What's the opposite to free trade?

[R_P_A_S]

Ok so this one guy said that with free trade we give undevelop countries a chance to catch up. i don't really see how. I mean I look at this way.

The U.S. employees people. but pays them pathetic wages and they never really own any of the products. or see any of the profits. is like they are paying rent to live in their own country.

so what policies can the U.S. practice instead of free trade? how can we give other countries chances "to catch up" what is better than free trade?

[Forward Union]

We don't want to figure out fairer ways of making capitalism work. We want to smash it.

This liberal bullshit about "letting countries catch up" is an absolute farce.

[Free Left]

This is free trade.... Firdst World buys really cheap raw materials off the third world, process them into manufactured goods, then sells the goods back to the third world for big prices.

[Global_Justice]

RPAS, don't confuse fair trade with free trade. the two couldn't be further apart. free trade is leading to globalization and will only benefit the rich countries (or more specifically, multi-national corporations)

[R_P_A_S]

ok. I am against free trade. but since I'm not that far into my understanding of marx and economics I fail to make the connections still. to how else it effects the poor instead of helping. I see and know what some of you are saying and I agree.

so there's no other option? while capitalism exist is there an other way to conduct business besides free trade? something more fair?

[Delta]

Well for under-developed countries you can kick other countries out and use your own natural resources for the wealth of your people, rather than some rich guy playing golf half-way around the world.

You see this happening a lot with oil companies, with the government nationalizing the oil industry and using it to fund their country's development (Venezuela and Iran for example). In fact, that only democratically elected leader that Iran has ever had was put out of power by Britain and the US because Iran did just that. The oil company which is now called BP owned essentially all of Iran's oil resources.

But strictly speaking, the opposite of free trade would be protectionism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protectionism).

[Umoja]

What Free Trade people don't mention is that America didn't gain economic strength because of free trade. Most powerful economies gained power because of protectionism. Infact, America still practices protectionism, the tariffs on Japanese cars are massive.

Free Trade has advantages for maintaining a status quo of sorts, and some countries that are poorer could benefit under free trade if they had better control of their resources, but that's not the case.

Still, I'm skeptical of fair trade. Someone at my school wrote an article against fair trade coffee, for example. Her main point was that coffee is dirt cheap because the supply of coffee is too great. Fair trade coffee is just artificially price-inflated coffee. It doesn't actually solve the deeper problem, and it still encourages farmers to grow a product that there is already too much. The best way to have 'ethical coffee' would be for less people to grow it! That'd raise the price! Don't believe me, make a supply and demand graph, imagine what would happen if you moved the supply curve to the left. Raise in prices for all price levels!

[R_P_A_S]

thanks for all the feed back. i dont know if this paper would be a good idea. i should just do it on capitalism.. iin general the bad!

[JKP]

Originally posted by [email protected] 30 2006, 12:06 PM
thanks for all the feed back. i dont know if this paper would be a good idea. i should just do it on capitalism.. iin general the bad!
Did you check the link that I posted in your previous thread?

Here it is again:
http://www.paecon.net/PAEtexts/Chang1.htm

You'll find it useful.

[BuyOurEverything]

The best way to have 'ethical coffee' would be for less people to grow it! That'd raise the price! Don't believe me, make a supply and demand graph, imagine what would happen if you moved the supply curve to the left. Raise in prices for all price levels!


How would a rise in the price of coffee as a commodity produce more "ethical" results, such as better treatment and compensation for coffe producing workers?

[Akira]

Capitalism is a beast and it must be destroyed or it will destroy us all leaving us to be in dehumanization consequences.

[emma_goldman]

Fair trade! :D

[Comrade Kurtz]

Free trade doesn't work because it asserts that businesses will refrain from exploitation without governmental intervention. This doesn't work even with government intervention (companies offshoring to Mexico, China, Vietnam, etc.) so what makes neo-liberals believe it would work without it? Really, free trade and capitalism are more utopian argument than Marxism!

[Demogorgon]

Free trade is only free in that the rich are free to exploit the poor. Wonderful system eh?

Trade of course can be beneficial for everybody. And it can make everybody richer. That is why we should all support fair trade.

[Nusocialist]

Here's an excellent site all about this.
http://www.ied.info/

so there's no other option? while capitalism exist is there an other way to conduct business besides free trade? something more fair?
undeveloped countries should start trade federations with countries with similar buying power and then they'd grow much quicker.

[( R )evolution]

As other have said, when you hear "free trade" it sounds cherry and nice and sounds like it benfits everyone in business but it doesnt at all. It alows rich imperalistic nations to take raw materials from 3rd world countrys for shit prices without traiffs or anything hence the word "free" but only free for the capitalist. The workers who manfuatre and get these raw materials out get paid shit well there product is sold for cheap prices but gets sold by the capitliast for alot higher prices, the only winner is the multi-national businesses that are usually funded by the goverments it isnt free but actually chains the worker up, so that the worker needs money to live and the only way to get that money is too work your ass off for nuthing while someone sits in there luxurious house sipping fucking long island ice teas gets all of the money you deserve. Fuck Free trade.

[LoneRed]

Engels Jun 1 1847 On the Question of Free Trade (http://marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/free-trade/index.htm)

Engels Jun 1 1847Protective Tariffs or Free Trade System (http://marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/06/01.htm)

Marx Sep 23 1847 The Protectionists, Free Traders and the Working Class (http://marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/09/23.htm)

Engels Sep 30 1847. The Free Trade Congress at Brussels (http://marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/09/30.htm)

On the Question of Free Trade, January 1848. Marx's Speech
http://marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/01/09ft.htm#marx

Engels 1888. On The Question Of Free Trade (http://marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1888/free-trade/index.htm)

Here is what Marx thought, take from it what you will

[JKP]

Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2006, 03:21 PM
Here's an excellent site all about this.
http://www.ied.info/

so there's no other option? while capitalism exist is there an other way to conduct business besides free trade? something more fair?
undeveloped countries should start trade federations with countries with similar buying power and then they'd grow much quicker.
Keep in mind that website supports reformist capitalism; that's not what leftists want. Also, I don't like how they appropriated the term "economic democracy". An economy that is controlled by the people is called either communism or anarchism. Capitalism is in opposition to that, no matter what label you put on it.

[Hooligan32]

First I'd like to say (being that this is my first post here) that I'm really glad to have found a message board like this and Hello.

As far as the question of free and fair trade I found some very useful, comprehensive information at Global Issues.org (http://globalissues.org) about trade related problems. There's also a wealth of information on distorted media, the AIDS epidemic, etc.

[Lord Koba]

free trade is a fundamental concept in increasing the productivity of any social organization from corporation to nation-state. Without free trade there are higher restrictions and allowances on an organization to distribute the full employment value of its labor and machinery. The resulting condition would mean that nations would not be able to work at full production (GDP) since a large market would be excluded due to the costs of transferring finished product to end consumers.