Whats Socialism?

[Cloud]

Whats socialism?

[Janus]

Moved to Learning.


Socialism is generally defined by state or collective ownership of the means of production.

[Dyst]

There are two different types of socialism, the way I see it.

One is the phase between communism. Most communists believe a step called socialism is necessary after the revolution, in order to destroy the state and the class divisions. This is basicly considered by most just to be a process towards communism though.

The other is what many politicians calls socialism these days, which is in fact only social democracy. You may for example have heard right-wingers speak of Sweden or Norway as socialist, while that is far from the truth; it's close to U.S. as far as capitalism goes.

[which doctor]

http://redstar2000papers.com/theory.php?su...rt_from=&ucat=& (http://redstar2000papers.com/theory.php?subaction=showfull&id=1082900868&archive=&cnshow=headlines&start_from=&ucat=&)

[nickdlc]

Marx and Engles tended to use the words socialism and communism interchangebly but gradually both these words have become to mean ownership of the means of production by the state on behalf of the workers.

Marx lived during the 19th century where it was obvious that if workers took hold of a certain country through revolution, it would not be possible to go straight to "each according to abilities, each according to needs" so there would most likely be a system using labour time as the basis of accounting and labour vouchers as the basis for pay of work preformed.

The lower phase of communism was purely an economic neccesity but workers were still supposed to own means of production collectively through organs created by the working class.

[OneBrickOneVoice]

In socialism there is still a state. in communism there is no state.

[Leo]

http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/index.php?showtopic=50476

[Led Zeppelin]

"The first phase of communism, therefore, cannot yet provide justice and equality; differences, and unjust differences in wealth will still persist, but the exploitation of man by man will have become impossible because it will be impossible to seize the means of production – the factories, machines, land, etc. – and make them private property.... Marx shows the course of development of communist society....which [firstly] consists in the distribution of consumer goods "according to the amount of labor performed" (and not [yet] according to needs)."

"But the scientific distinction between socialism and communism is clear. What is usually called socialism was termed by marx the "first", or lower, phase of communist society. Insofar as the means of production becomes common property, the word "communism" is also applicable here, providing we do not forget that this is not complete communism." Lenin

[apathy maybe]

There are generally two definitions. What I call the narrow and the broad.

LeftyHenry gives an example of the narrow definition.
Socialism is socialism (broad definition) with a state (often democratic, but not always).

The broad definition is more useful in most situations.
It combines conceptions of freedom, equality, certain ideas about property and wealth.

Thus we can get state socialism (or narrow definition socialism), anarchism (all sorts), some types of Marxism and "utopian" socialism all fitting under this definition.

It is obviously in opposition to any sort of capitalism, feudalism, fascism as well.

(Though you sometimes see certain aspects of socialism (state) in some of the above types.)

[emma_goldman]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29 2006, 04:54 PM
In socialism there is still a state. in communism there is no state.
According to Marx.

There's stateless socialism like anarcho-syndicalism (or libertarian socialism).

Bakunin calls anarchism "voluntary socialism."

[Cult of Reason]

I would define Socialism as "worker control of the means of production". Hence, USSR was not Socialist, etc. etc..

[emma_goldman]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31 2006, 12:04 AM
I would define Socialism as "worker control of the means of production". Hence, USSR was not Socialist, etc. etc..
Good definition. :D