Something that's potentially contraversial - random thoughts

[mentalbunny]

now this is a really bizarre theory but what if we accelarated capitalism's downfall by increasing the infjustice against the workers but also informing them of the shit that's going on so then they will stand up and do something about it sooner. Yeah it'll be shit in the meantime but at the mo they are either too busy working 3 jobs in order to survive or they don't care.

[Invader Zim]

So what your saying is that if you oppress the wrkers even more then they will rise up quicker???

Hmm I dont think that would go down to well...

[elijahcraig]

I don't think so, I don't know how you'd accomplish that. And it is a rule that a communist DOES NOT go against the working class, which means that he does not subject them to that sort of tactic. That's a stalinist way of thinking, we do what we can with what resources we have, increasing pain and suffering would make our cause counter-revolutionary.

[Eastside Revolt]

Exactly how do you plan on oppressing them more?

[sc4r]

Quote: from mentalbunny on 9:43 pm on June 30, 2003
now this is a really bizarre theory but what if we accelarated capitalism's downfall by increasing the infjustice against the workers but also informing them of the shit that's going on so then they will stand up and do something about it sooner. Yeah it'll be shit in the meantime but at the mo they are either too busy working 3 jobs in order to survive or they don't care.


Hmmmm so its us bloody commies that are doing this bollox to me.

shit.

Now what do I do ? Get religion ?

:)

[Reuben]

interesting. I know that in the 60s or 70s there was aggroup of marxists who chose to vote conservative.

However fighting against reforms which add to the elfare of the wokring clss put communists in impossible position, how will we explain our actions to the mass of the working class who it is our responsiility to organise politically.

The thing is that revolutions do not come simply as a spontaneous reaction to the working class getting desperate. What is the case is that if the working class s conscous of its class interests and has become politically organised through unions and organisations and through fighting for specific reforms, then at the critical point, the proletariat will be a revolutionary class.

I understand what your saying, and agree that the level of wealth enjoyed by secitions of the working class may take them further from revolutionary activity. However i feel that this is, to a great extent because the super exploitation of third world workers negates some of the exploitation suffered by those in the third world. In other words although a british worker may be low payed in british terms, the value of his/her wages is inflated by the super cheap goods being produced bysuper exploited third world workers. I believe that as the latin american working class begins to asserts itself (as is already happening ithroughout the continent particularly in venezuela and also in Brazil and ecuador) standards of living for the western working class will be forced downwards.

Therefoire while greater desperation on the part of the working class may be seen as a precondition to revolution, that sacrifice this will entail is communists removing themselves from mainstream working class struggles such as those for unions or those for greater welfare, and while these struggles are not revolutionary , these struggles represent the nexus between communists and mass working class organisation.

SORRY IF THAT WAS JUMBLED IT WAS LATE AT NIGHT.

[mentalbunny]

Thanks for that people, don't think i was being serious or anything, it was just a random theory that I was toying with and wanted to hear what other people had to say because I myself couldn't see how to get round it.

Thanks very much, I'd still like more responses to it though!

[Reuben]

you mean i put all that effort into a ridiculously long response to someone wh was 'toying with a random theory'

:)

[mentalbunny]

No, when I say "toying" I mean I haven't been considering it for long and haven't decided if it's proper or not.

[Reuben]

ok ok your forgiven.

But in the future do NOT make any posts that i disagee wit


in fact consult me first

[Red Comrade]

It's kind of a tough decision, what's more important: The advancement of the party, or the suffering of people. I don't know.

You know that globalization will eventually lead to the downfall of capitalism as well. The more jobs they take overseas, the less jobs we have here.

[Sandanista]

I think that although i dont agree with this, i think its quite an objective thought, it is one way of pushin things along, but ud prolly find that the ruling class will find another outlet for the workers, like blaming it on refugees or the EU or something

[elijahcraig]

Sandinista? The same as Axis of Justice?

[Umoja]

I sort of agree with the idea of voting conservative. It's easily justifiable as well. Your only showing people the problem with the current system so they are more willing to look at other viewpoints. I suppose that's why I hope Bush gets reelected.....

[MikeyBoy]

I thought about that once...What if we tried that and something unpredictable happens and the entire world becomes some kind of corporate GULAG or something? The ruling class is smart, that's why they've stayed in power so long. If we supported them then they might get the power they needed...

[elijahcraig]

The idea of oppressing a class in order to quicken a revolution would backfire and would be horrible. That's going against the working class, they wouldn't treat you as a guiding force if you did that.

[Umoja]

I don't see myself as a leader. So I'm not "leading" anyone. People lead themselves, and maybe when people see something wrong they'll decide to leave themselves.

[praxis1966]

in fact consult me firstYeah, me too. In fact, if you do such a thing again, you will be sentenced to forty days and forty nights of farting on a snare drum!

Besides, while exacerbating the suffering of the proletariat may cattle prod the revolution, we would in essence become the oppressor. This is exactly what Friere warns against, and his explanation for the failure of the Soviet revolution. Eventually you will be found out and there WILL be a backlash.

[mentalbunny]

Well I will post what I wnat when I want, as long as it's not pointless falming, I don't need your permission! Thank you for your input everyone, it's been very useful.

[Gregorio Allemagna]

Mentalbunny,

I too have thought at length about the exploitation of the "McJob" class in America.

My suggestion is all workers earning less that $10.00/hour have a National Sickout Day to start. It would be a shot across the bow without sinking the ship.