before that, you can see they used to be a fuckload more radical

for example
we dont need time to talk over a solution
we know what we need we need a fucking revolution!
i think its from the song "We've Got The Numbers" off of A New Kind Of Army, donno for sure though, it is definetely on ANKOA at least.

still i like them.
Even my name is a rip off of an Anti-Flag album (A New Kind Of Army --> ANKOA --> New Kind Of Soldier ---> NKOS), though it in fact is just a leftover from like when i was a "diehard fan".

[Utopia]

They have a lot of good ideas, and the ability to get their message across to a lot of people. Good for them.

[IcarusAngel]

I've heard them described as Libertarian-Socialists. They're even in the "Red Vocabulary" (http://reds.linefeed.org/vocab.html) dictionary as being libertarian-socialists. It is true that they read and cite libertarian-socialists like Zinn and Chomsky in their music and in their inserts and booklets.

However, Pat Thetic in interviews says that he's a "Socialist" all the time.

[Angry Young Man]

An interview in Kerrang (I know) described them as "fiercely left-wing" but RA as "anti-establishment". Surely it's truer the other way around, because RA still scare tories! You can always stuff a cappie by saying "The left has better music. In most genres as well."

Old Punk: The Clash and many more
New punk: RA
Metal: SOAD, RATM
Rap: Public Enemy
Folk: Neil Young?

What does the right have

O and apparently, Skinny Puppy of Industrial are also left-wing, but who gives a shit?

[Oiron]

Come over to the left, we have better music. Almost like the old one 'come to the dark side, we have cookies' ;) :P

But, seriously, we do, don't we? (have better bands, not the cookies :P ). Folk? I'm a folk punk fan (among other things), and folk punk bands are pretty much leftist by default :ph34r: :wub:

[Angry Young Man]

Who's to say that the left doesn't have better cookies? To quote the Oracle, cookies need love like everything else; and to quote me, politics is much like medicine: the heart is on the left.
And are Flogging Molly leftist? They do sound pretty cool, it can't be denied.

O and in my prev list, I forgot to mention Bob Dylan.

Plus it moves into other arts:
We have Frida Kahlo, who do they have?
We have George Orwell, who do they have?
We have J.B. Priestley, who do they have?
etc, etc, etc.

[Oiron]

Hey, I don't know about Flogging Molly, I'm not sure they've ever taken an official stance, I just know they're anti-Bush. Some of the lyrics sound like they're swinging to the left, at least mildly... They're not political, but they're sorta... aware. :) *loves floggin molly* :D

Anyway, we got Defiance Ohio and Ghost Mice and Mutiny and Street Dogs too :wub:

We're getting a bit off topic here, though, aren't we, so maybe we should move this to a separate thread... (or... ya know... not ;) )

[bloody_capitalist_sham]

I read in a interview with justin sane and another member, and they say only change will come with a "violent and bloody revolution".

Hardly liberal... :rolleyes:

[Tommy-K]

Originally posted by Romantic [email protected] 27, 2007 06:11 pm
Plus it moves into other arts:
We have Frida Kahlo, who do they have?
We have George Orwell, who do they have?
We have J.B. Priestley, who do they have?
etc, etc, etc.
I suppose the best they have is Lynyrd Skynyrd :P

[Angry Young Man]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28, 2007 08:00 am
I read in a interview with justin sane and another member, and they say only change will come with a "violent and bloody revolution".

Hardly liberal... :rolleyes:
Hardly liberal? 1789 ringing bells?

Anyho, they sux anyway.

[militant1001]

First of all Anti-flag kick ass. Second of all they cant possibly be liberal since a liberal supports a market economy and half of Anti-Flag's songs are leftist hymns ripping on big business and the corportocracy. Their much too anti-authoritarian to be communists and as you said they encourage voting so they cant be anarchists. I would say their radical democratic socialists.

[Enragé]

people here use the world liberal as a slur often to describe utopian-ish pussies, so i guess thats what he meant :P


I read in a interview with justin sane and another member, and they say only change will come with a "violent and bloody revolution".

Hardly liberal...

when was that?

[Angry Young Man]

Liberal as in liberal-left, like Michael Moore, rather than a socialist who wants workers to have democratic control and a social democrat who wants industries to be taken into state control.
They condone a sort of higher taxation and cheap and easy insurance companies, but still enjoy the iniquitous wealth they attain. Basically they call themselves "left-wing" to implace moderate reform that will put off proletarian revolution. Basically I hate these people more than I hate conservatives or laissez-faire capitalists. At least with these two there's a feeling of need to topple them.
I close this diatribe by using one person as an example: David Cameron. He makes my skin crawl!

[EwokUtopia]

Originally posted by Romantic [email protected] 25, 2007 07:25 pm
Folk: Neil Young?
Oh come on, Phil Ochs is a much more left wing folk musician than Neil Young and Bob Dylan combined. Ochs is the man of leftist folk.

[Rizzo]

I'm all for change, for finding soething better, but Anti-Flag is a *****y liberal band, that will sing about problems, but make no effort to fix them.
However,
Depleted Uranium is a Warcrime is a cool song.

[EwokUtopia]

I have never really liked anti-flag. They almost have an emo feel to them, and the pictures of the band are kind of funny too. They almost dress like me, but they look like male models in alot of ways, and again, with a deffinate emo undertone.

Mind you I've not heard too much of them, and I probably wont get into them now, they are very high school, like most popular Leftist music.

[Coggeh]

Meh their an ok band , Press Corpse is a good song , i think they just use fashionable leftism for money making opportunities .

[Sir_No_Sir]

Meh, I like Anti-Flag alot. Even if they are liberal pussies, they're pissed off and aware. Isn't that a good thing? I also like their music, generally, though the old stuff from "Die For Your Government" was so much better then it is now.

War Sucks, Let's Party:

The Anarchists are buzzin' like bees around a hive
As protesters hit the streets with signs, signs, signs
The dissent of the world has filled us to the brim
But some will still cast their ballots
Based on those who live in sin.

It's unbelievable
It's unbelievable to watch the system crumble
This political shakedown, coming correct from the underground
This political shakedown, coming correct from the underground
We've been cut up
We've been shut up
For far too long, yeah!

Pull the feeding tube out of the mouth of democracy
Televise it starving to death
Once buried in the ground
We can all breathe free
We can all breathe free

It's unbelievable
It's unbelievable to watch the system crumble
This political shakedown, coming correct from the underground
This political shakedown, coming correct from the underground
We've been cut up
We've been shut up
For far too long, yeah!

(It's unbelievable, whoa oh whoa oh-oh)
(It's unbelievable, whoa oh whoa oh-oh)

Policeman takes his club to a head (It's unbelievable, whoa oh whoa oh-oh)
Just like he's beating the drum
The news reporters dance like hell (It's unbelievable, whoa oh whoa oh-oh)
..To the sounds.

[Red October]

theyre not that bad. im going to see them in 2 days, but im not as excited about it as i was a few months ago. theyre not liberals or democrats, but they could be a hell of alot more radical.

[Chicano Shamrock]

Originally posted by Tommy-K+March 31, 2007 02:39 am--> (Tommy-K @ March 31, 2007 02:39 am)
Romantic [email protected] 27, 2007 06:11 pm
Plus it moves into other arts:
We have Frida Kahlo, who do they have?
We have George Orwell, who do they have?
We have J.B. Priestley, who do they have?
etc, etc, etc.
I suppose the best they have is Lynyrd Skynyrd :P [/b]
Skynyrd!!! Can you really call them right wing? They are my favorite classic rock band.

This is their song called "Saturday Night Special"

Two feets they come a creepin
Like a black cat do
And two bodies are lyin naked
Creeper think he got nothin to lose
So he creeps into this house, yeah
And unlocks the door
And while a man reaching for his trousers
Shoots him full of .38 holes

(chorus)
Its a saturday night special
Got a barrel thats blue and cold
Aint no good for nothin
But put a man six feet in a hole

Big jims been drinkin whiskey
And playing poker on a losin night
Pretty soon, big jim starts a thinkin
Somebody been cheatin and lyin
So big jim commences to fightin
I wouldnt tell you no lie
And big jim done grab his pistol
Shot his friend right between the eyes

(chorus)

Hand guns are made for killin
Aint no good for nothin else
And if you like your whiskey
You might even shoot yourself
So why dont we dump em people
To the bottom of the sea
Before some fool come around here
Wanna shoot either you or me






A right winged band would hardly say anything like that. I could be wrong though. The thing I don't like about Skynyrd is that they have the confederate flag everywhere. But you have to remember that the American civil war was not about slavery it was about the American government holding too much power.

Anyways about Anti-flag. I really can't figure out their political stance. On their dvd they have an interview of themselves. The interviewer asks what political parties they like. They say that they kind of like where the American Green Party is coming from. They don't really answer the question straight up though. When asked about violence they say that maybe sometimes it is ok. And they do lame commercials for peta. So I have no idea what their politics are but I like their music.

I was looking for their interview from the dvd on youtube and I came across an interview where Chris #2 is wearing a shirt with a hammer and sickle. Now I am more confused. :blink: Here is the interview with the sickle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGVohDbKvyg

[Goatse]

Well son, I don't know what Anti-Flag is, but I know what Anti-Flag isn't.

Good.

[Jazzratt]

what are they?
Tosswanks (http://www.revleft.com/index.php?act=ST&f=10&t=65287)

[Sickle of Justice]

about them telling people to vote: awhile back they had this big campaign to try and "hijack the vote". the figured that if the religious right could take over the republicans, the radical left could take over the democrats. it didn't work at all, but it was an o.k. idea.z i really dont care for there new music, though i have "for blood and empire". it has maybe three good songs (wto kills farmers, depleted uranium, ummm, forget the other)... but they're old stuff RULES. especially die for the government. its basically are punk/hardcore record, and is filled with revolutionary stuff, though somewhat less intelectually backed. the newer stuff is waaay softer. though i gotta say, "Death of a Nation" is downright amazing. the video too, maybe the best punk vid ever made, though i havn't seen many.

basically the question with A-F is whether or not you beleive that "selling out", (as in compromising some values to gain a wider audience or more commercial success) can be justified if the message stays clear. a-f's to most recent albums lyric books are filled with essays, and links to organizations. mostly passifist and socialist/liberal, but clearly they arn't in it for the money (otherwise they'd write a song thats not political. i can't think of any since "new kind of army"

[Sickle of Justice]

[QUOTE]
Anyways about Anti-flag. I really can't figure out their political stance. On their dvd they have an interview of themselves. The interviewer asks what political parties they like. They say that they kind of like where the American Green Party is coming from. They don't really answer the question straight up though. When asked about violence they say that maybe sometimes it is ok. And they do lame commercials for peta. So I have no idea what their politics are but I like their music.

i think they aproach each issue individually. my friend was backstage with them and justin said something like "we all beleive in different systems, but mostly what we try and do as a band is expose the problems with this one."

i think andy flag was an anarchist. Justin Sane seems to be a council communist?... maybe...

its hard to tell whether or not they are revolutionary. i think they try to be, but are really uptight about alienating they're growing audience, so they have kinda quieted those beleifs down.

[Sickle of Justice]

AHA!!! HERES FRIGGIN PROOF THEY"RE GOOD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKSm-24P9tU

[Sickle of Justice]

i think #2 is whering an emma goldman shirt