NIKITA SERGEYEVICH KHRUSHCHEV - i love this guy,... [Archive]

Anonymous

12th March 2003, 21:52

what you think about this former chairman of CCCP?
i think he was probably the funiest, most honest and peace loving statesman ever...

"Fish in Water. Nikita Khrushchev was not a student of Marxist theory. As peasant and sometime miner, he did not finish elementary school, did not begin serious reading until he entered an adult training class at the age of 27. Unlike Malenkov or Molotov, doctrinaire intellectual theoreticians, Khrushchev learned his Communism not out of a book but by contact. Alone among Stalin's lieutenants, he lived and spoke as a man who moves in Communism as a fish in water, oblivious of dialectical debate or moral pang. Drunk or sober, he never seemed to worry about what he said, who was listening, how it might diverge from the current line. A man in motion, he had the air of a man who never looked nervously back over his shoulder in his life. "

http://www.top-education.com/Speeches/Nikita.htm

Larissa

12th March 2003, 22:10

Dunno really what to think about him. He was ousted by Brezhnev and some Bolsheviks considered him a traitor to what Lenin and Stalin had built through the revolution. (Actually they referred to Khrushchev as a revisionist)

However, Khrushchev managed to avoid a very important war with the US (Missile crisis) and gave some freedom to countries that were part of the USSR and Stalin had oppressed for many years.

Political Suicide

12th March 2003, 22:34

#Moderation Mode

This has been moved to History.

Moved here (http://www.che-lives.com/cgi/community/topic.pl?forum=26&topic=262)

Kapitan Andrey

13th March 2003, 06:06

My opinion about him is, that he was the greatest communist leader!!! He has dispelled the cult of stalin!!! He helped the Cuba in the Coribean crisis!!! I hate Brejnev!!!

Do you remember his words on UN to yankee and to other yankee's allies :" I'll show (all of) you kuzya's mother!!! "

>To show kuzya's mother< means that, THAT man whom did you said that will get sirious troubles!!! ;)

chamo

13th March 2003, 18:02

I think Nikita Khrushchev did well to be taking over from the mess that Stalin left and his revisionism did well and his work with the solidarity movement, giving countries their independance, was quite a good move, as well as avoiding war during the ol' missile crisis.

Brezhnev was just a corrupt wanker. I am quite amused by the old Soviet joke when he showed his mother around her new country manision. She is alledged to have said, "It's beautiful, but what if the Communists come back into power?"

Saint-Just

13th March 2003, 22:11

Quote: from the anarchist on 9:52 pm on Mar. 12, 2003
what you think about this former chairman of CCCP?
i think he was probably the funiest, most honest and peace loving statesman ever...

"Fish in Water. Nikita Khrushchev was not a student of Marxist theory. As peasant and sometime miner, he did not finish elementary school, did not begin serious reading until he entered an adult training class at the age of 27. Unlike Malenkov or Molotov, doctrinaire intellectual theoreticians, Khrushchev learned his Communism not out of a book but by contact. Alone among Stalin's lieutenants, he lived and spoke as a man who moves in Communism as a fish in water, oblivious of dialectical debate or moral pang. Drunk or sober, he never seemed to worry about what he said, who was listening, how it might diverge from the current line. A man in motion, he had the air of a man who never looked nervously back over his shoulder in his life. "

http://www.top-education.com/Speeches/Nikita.htm

Sergei Khrushchev was given U.S. citizenship last year; a reward for his father's treachery against socialism.

Anonymous

13th March 2003, 22:16

thats a joke right chairmanmao?

becuase i honestly dont see where did he betraed socialism...

he may not have been the best leader because sometimes his waky theorys lead russia to some financial problems, but he never sold our the cause..

Just Joe

14th March 2003, 01:43

dude, Khrushchev wasn't much better than the man he followed into office. he didn't really do much to rid the USSR of bureacracy and the fact that he did not bring democracy into the country only layed the foundations for the lack of ideas and stagnation they later experienced.

redstar2000

14th March 2003, 01:43

It seems unlikely that Fidel will ever forgive Khrushchev for taking the missiles out of Cuba...and it's hard to blame him.

On a more serious note, Khrushchev certainly began the process of the restoration of capitalism in the USSR. How? It was his government that came up with the idea that individual factory managers should be "responsibile" for "their" factory's profitability.

If you are a factory manager with this kind of individual responsibility, how long does it take for you to start thinking of the place as "your factory"? And if you have to be "on the hook", why "shouldn't" you own it?

It shouldn't surprise anyone that the people who own Russia now came from the ranks of managers that were first created under Khrushchev.

Likewise, the Soviet military intervention in Hungary in 1956 was a terrible blow to the prestige of communism...and probably totally unnecessary.

I wonder if ultimately the Khrushchev period will not be known, at least in more irreverent circles, as "the revenge of the peasantry".

:cool:

CopperGoat

14th March 2003, 04:19

Hey, I was wondering, you part of his name is "molotov". So, did he invent the Molotov Cocktail? If that is true, then this guy is cool.

Revolution Hero

14th March 2003, 08:37

Chairman Mao, do you know that Stalin's grandson is about to recieve US citizenship?

InnocentCivilian

15th March 2003, 18:42

my dad is reasonably right wing and i was talking to him the other day and he spoke very positviely about Khrushchev. stating that he made the living standard better for the people and that he cleared up after Stalin. it wasn't my opinion but i don't really know much about Khrushchev, however i think he was definetly a man with the interests of the people in his mind rather than himself....however, like i said i don't really know much about him

Geddan

15th March 2003, 20:54

I don't really care about the leaders of the past anymore, you can't create socialism by looking back. It sure could help, but the key is looking forward.

redstar2000

16th March 2003, 02:47

There's a new biography of Khrushchev out now. It doesn't look all that good to me, but here's a review if you're interested...

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/16/books/re...w/016PRONT.html (http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/16/books/review/016PRONT.html)

:cool:

PS: If that link doesn't work, trying going to nytimes.com for March 16 and checking books.

(Edited by redstar2000 at 10:28 pm on Mar. 15, 2003)

pastradamus

16th March 2003, 03:05

Khrushchev is A fucking cool guy!

I love his public speeches.

"what kind of comminism is it that has no sausage?"

Kapitan Andrey

16th March 2003, 05:54

pastradamus...

>"what kind of comminism is it that has no sausage?"<
Hey, this isn't his words! :angry:

redstar2000....As for me, I don't trust any foreign sites about OUR leaders,heroes or events!!!

man in the red suit

16th March 2003, 23:13

Kruschev was a very important reformer but he was also a very flawed man. he came up with some very outrageous economic plans which were doomed to failure. I believe there was such a plan in which he tried to create collective farms in Siberia. he also had a tantrum when the U.S. security wouldn't let him into Disneyland one time. This was told to me by my english teacher although I am not sure as to how credible it is. I do know from a biography I read on him that he followed Marx's words when it came to education. He wanted to combine education with production which he did. He made it so that students would learn how to work in school. this had beneficial and negative consequences. Students would be able to make a more facilitive transition into the work environment than students in capitalist countries however some argue that these students were deprived of the information and school experiences they could have used to become something else other than a blue-collar factory worker. Kruschev, in my opinion, made some very important political reforms which were extremely beneficial to Soviet Citizens but on the other hand, he did a number of things that really didn't make any sense.

Anonymous

17th March 2003, 23:45

and that was the beauty of him...:

Pigs & Sandhogs. Few would have picked Khrushchev as Joseph Stalin's heir. This was the muzhik from Kalinovka whom Stalin commanded to dance the gopak, the hayseed at whom Beria sneered years ago as "our beloved chicken statesman," "our potato politician." When Stalin put Nikita in charge of the Moscow party back in the '30s, Khrushchev used to don navies' rough clothes, crawl down to visit the sandhogs tunneling out the new subway, take a hand with a pneumatic drill, and talk with the lads in the unprintable language for which, even in the Kremlin, he is famous. The palace courtiers dubbed him "Comrade Lavatory Lover" because Nikita not only insisted on equipping the Moscow metro with the world's best subway toilets, but often broke in rudely on conference speakers: "All right, all right, comrade, you have achieved this and that, but what about lavatories in your factory? How many lavatories? What is their cultural state?"

Kapitan Andrey

18th March 2003, 03:53

the anarchist...
I don't like your last post! This is true...but...I don't like it!!!

Revolution Hero

18th March 2003, 09:21

Khruschev was typical hypocrite. He had been pro- Stalin during Stalin, he became anti- Stalin after Stalin’s death. Stalin’s cult of personality was basically Khruschev’s invention, this was not something which had really taken place. His strategy was clear- to criticize the past leader in order to become present leader.

Socialsmo o Muerte

18th March 2003, 20:55

Quote: from CopperGoat on 4:19 am on Mar. 14, 2003
Hey, I was wondering, you part of his name is "molotov". So, did he invent the Molotov Cocktail? If that is true, then this guy is cool.

The Molotov Cocktail was named after Cold War Commissar of Foreign Affairs Viacheslav Molotov. I'm unsure what the link to the weapon actually is though if one exists.

Kapitan Andrey

19th March 2003, 01:37

Revolution Hero...bullshit!!!

Khruschev was only sceared of sTalin...because he might be easily repressed(killed)!!!
And when sTalin died, there were no one to afraid of!So Khruschev wanted to revenge sTalin for years of fear to die!!!

timbaly

19th March 2003, 01:54

Quote: from Socialsmo o Muerte on 3:55 pm on Mar. 19, 2003

Quote: from CopperGoat on 4:19 am on Mar. 14, 2003
Hey, I was wondering, you part of his name is "molotov". So, did he invent the Molotov Cocktail? If that is true, then this guy is cool.

The Molotov Cocktail was named after Cold War Commissar of Foreign Affairs Viacheslav Molotov. I'm unsure what the link to the weapon actually is though if one exists.

The molotov cocktail was given it's name by the finnish army during one of their wars with Russia during WWII. they names it after Molotov because they believed the war was much of his fault.

CopperGoat

19th March 2003, 01:58

How was WW2 this guy's fault?

Revolution Hero

19th March 2003, 09:24

Quote: from Kapitan Andrey on 1:37 am on Mar. 19, 2003
Revolution Hero...bullshit!!!

Khruschev was only sceared of sTalin...because he might be easily repressed(killed)!!!
And when sTalin died, there were no one to afraid of!So Khruschev wanted to revenge sTalin for years of fear to die!!!

Ha!
It is ridiculous how you talk about a man whom you didn't even know personally. I don't know if Khruschev was afraid of Stalin or not, but the fact that Khruschev praised Stalin before Stalin's death was apparent.
Stalin's granddaughter said that 20th Congress had been extremely insincere comedy played by khruschev.
NO DOUBT THAT khruschev was HYPOCRITE!

Kapitan Andrey

20th March 2003, 02:39

May be he was a hypocrite...but this is because of "fear to die"!!!

>It is ridiculous how you talk about a man whom you didn't even know personally<
[sarcazm] Ha-ha-ha!!! You want to tell me, that you knew him personally!? Or you even Russian!!! I don't belive you!!!

man in the red suit

20th March 2003, 02:58

Quote: from Revolution Hero on 9:21 am on Mar. 18, 2003
Khruschev was typical hypocrite. He had been pro- Stalin during Stalin, he became anti- Stalin after Stalin’s death. Stalin’s cult of personality was basically Khruschev’s invention, this was not something which had really taken place. His strategy was clear- to criticize the past leader in order to become present leader.

well if you have a choice of being pro-stalin or being shot, I would most likely choose pro-stalin whether I agree with it or not. Kruschev was an anti-stalinist but when there are a ridiculous amount of party purges going on around you by a crazed paranoid lunatic, your best bet is to commense with the brown nosing.

Revolution Hero

23rd March 2003, 08:42

Quote: from man in the red suit on 12:58 pm on Mar. 20, 2003

Quote: from Revolution Hero on 9:21 am on Mar. 18, 2003
Khruschev was typical hypocrite. He had been pro- Stalin during Stalin, he became anti- Stalin after Stalin’s death. Stalin’s cult of personality was basically Khruschev’s invention, this was not something which had really taken place. His strategy was clear- to criticize the past leader in order to become present leader.

well if you have a choice of being pro-stalin or being shot, I would most likely choose pro-stalin whether I agree with it or not. Kruschev was an anti-stalinist but when there are a ridiculous amount of party purges going on around you by a crazed paranoid lunatic, your best bet is to commense with the brown nosing.

Another hypocrite!

Saint-Just

23rd March 2003, 15:30

Quote: from Revolution Hero on 8:37 am on Mar. 14, 2003
Chairman Mao, do you know that Stalin's grandson is about to recieve US citizenship?

What?! why.... strange....

Saint-Just

23rd March 2003, 15:44

Quote: from the anarchist on 10:16 pm on Mar. 13, 2003
thats a joke right chairmanmao?

becuase i honestly dont see where did he betraed socialism...

he may not have been the best leader because sometimes his waky theorys lead russia to some financial problems, but he never sold our the cause..

Khrushchev said the USSR was a 'state of the whole people', what that means is that it was a state of all classes. He talked of 'peaceful transition' and so forth, this means he rejected the transition through class struggle, he rejected the method of the dictatorship of the proletariat.

Stalin did indeed say that class antagonisms had ended after collectivisation. However, he continued with the dictatorship of the proletariat so the bourgeois may not rise again, however he was proven wrong as it inevitable did.

Cassius Clay

23rd March 2003, 16:53

Man in the Red Suite and Kapitan Andrey you seem to think Khruschev would of been shot simply for disagreeing with Stalin. Rubbish. Khruschev had been a member of the Trotskyite oppostion, Stalin knew about this and guess what he didn't give a dam.

Perhaps Nikita deserved a bullet in the back of the head for all his later crimes but that's a matter of opinion.

Xvall

23rd March 2003, 21:33

Seeing as none of your lived during the Stalin/Kruschev era, and that the only thing that you know about any of these two individuals is from your pro/anti Stalin/Kruschev sources; I will take none of this seriously.

Revolution Hero

27th March 2003, 09:53

Quote: from Chairman Mao on 1:30 am on Mar. 24, 2003

Quote: from Revolution Hero on 8:37 am on Mar. 14, 2003
Chairman Mao, do you know that Stalin's grandson is about to recieve US citizenship?

What?! why.... strange....

Yes, he lives in Georgia and argues that he can't live with such surname (Djugashvili) as people don't treat him good enough...
This is lie, people of Georgia respect Stalin...Stalin's grandson just want to move to US for his personal pragmatic reasons.

Saint-Just

28th March 2003, 21:59

Quote: from Revolution Hero on 9:53 am on Mar. 27, 2003

Quote: from Chairman Mao on 1:30 am on Mar. 24, 2003

Quote: from Revolution Hero on 8:37 am on Mar. 14, 2003
Chairman Mao, do you know that Stalin's grandson is about to recieve US citizenship?

What?! why.... strange....

Yes, he lives in Georgia and argues that he can't live with such surname (Djugashvili) as people don't treat him good enough...
This is lie, people of Georgia respect Stalin...Stalin's grandson just want to move to US for his personal pragmatic reasons.

Interesting, I see. Strange that the grandson of Stalin lives in America.

damn the capitalism

28th March 2003, 23:00

hi everybody ,of course i wasn't born yet in the years of khruchev,but from the knowledge and from what i read, i think that khrushev wasn't that selfish man and he wasn't searching for his own glory as stalin,so at least he disn't killed that enormous number of stalin,he loved his people ,he loved the freedom of the nations ,i don't think and agree taht he is revisionist ,because the time is passing and it's not wrong to develop and moderenize our brain ,the the state of communism in the days of lenin and trotsky is not the same as the days of khrushev, as the days of the troika(kussigen,brejnev,bodgorni) !if we consider him as a revisionist so we must consider lenin a revisionist too because of the economic policy of the NEP ,so according to the nep back in 1921 he was forced to bring french ,amercians and germans specialists to russia to develop his country and to develop the industry and the lands that because that his people protest against him!so i don't consider what lenin did was wrong ,he was foeced to do so for the success of the communist revolution ,if he didn't do so ,maybe they would fell too early in the 20's !so khruchev was forced to pretend to be pro stalin ,to prevent himself of dying! and what he did in 20th congress ,was for the love of his russian people ,and from his hate of stalin dictator regime, of course there's a kind of propaganda for himself ,but he did this because he felt the pity for his people during the stalin days! of course a person like Mao tse tong consider him as a revisionist 'cause his policy was the same as stalin ,so when khruchev accuse stalin,mao felt that he is accusing him !for cuba missle case ,i think that khruchev didn't want te third war word to begin!
finally his only fault was due to his economin policy!

Revolution Hero

29th March 2003, 00:10

Chairman Mao, he doesn’t live in u.s.a. yet, but he is going to move there. When I said that he lived in Georgia, I meant the republic of Georgia- the motherland of Stalin, that was why I said that the man with Stalin’s surname can’t be discriminated there.
Well, do you know that Stalin’s daughter Svetlana Alilueva moved from USSR abroad (I don’t know what country she moved exactly in)?

Just Joe

29th March 2003, 00:16

didn't she defect, then defect back?

ah the good old days of the Cold War.

Reuben

29th March 2003, 00:45

When Kruschev was in Britain on a an official state visit he was taken to a factorty where he wlked off the red carpet layed out for him to go and talk o the workers about their conditions

Larissa

29th March 2003, 01:32

Quote: from Reuben on 9:45 pm on Mar. 28, 2003
When Kruschev was in Britain on a an official state visit he was taken to a factorty where he wlked off the red carpet layed out for him to go and talk o the workers about their conditionsWell, ok, but I don't think NK worked as a volunteer in a factory on Sundays like Che did.

man in the red suit

29th March 2003, 07:02

Quote: from Cassius Clay on 4:53 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Man in the Red Suite and Kapitan Andrey you seem to think Khruschev would of been shot simply for disagreeing with Stalin. Rubbish. Khruschev had been a member of the Trotskyite oppostion, Stalin knew about this and guess what he didn't give a dam.

uh yeah as we discussed before.......Khruschev pulled off the brown nosing. That is what saved his ass. Even if he was truly loyal to Stalin and wanted to praise him, who is going to tell the difference. If I wanted to convince you that I was your humble servant, I could very well do so without you suspecting a thing.

Cassius Clay

29th March 2003, 10:15

Man In The Red Suit, what you fail to understand is that Khruschev could of said Stalin was all the stuff he said in 1956 while Stalin was alive. It wouldn't of suddenly mean't Khruschev would be killed, or even arrested.

Anyway Khruschev was a traitor and criminall. The man released Nazi war criminalls, unleashed a mafia style terror, banned democracy in the party, took the first steps of reintroducing Capitalism and was largely responsible for the split in the Communist movement worldwide.

RH, I thought Stalin's grandson was now leading the new CPSU with Victor Anpilov which is a uniting left-wing movements throughout the former Soviet Union.

Revolution Hero

29th March 2003, 16:40

That what he did last year…You know Cassius, I saw an interview with him right on the 5th of March and he said about intention to get out from Georgia himself. Those were surprise news received during the anniversary of his grandfather’s death…very upsetting news...

Revolution Hero

29th March 2003, 16:46

That what he did last year…You know, Cassius, I saw an interview with him right on the 5th of March and he said about intention to get out from Georgia himself. Those were surprise news received during the anniversary of his grandfather’s death…very upsetting news...

Cassius Clay

29th March 2003, 17:13

Well I'll be dammed, that is a shame.

Anyway RH what is your opinion on the CPSU and Anpilov? I think they've also united with Oleg Shenin and his party which holds some power in the Duma.

man in the red suit

29th March 2003, 20:39

Quote: from Cassius Clay on 10:15 am on Mar. 29, 2003
Man In The Red Suit, what you fail to understand is that Khruschev could of said Stalin was all the stuff he said in 1956 while Stalin was alive. It wouldn't of suddenly mean't Khruschev would be killed, or even arrested.

yes it would. It's as simple as that. and Stalin died in 1953 so he couldn't of been alive in 1956 you see. :)

Cassius Clay

30th March 2003, 12:06

Erm no it wouldn't. In the 30's Stalin was forced to apologise to a group of party members whom he had been rude to, Zhadov said he disagreed with the policy of Soviet-German relations in the late 30's and there were plays ridiculing the purges. Not to mention the politburo voted against Stalin on various policies sometimes.

What do you honestly think would of happened if Stalin had wen't up to the NKVD and demanded they arrest Khruschev because Khruschev had called Stalin all soughts of monstrourous names? The NKVD would laugh in Stalin's face.

damn the capitalism

30th March 2003, 16:03

Cassius Clay

30th March 2003, 17:30

Damn the Capitalism.

Khruschev was not forced to be 'Pro-Stalin' he had been a member of the Trotskyite opposition in the 20's and there wasn't anything Stalin could of done about that. And even if there was he didn't did he?

I still fail to see what there is to admire about Khruschev the man gained power through a military coup.

damn the capitalism

30th March 2003, 19:09

yes ,it's true that khruchev used to be against trotsky,but this was to win the side of stalin,if he didn't maybe he would be killed ,so i think that he got his excuse to pretend to be pro stalin.
when we are talking about a peson we should think and say his positive things and job! so briefly ,he liked his country and he wasn't selfish ,that 1 of many good things that have been done to his country!

man in the red suit

30th March 2003, 20:45

What do you honestly think would of happened if Stalin had wen't up to the NKVD and demanded they arrest Khruschev because Khruschev had called Stalin all soughts of monstrourous names? The NKVD would laugh in Stalin's face.

who are the NKVD?

ans who said anything about name calling. Stalin could of twisted it into what ever stupid excuse he could imagine. he could very well just tell the KGB that Khruxchev was a threat to socialism and the construction of a communist society or something of that nature.

(Edited by man in the red suit at 9:47 pm on Mar. 30, 2003)

Revolution Hero

31st March 2003, 08:19

Anpilov has to unite with KPRF and he will do it, as Duma is about to pass the law about political parties, which sets the minimum number of party members for all parties. Anpilov's party is not numerous so he would have only one choice.
This would be good for Anpilov and KPRF as well. Anpilov is a good Marxist and KPRF lacks good Marxists.
There is possibility that in the case of effective Anpilov's influence KPRF would become trully revolutionary party.

Cassius Clay

31st March 2003, 18:11

Man In Red Suit, NKVD were earlier KGB. Anyway I see that I'm not going to convince you so I'll leave at that.

RH, that is actually great news that Anpilov is joining with KPRF. I've read some of his articles and he is a genuine Marxist without a doubt. I gather he wrote a book in prison (where Yelstin's Fascist thugs put him in 1993) do you have any info on that.

Revolution Hero

1st April 2003, 09:08

No, Cassius, unfortunately I don't have any information about this. But I'll try to search for it on some russian sites...
btw, do you have Prompt translator?

Revolution Hero

2nd April 2003, 08:36

Comrade Cassius, I found this book by Anpilov, it is called "Our Struggle", but I am not sure if it was written by Anpilov in jail.
Here is the link http://www.anpilov.com/anpilov.php?action=...=kniga&id=index (http://www.anpilov.com/anpilov.php?action=kniga&id=index)
It is in russian, but if you have translator program then you can easily read it.

I asked on one forum about the book you mentioned, so you'll have the information about it soon.