Che's Grandson: Fidel's An "Aged Tyrant"

[Tanya]

“The Cuban Revolution died some years ago: it had to be killed off by those who act in its name to make sure it didn’t turn against them; it was institutionalized and smothered by its own bureaucracy, by corruption, nepotism and the rigidity of the much-celebrated Cuban ‘revolutionary’ state.”

Canek Sanchez Guevara



http://www.lacasaazul.org/Canek_Che_Guevara.html

http://www.centroargentino.org/publicaciones.asp?id=7


''me aburre ser el Nieto del Che; me gusta más ser canek (así, con minúsculas).''
http://canf.org/2005/1es/ensayos/2005-ago-...er-el-nieto.htm (http://canf.org/2005/1es/ensayos/2005-ago-02-me-aburre-ser-el-nieto.htm)


Caneck's blog:
http://diariosinmotocicleta.blogspot.com/2...ta_archive.html (http://diariosinmotocicleta.blogspot.com/2005_12_01_diariosinmotocicleta_archive.html)


[email protected]

[Rawthentic]

I have heard about him, he has some very interesting and concrete things to say.

I think that today, it is important to ask, "What would Che Guevara think about Cuban society and how it is run?" This is not to say that he is the ultimate in authority, but he was a mastermind behind the making.

[Red October]

do you have a link to any english articles about this? i cant read spanish.

[Jesus Christ!]

I don't think being someone's grandson should give you any more authority than anyone else.

[Red October]

true, but its still interesting that che's grandson is so opposed to fidel.

[metalero]

so? Fidel's daughter hates the revolution and lives in Europe, unlike her brothers who support the revolution. Che's daughter Aleida Guevara (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleida_Guevara) is a revolutionary socialist and writer, and a hard supporter of every revolutionary process in latinamerica. We don't care about individuals thoughts, but rather working class conditions and actions in Cuba.

[Severian]

More good news: there is little or no nepotism in Cuba's political leadership. Being someone's child or grandchild does not guarantee you a leadership spot, let alone a lot of privilege. Naturally some of these children and grandchildren are unhappy about this.

Ad hominem? Of course. But the whole premise of this thread is ad hominem: that we should listen to these criticisms because they're made by "Che's grandson."

[LSD]

Yeah, I'm no fan of the Cuban government, but "che's grandson says so" is hardly a good reason to oppose it.

But on the topic of Cuba and nepotism, I would remind everyone that it's Fidel's brother who's taking over (and who's been running the army for 50 years). And while political dynasties aren't particularly uncomon, they're hardly inspirational examples of democracy.

Rather they just demonstrate, yet again, how non-spectacular the Cuban state is.

Fifteen years ago there was a Bush in Washington fighting a Castro in Havana, a year from now, there'll probably be a different Bush fighting a different Castro.

The more things change... <_<

[Severian]

Originally posted by [email protected] 13, 2007 06:11 pm
But on the topic of Cuba and nepotism, I would remind everyone that it&#39;s Fidel&#39;s brother who&#39;s taking over (and who&#39;s been running the army for 50 years).
Along with being Fidel&#39;s brother, Raul is also a leader of the Cuban revolution going all the way back to the Moncada attack and the Granma landing. Damn few people even survived both, let alone distinguished themselves as leaders. And he&#39;s done a good job as Defense Minister for, as you say, 50 years. Nope, sorry, not nepotism.

Both have a number of children, who are not prominent in the Cuban leadership. Fidel Castro Diaz-Balart, a nuclear physicist, ran the country&#39;s nuclear energy program for a time, but was eventually removed from that post.


Fifteen years ago there was a Bush in Washington fighting a Castro in Havana, a year from now, there&#39;ll probably be a different Bush fighting a different Castro.

Almost 60 years ago, capitalists and sectarians alike were confidently predict ing the imminent demise of the Cuban revolution. A year from now, that&#39;ll probably still be true.

Contrary to your superficial, ignorant assertions, the survival and continued fighting commitment of Cuban revolutionaries is unusual, even unique.

[LSD]

Along with being Fidel&#39;s brother, Raul is also a leader of the Cuban revolution going all the way back to the Moncada attack and the Granma landing. Damn few people even survived both, let alone distinguished themselves as leaders. And he&#39;s done a good job as Defense Minister for, as you say, 50 years.

Actualy, we really can&#39;t say how good a job Raul&#39;s done as we have no one to compare him against. Indeed, no one else has ever even held the job.

I guess that&#39;s "socialist democracy", though, right? &#39;cause there&#39;s nothing more democratic than two brothers holding the reigns of power for half a century. :rolleyes:


Nope, sorry, not nepotism.

So you think that, what, it&#39;s just a coincidence that Raoul rose to such prominence and held it for so long? What, is the Castro gene pool just that damn "revolutionary"?

I mean really Severian, is it seriously your contention that absent Fidel Castro, Raul would have held on to that position for so long? Or that if Castro weren&#39;t currently President, Raul would still be number one in line (on what&#39;s basically a one person list) for the position?

And I suppose you&#39;re one of those folks who thought that Bobby Kennedy was Attorney General &#39;cause he was so damn smart... :rolleyes:


Both have a number of children, who are not prominent in the Cuban leadership.

Nepotism doesn&#39;t have to be absolute to be nepotism.

None of Kim Il Sung&#39;s other children are particularly prominent in North Korean politics -- I believe that one of them is Ambassador to Poland -- but that doesn&#39;t make Kim Jong Il&#39;s position any less a result of his lineage.

And Kim Jong Il, for his part, insists that his position had nothing whatsoever to do with his family. But we know better. As we will when Raul takes the reigns.

The nature of power is that people are driven to share it with people they care about (assuming that such people exist). That&#39;s why kings gave their throne&#39;s to their sons. And it&#39;s why Raul Castro is "first vice minister" of the Republic of Cuba.

It&#39;s not pretty and it&#39;s certainly not "socialist" but its the unavoidable reality of institutional government.


Almost 60 years ago, capitalists and sectarians alike were confidently predict ing the imminent demise of the Cuban revolution. A year from now, that&#39;ll probably still be true.

And that proves ...what?

Nepotism is the oldest form of government on earth largely because its so damn good at succession.

I suppose you could be right, the fact that Cuba&#39;s about to go from the 50 year rule of one F. Castro to the open-ended rule of one R. Castro doesn&#39;t nescessarily mean that nepotism&#39;s involved ...but it sure smells like it.

And given the tendency of powerful centralized states to become vehicles for personal interests, it&#39;s a very very likely possibility. So likely in fact, and so dangerous, that a responsible government would eliminate even the semblence of dynastic aspirations.

The Cuban presidency shouldn&#39;t go to another relic of three generations back, certainly not to the outgoing president&#39;s own brother. Cuba needs some serious and radical change, and that&#39;s not going to come from another octogenerian Cold Warrior still mouring the fall of Stalinism.


Contrary to your superficial, ignorant assertions, the survival and continued fighting commitment of Cuban revolutionaries is unusual, even unique.

The Soviet Union lasted 84 years and the PRC doesn&#39;t appear to be going anywhere any time soon. Both have outlasted Cuba by decades and yet neither were revolutionary in any serious meaning of the word.

Longevity doesn&#39;t make the Cuban regime any more socialist and it certainly doesn&#39;t make it "unique".

On the contrary, it makes it depressingly familiar.

[Red Rebel]

Can anyone provide a link to those articles in English? Also can anyone provide any link about Canek Sanchez Guevara in English?

On another note, most of the grandchildren of socialist leaders turn out to be complete capitalists.


Originally posted by "LSD"
I would remind everyone that it&#39;s Fidel&#39;s brother who&#39;s taking over (and who&#39;s been running the army for 50 years).

Raul has been with the Cuban Revolution since the begining and in some ways, before Fidel. Also keep in mind that neither of them are lining up their children for the presidency.


I guess that&#39;s "socialist democracy", though, right? &#39;cause there&#39;s nothing more democratic than two brothers holding the reigns of power for half a century.

Who do you think should be a better canidate for the President and General of the Armed Forces?


What, is the Castro gene pool just that damn "revolutionary"?

That doesn&#39;t explain why their children don&#39;t have high ranking positions. Also many sibilings have similar enviroments when growing up. If one is revolutionary, the other, more than likely, will be revolutionary for the same reason as the first. Lenin comes to mind when I think of this.


Or that if Castro weren&#39;t currently President, Raul would still be number one in line (on what&#39;s basically a one person list) for the position?

Fun fact:
The Vice President sucseeds the President.


The nature of power is that people are driven to share it with people they care about (assuming that such people exist).

Human beings are social creatures. They have a need to be with other humans. And while being with them, they tend to care for them.


And it&#39;s why Raul Castro is "first vice minister" of the Republic of Cuba.

So Fidel appointed Raul that position? You seem to be confused. Raul was elected to that position by the National Assembly.


Cuba needs some serious and radical change

So did China, look how well that did.


and that&#39;s not going to come from another octogenerian Cold Warrior still mouring the fall of Stalinism.

Which is why Cuba hasn&#39;t changed one bit since the end of the Cold War. Look at the changes in Cuba since the end of the Cold War, you might notice something.


The Soviet Union lasted 84 years and the PRC doesn&#39;t appear to be going anywhere any time soon. Both have outlasted Cuba by decades and yet neither were revolutionary in any serious meaning of the word.

The French Revolution maintained its revolutionary spirit. The people than hated the revolution and choose a stable government (Napoleon, who was in more autocratic than the Bourbons). China tried to maintain the revolutionary spirit, look how well it is doing after the Cultural Revolution.

I suggest you look more into the lives of Cubans. They have maintained a revolutionary spirit while keeping stability.

[UndergroundConnexion]

Fidels sons are if i remember well photographer, cameraman, surgeon, and one is doing some administrative work in the government... no prominent position at all. Instead is people like Roque (43 years old, thus born after the revolution), or Carlos Lage who will take over. Also now its not exactly Raul who took over, but more a team of people

[Rawthentic]

Fun fact:
The Vice President sucseeds the President.
Here&#39;s another: Raul is not vice-president.


Raul has been with the Cuban Revolution since the begining and in some ways, before Fidel. Also keep in mind that neither of them are lining up their children for the presidency.
But Raul sure is. LSD&#39;s post explains it pretty well.


Human beings are social creatures. They have a need to be with other humans. And while being with them, they tend to care for them.
Oh yeah, its very....caring to make sure that your brother becomes ruler of the state after you die. Your comment here is quite absurd and irrelevant. I care about my dog, but I&#39;m willing it anything.


So did China, look how well that did.

Yeah, it needed radical change, but I got back on its historical path to capitalism. At least the Chinese Communist Party accelerated the capitalist process. Radical change would have been for the workers to take control.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

there is little or no nepotism in Cuba&#39;s political leadership.


When you go to a demonstration you&#39;ll be checked by at least three persons/organizations: CDR members (Committee for the Defence of the Revolution, if fact your neighbours), party members (it doesn&#39;t matter whether you are a member of the party or not) and by workers union&#39;s members.

If you don&#39;t go then next working day your boss at the company will ask you why you didn&#39;t go, later on the party&#39;s secretary will do the same.

Consequence 1: If you are a party&#39;s member you&#39;ll get a sanction (the first time you get a public reprimand, then you may loose the right to vote for a couple of months). Probably they won&#39;t throw you out of the party because it&#39;s already bad enough (nobody wants to belong to the party so they need to keep their members).

Consequence 2 (the worst one): In Cuba if you want to take your kid to a kindergarten you have to fill in an application form, your personal details are just pure formalities, what really counts are the signatures of your company&#39;s boss, the union&#39;s boss and the CDR&#39;s boss, and it&#39;s then when they will recall that you didn&#39;t go to the last demo.

Consequence 3 (also a bad one): some things (TVs, ventilators, refrigerators, etc) are given away at the companies by the workers unions, they are for the best workers. Who the best workers are is decided at a open meeting, and then you will see that even your best friend will raise his hand and say Pepe doesn&#39;t deserve to get a TV because he didn&#39;t go the last demo.


And in general regime-loyal communists benefit more from thesystem. A family member of a friend of mine is CDR chief in the neighbourhood. Of course he got the latest TV.

Every CDR chief must be a "good communist", that means being loyal to the regime. And who got the TV that was supposed to be given to the best person in the neighbourhood, yes that&#39;s right, a family member of a friend of mine who is head of the CDR.


I think about 5-10 percent of the population are really "communists" (regime loyal), even though the membership numbers say something different.

Of this little percent, about half are in the closet, they are regime loyal to get work as a leader or for other benefits.

In most "zones" there are meetings every month. Many show up because of the job or want to have a good relationship to the zone chief (CDR), and they can actually manage to affect and get through some small things they want to change, that are deals with their neighbourhood.

--
The difference between the poliec and military is not big, excluding some special military groups. The police in Cuba are among those who make more money than everyone else. I have heard they make more than the doctors. The police are often from rural areas, where Castro is the most popular, because they were those who benefitted most from the uprising against Batista ("the revolution"). Those who live in Havana must serve their military service in other places. And the poliec have special political meetings, who could in effect be called brainwashing.


Castro&#39;s system has some major problems or faults, that means it will never succeed


1. The morale of Cubans is generally destroyed, in the struggle to survive or get materialist things, so most people have little problems in lying, stealing etc. to get a "better life".

The morale and loyalty lies only among nearest family or friends.

For instance if you don&#39;t steal from your job, you will be termed as stupid, if it canbe done without a great risk of getting caught.

In fact, Cubans are very preoccupied about material things.

When a cuban buys a portable radio, he is more occupied about the number of buttons the radio has, and they keep stickers and commercial folders that are on the radio when they buy it.

For instance if you give a little girl a dollw hich lies in a box, you could sometimes discover that it has become a adornment which the girl is not allowed to play with.

And most of the walls are covered in commercial posters for a whole variety of products.

But, in terms of moral, we should not generalize. Many, but not all are like this.

2. The principle of equality, is what makes Cubans good compared to many of its neighbour countries and they have a society with many close to free or free benefits like health care and education, and the benefit of living safe in Cuba.

Cubans may be intelligent, but lacks a lot of experience and understand of things, and it arrives from not having a wide variety of media like newspapers, magazines and books.


A lot of cubans are incredibly smart when it comes to doing illegal business, and there are many many tricks in order to get some money from tourists. I am saying you have not been in Cuba, if you have not been tricked by Cubans.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Fidel has other family that&#39;s not even involved in government, like his other brother.

Ramon Castro

is chiefly responsible for many of Cuba&#39;s agricultural initiatives since the revolution.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram%C3%B3n_Ca...evolutionary%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram%C3%B3n_Castro_%28Cuban_revolutionary%29)

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Fidels sons are if i remember well photographer, cameraman, surgeon, and one is doing some administrative work in the government... no prominent position at all. Instead is people like Roque (43 years old, thus born after the revolution), or Carlos Lage who will take over. Also now its not exactly Raul who took over, but more a team of people

The daughter of Raúl, Mariela Castro


is the director of the Cuban National Center for Sex Education in Havana and an activist for LGBT rights in Cuba. She is the daughter of first vice president Raúl Castro Ruz and Vilma Espín Guillois, and the niece of president Fidel Castro.



Mariela Castro is president of the Cuban Multidisciplinary Centre for the Study of Sexuality, president of the National Commission for Treatment of Disturbances of Gender Identity, member of the Direct Action Group for Preventing, Confronting, and Combatting AIDS, and an executive member of the World Association for Sexual Health. She is also the director of the journal Sexología y Sociedad.

She has published 13 scholarly articles and nine books.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariela_Castro


I vaguely remember reading that a family member of the Castro family also runs the medical team of the Cuba&#39;s national sports union or something like that. It is probably not an accurate description of his job but it is something in that field, I believe.




Vilma Espín Guillois is a former Cuban chemical engineer and revolutionary who is married to Raúl Castro, Vice President of the Cuban Council of State, head of the Cuban Armed Forces and brother to Cuban President Fidel Castro. Espin has four children and seven grandchildren. Her daughter, Mariela Castro, currently heads the Cuban National Center for Sex Education. Espin is often described as "Cuba&#39;s first lady". [1]


Espín has been President of the Federation of Cuban Women since its foundation in 1960. The organization is a recognized non-governmental organization which claims a membership of more than three and a half million women. Espin is also a member of the Council of State of Cuba, is a member of the Central Committee and the Political Bureau of the Communist Party of Cuba.

Espin headed the Cuban Delegation to the First Latin American Congress on Women and Children in Chile in September 1959. She also headed the Cuban delegations to the Conferences on Women held in Mexico, Copenhagen, Nairobi and Beijing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vilma_Esp%C3%ADn


Are there any in the Castro family who is either not a dissident or a member of the government or policy making in Cuba?

[Rawthentic]

Yes he is. Don&#39;t be a moron.

Easy there.:D


Raul was there from the beginning of the revolution, the assault on Moncada, prison, exile in Mexico, the Granma, the fight in the Sierra, etc.
So were countless others. What a coincidence. I suppose that he is the ones that "knows" how to keep the revolution alive, those workers need experts and specialists to teach them and keep them in line.


You&#39;re sounding more like a "journalist" for Forbes than a communist.
What? Cuba can&#39;t take a little heat? I&#39;m sorry if I don&#39;t desperately hang on to the last egalitarian "socialist" nation.

[Hiero]

Canek Sanchez Guevara is a dog.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Canek Sanchez Guevara is a dog.


That&#39;s quite the compliment. :lol:

Man&#39;s best friend.

[Councilman Doug]

Are there any in the Castro family who is either not a dissident or a member of the government or policy making in Cuba?

What about his five sons?

[Karl Marx's Camel]

According to UndergroundConnexion, at least one is doing some administrative work in the government...

[Question everything]

"What would Che Guevara think about Cuban society and how it is run?"

WWCD (What would Che Do) lol :lol:

[Ihavenoidea]

lmao, I am gonna check out that Che store. lol.

[Red Rebel]

Originally posted by "hastalavictoria"
Here&#39;s another: Raul is not vice-president.

As stated earlier, yes he is. Cuban Council of State (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_State_of_Cuba)


But Raul sure is. LSD&#39;s post explains it pretty well.

The same one I already responded to? :P


Oh yeah, its very....caring to make sure that your brother becomes ruler of the state after you die.

Raul isn&#39;t an idiot. He is an experienced revolutionary, commander of the military, and dedicated communist. Counts for something, don&#39;t ya think?