Appartheid

[VermontLeft]

obviously the "original" south African appartheid system isnt around any more, but there are clearly a number of appatheid-like states left in the wordl.

normally people associated isreal as the first, which makes sense to me cuase their policies are about as racist a it gets, but there have got to be other instances of institutinoal "segregation" (?) like that ...if not worse :o

so what do you think is the worst example of state-sanctioned discrimination in the world right now? whats the new "appatheid"??

[bolshevik butcher]

I think that to a large extent aparteihd exists still in South Africa, although an elite few blacks have joined the mainly white bourgeoirse its not like there is not a massive black underclass, and most have not seen a significant increase in standrads of living since aparteihd was abolished. Israel does run an apartheid state. However I think it would be entirley wrong to compare it to the Sotuh African one in that Israel is a class ridden societ in itself and it's not like in South Africa where there effectivley was not a white working class, or it was part of the 'labour aristocracy'. In Israel there is a large working class.

[LSD]

obviously the "original" south African appartheid system isnt around any more, but there are clearly a number of appatheid-like states left in the wordl.

Well I think it really depends on how liberal one is willing to be with the definition of "appartheid".

In the stricted sense, after all, the only appartheid state to ever exist was the appartheid state. Any comparisons to modern policies are just that, comparisons.

That being said, however, "appartheid" is a useful shorthand for institutional policies of state discrimination. Because of the emotional and psychologiocal connotations built up around the word, it's a particularly effective means of conveying the horror of oppressive marginalization.

That is, from a propaganda perspective, saying that Israel is "racist" or "prejeduced" is one thing; but pointing out that they are running a virtual appartheid state is another.

It's the same reason that people love to compare Zionists with Nazis, the power of the rhetoric has a life of its own.

So if your aim is to move people; to shock them into understanding, "appartheid"-language is probably a reasonble means of doing so. From the perspective from rational theoretical discussion, however, analogies to the former South African regime are wholly hyperbolic.

There are some awful states in the world today, but there was only one "appartheid".


so what do you think is the worst example of state-sanctioned discrimination in the world right now?

That's a very different question.

Now, obviously the worst exploitation in the world today is the despotism of capital and what it's doing to the billions of proletarian and peasant victims around the world. That being said, however, I take it from the way you formulated your post that you're more interested in discussing social discrimination and not economic oppression.

Accordingly, I would have to say that the worst institutional discrimination in the world today -- the "new appartheid" as you put it -- is without a doubt the treatment of women in the middle east.

Now obviously it's not a "new" problem by any means, but in terms of state-sanctioned social marginalization, nothing else comes close.

Yeah, people like to hold up Israel has some sort of "successor" to South Africa, but the reality is that four million odd oppressed Palestinians do not even compare with the half-billion women currently enslaved by Islamic "law".

As far as "appartheid"-like goes, it really doesn't get any worse.