dictators

[hoffer]

ho is the biggest dictator of al times ?hitler,stalin,batista,bush(senior) ,saddam,bush(junior) i think its hitler but bush (junior) is also a big asshole ho is the biggest dictator of the world please say it i won to now it ok

(Edited by hoffer at 5:47 pm on April 26, 2003)

[smoer]

BATISTA and BUSH JUNIOR AND SENIOR!

[Comrade Gorley]

Much as I hate them, both President Bush's are off the list because they were simply too simple to be considered dictators. Saddam, also, is a good candidate except Iraq itself isn't powerful enough for him to be a candidate for 'biggest dictator'. Likewise with Batista. I'll have to say Hitler as well because Stalin was more paranoid and "tightly wound" than maniacal, whereas Hitler was a calm, cold-blooded, calculating and callous criminal who premeditated all his heartless actions and killings. So the title goes to him.

[Invader Zim]

Quote: from smoer on 4:49 pm on April 26, 2003
BATISTA and BUSH JUNIOR AND SENIOR!


Do not be foolish, they are tossers but they do loosly follow democracy. (except batista i agree with him being on the list)

Stalin, by about 10,000,000 murdered people.

[chamo]

That is a bullshit number AK47 and you know it.

[smoer]

jeah ak47 big bullshit hes a republikan who doenst live hte law

[Umoja]

Regardless he killed lots of people, we should stop arguing straight numbers.

[Uhuru na Umoja]

Please, regardless of whether or not you like or agree with Stalin he was a dictator. You can argue about how many he killed, or how authoritarian he was, but there is no real doubt that he was a dictator. Indeed he is the most dictatorial leader I can think of.

[Saint-Just]

How do you mean 'biggest dictator'. Well Stalin is a dictator. He wasn't physically particularly big, but quite possibly bigger than the rest. Hitler was rather small, so is Bush really. But I think Mussolini's brutal figure really outshines the phyique of each one. I am positive there are a number of obese dictators too. Although to keep a good public image most leaders have tried to maintain a modest size.

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

Quote: from Umoja on 8:09 pm on April 26, 2003
Regardless he killed lots of people, we should stop arguing straight numbers.


He is right, what does it matter if it was 1 million or 10 million.

Those were living people killed by a paranoid maniak and are not just a number to be counted.

We must remember and honour those who tarted authoritian rule and sadly paid it with their lives.

[Ian]

Stalin was quite a short man, 5'3" or thereabouts... not that big by anyone's standards, he wore lifts often to counter that. So I would say Stalin would be the Smallest Dictator

[Comrade Gorley]

Quote: from Chairman Mao on 10:45 pm on April 26, 2003
How do you mean 'biggest dictator'. Well Stalin is a dictator. He wasn't physically particularly big, but quite possibly bigger than the rest. Hitler was rather small, so is Bush really. But I think Mussolini's brutal figure really outshines the phyique of each one. I am positive there are a number of obese dictators too. Although to keep a good public image most leaders have tried to maintain a modest size.


That's true, Bush and Hitler are rather short, although I think Stalin is a bit portly. And Mussolini would be the biggest dictator (in that sense) were it not for the "biggest" dictator of 'em all-

QUEEN ELIZABETH II. ;)

[hoffer]

i mean ho was the baddest ok

[Cassius Clay]

Probably Hitler or Saddam, in terms of personal power I would say Saddam. There's also Pol Pot, that Indonesian guy and plenty of African dictators. Don't forget Pinochet and other CIA stogges.

Where Stalin comes into this I don't know. Oh yeah your history book said he was a dictator. Suffice to say he wasn't a dictator, or 'Authoritarian' and didn't personally order the 'murder' of anyone.

[smoer]

wait stalin gived the order to kill his own man he was a monster!
by the way hoffer dont forget Chavez

[Invader Zim]

Quote: from happyguy on 7:59 pm on April 26, 2003
That is a bullshit number AK47 and you know it.


Really?

Then have a look at this (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat1.htm#Stalin) then.

[Cassius Clay]

AK47 do you actually take that link seriesly? Robert Conquest, LOL. Just where are all those '50 million' bodies?, I mean a team of independent scientists can find the remains of some 30,000 Elephant.

In 1917 Cossacks refused to fire on bread rioters durin a war, in 1991 elite Spetsnaz refused to fire on demonstrators outside parliament. Yet for Stalin the average soldier is prepared to engage in a huge genocide against their own people. Rightttttttttttttttttt.

[Nic8]

I guess it must all be a big right-wing conspiracy to make Stalin look bad, right? They must have special rooms under the White House where all the historians meet and make up lies about how Stalin was an evil, evil man who murdered millions of people, sure. Of cource, Stalin was the greatest Democrat in the world, he couldn't have had a cult of personality, must of had elections and couldn't have murdered any one because, well, he just couldn't have and the capitalist conspiracy made it up... In case you didn't notive, that was was sarcasm. Stalin was a fascist and it does not make sence to include both Bushs on the same list.

[Uhuru na Umoja]

I think Idi Amin is probably the biggest dictator I can think of. He had quite the appetite.

[Cassius Clay]

''I guess it must all be a big right-wing conspiracy to make Stalin look bad, right? They must have special rooms under the White House where all the historians meet and make up lies about how Stalin was an evil, evil man who murdered millions of people, sure.''

Did I say this? No but given the FACT Robert Conquest worked for the MI6 disinformation department which happened to be run by fanatical anti-communists I wouldn't dismiss it. Also the Reagen administration fully backed Ukrainain Nazi and Neo-Nazi orginisations to produce literature on the so called 'Famine' in the 1930's. So yeah perhaps what you said here is right. But I didn't say that did I? I have no doubt that alot of historians generally belief the crap they spew about Stalin.


''Of cource, Stalin was the greatest Democrat in the world,''

No Bill Clinton is the greatest 'Democrat' in all the world. Stalin was a Marxist-Leninist who set about building socialism.


''he couldn't have had a cult of personality,''

Yeah he did have a so called 'cult of personality' so does Mandela yet you don't accuse him of being a 'Fascist'. Note that Stalin fought against it and who built it up in the first place, Khrushcev and other traitors.


''must of had elections''

Yeah 'he' did, 47% of the governing offcials were replaced in elections in Leningrad in 1937, where over 90% of the population took part. In 1927 the party voted for Stalin by 724,000 votes to 6,000 for Trotsky.


''and couldn't have murdered any one because, well, he just couldn't have and the capitalist conspiracy made it up...''

Because he didn't have the power to 'murder' anyone. If he wen't up to the NKVD and demanded they kill someone not only would the NKVD laugh in his face they would probably arrest him. All executions had to be approved by the Supreme Soviet Court, as was the case in 1941 with a number of political prisoners in the Ukraine and Baltics.


''In case you didn't notive, that was was sarcasm.''

No kidding. The sad thing is that people on this board aren't being sarcastic when they in all seriousness claim that Stalin was a 'Fascist' or what have you.


''Stalin was a fascist and it does not make sence to include both Bushs on the same list.''

First of all he wasn't and second of all I think if you ask plenty of Iraqi familys they will say both Bush's deserve to be on the list.

[exploding toast]

BATISTA, and and although he might not be a dictator he still is a big asshole... that Kosovo guy...im sorry i forget his name

[synthesis]

The sad thing is that people on this board aren't being sarcastic when they in all seriousness claim that Stalin was a 'Fascist' or what have you.

Yeah, calling Stalin a fascist displays an astounding lack of knowledge about political systems, considering the economic systems of the two are totally different.

I think the word they're looking for is 'totalitarian.'

Worst dictator ever? All dictators are bad. Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini, Dubya, and Ceausescu - can't stand any of 'em.

Dubya is a dictator. The corporate mass media would like you to believe that the only wrongdoing in Florida was the miscount of perhaps a few hundred of the elderly's votes. Total lie.

The government in Florida, run of course by Bush's brother, intentionally threw out and/or discounted literally thousands of minority (mostly black) voters, since they were overwhelmingly Democratic.

Plus, Bush never fucking won the majority of votes anyways. 9/11 was a godsend for his popularity. Truly a Hobbesian scenario.

[Umoja]

Stop arguing over damn numbers. Would Stalin be any better if he killed 10,000 people? No. That's an entire village. He killed many people, that makes him un-good.

[Invader Zim]

Quote: from Cassius Clay on 12:04 pm on April 27, 2003
AK47 do you actually take that link seriesly? Robert Conquest, LOL. Just where are all those '50 million' bodies?, I mean a team of independent scientists can find the remains of some 30,000 Elephant.

In 1917 Cossacks refused to fire on bread rioters durin a war, in 1991 elite Spetsnaz refused to fire on demonstrators outside parliament. Yet for Stalin the average soldier is prepared to engage in a huge genocide against their own people. Rightttttttttttttttttt.



AK47 do you actually take that link seriesly? Robert Conquest, LOL.

Well it is very anti capitalistic if you actually bother to read it, which you have obviusly not. You will also see many sources. The author of the site appears to be very liberal and is not bias.

Just where are all those '50 million' bodies?,

They cant find many remains of the holacaust, certainly not nearly enough to justify the 6.6 million Jews, do you deny that as well?


'50 million' bodies?,

That includes the deaths of soldures during the war as well dont forget. That average figure takes into account the entire russian casualties of WW2.

[Cassius Clay]

''Well it is very anti capitalistic if you actually bother to read it, which you have obviusly not. You will also see many sources. The author of the site appears to be very liberal and is not bias.''

I couldn't care if it was, doesn't change the fact their spouting rubbish. And I wasn't aware the link was directed at me anyway. Nevermind I only read the part about Stalin and it was fanatically pro-Capitalist in it's approach in that which sais enough.


''They cant find many remains of the holacaust, certainly not nearly enough to justify the 6.6 million Jews, do you deny that as well?''

Are you denying the holocaust? The Nazis (insert German Capitalist companys) cannot deny anything there is plenty of evidence that the holocaust happened. Film and photographic evidence, thousands of eye-witness accounts from survivors and those who carried it out, Goebbels diarys, the Wallsea meeting chaired by Heydrich, population stats in 1939 and those in 1945, Hitler's speeches etc, etc, etc.


''That includes the deaths of soldures during the war as well dont forget. That average figure takes into account the entire russian casualties of WW2.''

No that site said (and yourself) that they were all murdered by Stalin. But I guess Stalin is also responsible for all those deaths aswell. Oh well ignorance is bliss.

[Invader Zim]

I couldn't care if it was, doesn't change the fact their spouting rubbish. And I wasn't aware the link was directed at me anyway. Nevermind I only read the part about Stalin and it was fanatically pro-Capitalist in it's approach in that which sais enough.

Well that statment catagorically proves you have not read the source. The person does not pull the figures out the air. He has taken the figures set down by Pro stalin people and antistalin people and worked out an average.

You can also see how it is by no means bias as it is equily critical of the USA and GB.

- USA (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#usa)

-UK (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#uk)

So your petty arguments of capitalist propagander are quite null and void. The author of the site is neutral, and is evidentaly only interested in facts, unlike you who is interested in dreams about stalin.

Are you denying the holocaust? The Nazis (insert German Capitalist companys) cannot deny anything there is plenty of evidence that the holocaust happened.

Of course im not denying the bloody holacaust, i was mearly pointing out that 6.6 million bodys have not been found, rather like how the bodys of Stalins atrocitys have not been found. Only a complete fool would deny either Stalins or Hitlers crimes against humanity.

Cassius stop believeing your fairy tales.


Oh well ignorance is bliss.

I would not know, but i am willing to take your word for that, as an esteamed expert.

(Edited by AK47 at 7:18 pm on April 29, 2003)

[hoffer]

that kosovo guy is milosovitch

[Cassius Clay]

Quote: from AK47 on 11:17 am on April 29, 2003
[Well that statment catagorically proves you have not read the source. The person does not pull the figures out the air. He has taken the figures set down by Pro stalin people and antistalin people and worked out an average.

You can also see how it is by no means bias as it is equily critical of the USA and GB.

- USA (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#usa)

-UK (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#uk)

So your petty arguments of capitalist propagander are quite null and void. The author of the site is neutral, and is evidentaly only interested in facts, unlike you who is interested in dreams about stalin.

Of course im not denying the bloody holacaust, i was mearly pointing out that 6.6 million bodys have not been found, rather like how the bodys of Stalins atrocitys have not been found. Only a complete fool would deny either Stalins or Hitlers crimes against humanity.

Cassius stop believeing your fairy tales.



LOL, why is it AK47 you don't respond to the whole post? Got news for you it isn't a maths game where you divide the average and come up with the mean or what have you. I'm sorry but your author is not interested in 'Facts' when he/she states ridiculious numbers like '50 million', I couldn't care what he says about the UK or U$A it is what he writes about Stalin that you pasted the link for and what this topic is about. On the Holocaust, I just told you plenty of evidnece of the top of my head about it, can anyone come up with the same regarding Stalin.

[Invader Zim]

Quote: from Cassius Clay on 5:50 pm on April 29, 2003

Quote: from AK47 on 11:17 am on April 29, 2003
[Well that statment catagorically proves you have not read the source. The person does not pull the figures out the air. He has taken the figures set down by Pro stalin people and antistalin people and worked out an average.

You can also see how it is by no means bias as it is equily critical of the USA and GB.

- USA (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#usa)

-UK (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#uk)

So your petty arguments of capitalist propagander are quite null and void. The author of the site is neutral, and is evidentaly only interested in facts, unlike you who is interested in dreams about stalin.

Of course im not denying the bloody holacaust, i was mearly pointing out that 6.6 million bodys have not been found, rather like how the bodys of Stalins atrocitys have not been found. Only a complete fool would deny either Stalins or Hitlers crimes against humanity.

Cassius stop believeing your fairy tales.



LOL, why is it AK47 you don't respond to the whole post? Got news for you it isn't a maths game where you divide the average and come up with the mean or what have you. I'm sorry but your author is not interested in 'Facts' when he/she states ridiculious numbers like '50 million', I couldn't care what he says about the UK or U$A it is what he writes about Stalin that you pasted the link for and what this topic is about. On the Holocaust, I just told you plenty of evidnece of the top of my head about it, can anyone come up with the same regarding Stalin.

On the Holocaust, I just told you plenty of evidnece of the top of my head about it, can anyone come up with the same regarding Stalin.

Ohh yes i can actually. Eye witness accounts, photographs, escapee's, exciles.

This is a rather good site of pictures that not even you can dispute. source (http://www.okay.com/dunc/gulag.htm)

Painful as it is LL found it, but a source is a source.


LOL, why is it AK47 you don't respond to the whole post?

Im sorry, i will however fix that with a small edit.



(Edited by AK47 at 7:22 pm on April 29, 2003)


(Edited by AK47 at 7:25 pm on April 29, 2003)

[Cassius Clay]

AK47 I responded to those pictures in another thread about a month ago. It's in the 'Opposing Ideologies' forum with the thread being entitled something along the lines of 'Gulag Workers rights' or something, it was started by Chaik47. It should be on page 7 or 8. If your that bothered to see my response go there. But I can't really be bothered to respond again when I have neither the time or the energy, right now atleast. See yeah.

[damn the capitalism]

If we look by the number of peoples killed,i think that this prove the severity and the dictatorian of a regime, so we would say Stalin, ,we must remember that over 1 million kullak had been killed during the transition from the NEP to the 1st five year plan! The what is called moscow condemnation in 1936 prove his bloodiest regime and he was affraid to lose his power ,so he killed all that doubt them ,and many of them was one day they helped him! i'm only talking about the peoples killed and the severity of his regime,so i'm not talking about another thing!
Hitler was the same case ,he can see this from the number of communists ,serbs, jewish, even germans,and who opposed his regime!
Pol pot was the same thing ,killing 25% to 35% by his stupid agriculture regime is something stupid and prove his dictatorian way!
If we looked about the numbers of peoples killed so it would be stalin,hitler,pol pot,sadam, idi amin, anyone else ,even mao!
But i think that we are talking about a dictator's regime in leading a country, so i think that hitler and mussulini along with many communist leaders who was forced to do so!

[hoffer]

victor89 sad that he let people dans naked at a temperture of -30celcius

[Invader Zim]

Quote: from Cassius Clay on 9:49 am on April 30, 2003
AK47 I responded to those pictures in another thread about a month ago. It's in the 'Opposing Ideologies' forum with the thread being entitled something along the lines of 'Gulag Workers rights' or something, it was started by Chaik47. It should be on page 7 or 8. If your that bothered to see my response go there. But I can't really be bothered to respond again when I have neither the time or the energy, right now atleast. See yeah.


Care to post a link or repost it? Because i cant find the thread.