Seeking Secular Theories About Jesus

[Dooga Aetrus Blackrazor]

Even though I am atheist, I find the stories and accounts of Jesus (though usually fictional) to be interesting. Does anyone know the truth about him - or some secular theories dealing with the issue? He was ressurected, lol? What's the real deal on that?

[Publius]

He's a combination of previous religious figures, namely Horus and Mithra.

Basically, that's it.

Take Judiasm and toss in some Horus and Mithra and voila; Jesus.

He may or may not have existed, but we know where the stories come from.

[More Fire for the People]

Jesus was most likely a kind of layman's pastor turned radical. However, he signifies the proper union of Judaism and pre-Chritsian pagan beliefs.

[which doctor]

Reasons to believe he was fictional.

# Physical evidence of the life of Jesus Christ does not exist.

# Historians who lived in the time of Christ do not record his existence. Author John E. Remsburg compiled a list of 42 historical writers from the time period, none of which mentions Christ.

# Official Roman historical records contain no mention of the execution of Jesus Christ.

# The only "hisorical" records of the life of Jesus Christ are the New Testament books of Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. These writings are fraught with problems:

* Original copies of the Gospels no longer exist. According to Hugh Schonfield, "It would be impossible to find any manuscript of the New Testament older than the late third century, and we actually have copies from the fourth and fifth.

* Elaine Pagels writes: "Although the gospels of the New Testament - like those discovered at Nag Hammadi - are attributed to Jesus' followers, no one knows who actually wrote any of them." (Pagels, 1995)

* Mark, the earliest of the four Gospels written, was written in 70 AD according to Biblical historians. The others were written even later.

* "The authors of these gospels are said to be the actual disciples of Jesus. The average lifespan of human beings in the 1st century was 30. The ages of these apostles would have been a near-impossible 70 for Mark and over 110 for John."

* Whoever wrote Luke says that he is compiling the stories from other material and was not a witness to the events himself (Luke 1:1-4).

* The Gospels are written in Greek and not the Aramaic that would've been the actual language used by Christ and his followers.

* "The gospels are written in the third person, not in the first as an eyewitness would write. Many of the statements of Jesus were said when he was alone or are his thoughts, and could not have been heard by the writers of the gospels."

# "If Jesus lived, he must have been born. When was he born? Matthew says he was born when Herod was King of Judea. Luke says he was born when Cyrenius was Governor of Syria. He could not have been born during the administration of these tow rulers for Herod died in the year 4 B.C., and Cyrenius, who, in Roman history is Quirinius, did not become Governor of Syria until ten years later. Herod and Quirinius are separated by the whole reign of Archelaus, Herod's son. Between Matthew and Luke, there is, therefore, a contradiction of at least ten years, as to the time of Christ's birth. The fact is that the early Christians had absolutely no knowledge as to when Christ was born. The Encyclopaedia Britannica says: 'Christians count one hundred and thirty-three contrary opinions of different authorities concerning the year the Messiah appeared on earth.'"

# "Towards the close of the eighteenth century, Antonmaria Lupi, a learned Jesuit, wrote a work to show that the nativity of Christ has been assigned to every month in the year, at one time or another."

# "The Roman custom, when an enrollment was made, was that every man was to report at his place of residence. The head of the family alone made report. In no case was his wife, or any dependent, required to be with him. In the face of this established custom, Luke declares that Joseph left his home in Nazareth and crossed two provinces to go Bethlehem for the enrollment; and not only this, but that he had to be accompanied by his wife, Mary, who was on the very eve of becoming a mother. It would be highly improbable that she could make the trip."

# "John tells us that the driving of the money-changers from the Temple occurred at the beginning of Christ's ministry; and nothing is said of any serious consequences following it. But Matthew, Mark and Luke declare that the purification of the Temple took place at the close of his career, and that this act brought upon him the wrath of the priests, who sought to destroy him. Because of these facts, the Encyclopedia Biblica assures us that the order of events in the life of Christ, as given by the Evangelists, is contradictory and untrustworthy."

# "Nothing could be more improbable than the story of Christ's crucifixion. The civilization of Rome was the highest in the world. The Romans were the greatest lawyers the world had ever known. Their courts were models of order and fairness. A man was not condemned without a trial; he was not handed to the executioner before being found guilty. And yet we are asked to believe that an innocent man was brought before a Roman court, where Pontius Pilate was Judge; that no charge of wrongdoing having been brought against him, the Judge declared that he found him innocent; that the mob shouted, "Crucify him; crucify him!" and that to please the rabble, Pilate commanded that the man who had done no wrong and whom he had found innocent, should be scourged, and then delivered him to the executioners to be crucified! And let us ask, if Christ performed the miracles the New Testament describes, if he gave sight to blind men's eyes, if his magic touch brought youthful vigor to the palsied frame, if the putrefying dead at his command returned to life and love again - why did the people want him crucified? Is it not amazing that a civilized people - for the Jews of that age were civilized - were so filled with murderous hate towards a kind and loving man who went about doing good, who preached forgiveness, cleansed the leprous, and raised the dead - that they could not be appeased until they had crucified the noblest benefactor of mankind?"

# "The idea of the human messiah was stolen from earlier religions, prior to the birth of Christ. According to Gerald Massey, 'The mythical Messiah was Horus in the Osirian Mythos; Har-Khuti in the Sut-Typhonian; Khunsu in that of Amen-Ra; Iu in the cult of Atum-Ra; and the Christ of the Gospels is an amalgam of all these characters.' Osiris, Hercules, Mithra, Hermes, Prometheus, Perseus and others compare to the Christian myth. According to Patrick Campbell of The Mythical Jesus, all are pre-Christian sun gods, yet all allegedly had gods for fathers, virgins for mothers; had their births announced by stars; were born on the solstice around December 25th; had tyrants who tried to kill them in their infancy; met violent deaths; rose from the dead; and nearly all were worshiped by 'wise men' and were alleged to have fasted for forty days. (McKinsey, Chapter 5)"

# "The Egyptian mythical Horus, god of light and goodness has many parallels to Jesus (Leedom, Massey). These myths contain allusions to:

* Horus and the Father as one.

* Horus as the Father seen in the Son.

* Horus as the way, the truth, the life by name and in person.

* Horus was baptized with water by Anup.

* Horus as the "Good Shepherd."

* Horus as the Lamb.

* Horus as the Lion.

* Horus identified with the Cross.

* The trinity of Atum the Father, Horus the Son, Ra the Holy Spirit.

* Horus the avenger.

* Horus as life eternal.

* Horus' twelve followers (disciples/apostles)."

[Comrade J]

Some interesting articles you may wish to read -

Did Jesus Exist? (http://www.atheists.org/christianity/didjesusexist.html)

How Jesus Got A Life (http://www.atheists.org/christianity/jesuslife.html)