What is "Scandinavian Socialism"

[Entrails Konfetti]

I haven't googled the subject, but I wikied it, and it doesn't come up.

Please answer of these questions if you can:

How are the institutions set up?

In what ways are the workers represented or supposed to be represented?

What are the governmental bodies (legislative, executive, judicial ect)?

What are the term limits for representatives?

How does the economy run?

Do the workers decide what goes in with the means of production?

[LoneRed]

this "scandinavian socialism" is merely a use of the wrong words, the Laissez-faire capitalists as well as other people of opposing ideologies, term Welfare-States European socialism, or the term you used to hurt the name of socialism, as In those countries taxes are quite high, businesses leave them for safer places of trade, and there are a substantiallly more amount of "human rights" and healthcare, most of these countries have nationalized healthcare.

[Entrails Konfetti]

I googled it and got nothing except report by neo-liberal newspapers about how its heavy taxation is bad and that they should follow Irelands example of cutting taxes so that it creates more jobs (although there isn't a description on the quality of these jobs).

I also read a Belguim article saying everything is fine because the public schools offer good education.

How very informative :rolleyes: !

No mainstream really talks about how anything works, it's all *****ing about taxes.
A country could be a dictatorship but allow private sectors to move freely and they'd be praised by neo-liberal press.

Most Neo-liberals dont understand that some countries don't look at taxes as such a burden (that all depends who gets taxed though).

[Tommie]

The Scandinavian countries have developed the most advanced form of social democracy on the planet. I often hold Hugo Chavez and Venezuela as examples for the rest of the Third World to follow so that they can achieve social justice, fight poverty and remove themselves from the yoke of imperialism. Just as I hold Bolivarianism as an example to be followed by the Third World I hold the Scandinavian countries as the example for the First World.

Generally speaking Denmark, Norway, Sweden and Finland have all charted their own independent socio-economic course over the past fifty years. They have mixed economics, national public healthcare, education and extensive welfare states. Unionization rates are high and workers have a lot of input economically. Scandinavia also sets the bar high when it comes to ecological sustainability.

[Entrails Konfetti]

Originally posted by [email protected] 13 2006, 03:27 AM
this "scandinavian socialism" is merely a use of the wrong words, the Laissez-faire capitalists as well as other people of opposing ideologies, term Welfare-States European socialism, or the term you used to hurt the name of socialism, as In those countries taxes are quite high, businesses leave them for safer places of trade, and there are a substantiallly more amount of "human rights" and healthcare, most of these countries have nationalized healthcare.
Pardon my misuse of the term "socialism"-- most people think it just means tight government regulations and taxation on the market, and nationalized health care. Besides that "socialism" is a broad term ( and I fear an entrance by Mr.White giving us his definitions on Socialism, Communism, Anarchism ect.)

All I've heard really about these Scandinavian countries or I think Belguim is that they tax individuals and consumption, but not corporations-- and all this tax goes to the nationalized healthcare programs.

[Severian]

Exactly. It's capitalism with some nationalized industries and an unusually high social wage, aka "social welfare programs".

Also: it's largely a thing of the past.

Sweden, held up as theworld model of "social-democracy", has in fact been dismantling its social programs, setting up all kinds of limits and barriers to using 'em, etc. Plus the privatizations and so forth. Much of this has been done by the Swedish Social-Democratic Party.

The ruling class can less and less afford this kind of so-called socialism. They have to raise their profit rates by attacking working people's past economic gains.

Some articles with details on the gradual demise of the "Swedish model":
From 1995, the beginning of the end (http://www.themilitant.com/1995/5918/5918_15.html)
2004: further attacks (http://www.themilitant.com/2004/6812/681250.html)
[url=http://www.themilitant.com/2004/6822/682237.html]A glimpse of 'Swedish socialism': unpaid labor is 'practical education'.

[Dooga Aetrus Blackrazor]

It's difficult to say whether Scandinavian social democracy will survive. I am a supporter of world revolution, and I don't see it surviving. Capitalist interests have more economic and political power than social democratic nations. Social democracies can only progress as far as they are aloud to by those with capitalist interests. In fact, it may serve the interests of the capitalists to allow social democracy to survive in certain areas. That way the left would think there is a viable alternative to revolution.

Still, I will admit that (even though I support revolution) I haven't been fully convinced that reformism will be unsuccessful. However, I have been indoctrinated or 18 years so...

[LoneRed]

EK, I didnt know if you took what i said as an insult, as when i was talking about the word "socialism", i wasnt meaning you, persay, but i was mostly talking about how they coined it to "make an example" of those countries

[The Feral Underclass]

Denmark still maintains one of the highest taxation rates with a standard income tax of 51%.

Also Scandanavia has one of the highest suicides rate. The unfiformed, clean and tidyness makes everyone want to kill themselves.

[LuXe]

Me beeing from Norway I can confirm the fact that this country is extremely good to live in. (rated as the best country to live in, and the government are quite proud of that. Although the rich have it better and they are a part of the "average" calculation)

We have health care given by the government. Free hospitals, schools etc. So that is quite good.

"Do the workers decide what goes in with the means of production?"

No.

"In what ways are the workers represented or supposed to be represented?"

All workers have unions, I belive.

The rest I dont know, and will leave for NWOG and Norwegian commie :)

[Tommie]

Originally posted by The Anarchist [email protected] 13 2006, 07:54 AM
Also Scandanavia has one of the highest suicides rate. The unfiformed, clean and tidyness makes everyone want to kill themselves.
God forbid. :rolleyes:

[The Feral Underclass]

God forbid what?

[Tommie]

That the Nordic countries are clean, pretty and naturally beautiful.

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2006, 01:18 AM
That the Nordic countries are clean, pretty and naturally beautiful.
I dont understand why you said "god forbid" to me?

[Janus]

I think that may actually just be a myth.


There is a common belief, especially in the US, that Sweden has a higher rate of suicide than other countries; this is actually a myth, as Sweden has an average suicide rate. The myth was probably started because the secular government of Sweden started to measure suicide statistics openly before other countries did. President Eisenhower saw this as a chance to promote his political ideology, and maintained that the statistics showed Sweden was the country of "free love, high taxes and suicide" (none of this was particularly true at the time). Also, the dark, relatively cold climate of Sweden in the winter has added fuel to this myth. (see "Suicide and Season" below).
Suicide rates (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_rates)

[OneBrickOneVoice]

I prefer Scandanavian economics to Western economics, however it's really just Democratic socialism or social democracy. More of a social democracy.

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2006, 02:28 AM
I prefer Scandanavian economics to Western economics
What's the difference?

[Tommie]

It is quite different. The fact that the market is heavily regulated, much industry is under public ownership and wealth is redistributed in a progressive manner.

[LuXe]

tsk stk...

Bullshit. We dont kill ourselves because the nature is pretty and all. A kid at my school hung himself up in the woods north of my school, but because he was addicted to drugs. Another lady also shot herself in a restroom in a mall here. (Drug debt ftw)

We kill ourselves because of those things. No I dont do drugs, therefore I am not in that envoirment. Our nature is just pure beauty, and I dont see any reason to kill myself because of that :D

http://www.adventureliving.com/journeys/norway/images/large/norway081.jpg

I can walk five minutes from my house and see something like this. I love it.

http://www.anders.com/pictures/public/04-views/09%20-%20Trondheim%20Park%20-%20Norway.jpg

This is if you walk on LONG trips. The mountain is very nice. :D

[Tommie]

Beautiful. It is like a mystic version of my home, British Columbia.

[LuXe]

The best is when you pitch a tent out there in the night. It is pitch dark, you cant see a thing. :)

And in the morning there is the fresh smell and the morning haze :D can it get more wonderful?

[Tommie]

Doubtful.

[OneBrickOneVoice]

Originally posted by The Anarchist Tension+Sep 14 2006, 01:38 AM--> (The Anarchist Tension @ Sep 14 2006, 01:38 AM)
[email protected] 14 2006, 02:28 AM
I prefer Scandanavian economics to Western economics
What's the difference? [/b]
better worker's rights, more social programs, less of a class difference than the US.