Quite onesided points of view

[Senf_in_Genf]

After finding this forum I've searched for critical opinions concerning the Eastern bloc and communist countries and I haven't found any.
I searched for "Prague Spring" and I found nothing. I searched for "1953","1956","1968" and "Spring Uprising" but I didn't find anything either. Thus I assume that you have never tried to judge your own ideology's history.

But I've found admiration for madmen. Stalin's pretty much admired around here. If you're opposing NS so much why do you protect similarly oppresive governments?(OK, Stalin wasn't a racist and he didn't organise a such industrial way of extermination, but he was a madman nonetheless, take his purges for instance ).

Ah, and I don't want to see any arguments comparable to "Evil Capitalist want to spread lies about our great comrades to stop our glorious Communism!".

[Cult of Reason]

Most people here, including me, are anti-Stalinist.

[Commie Girl]

Very few people support Stalin.....Lenin is another story!

[Lord Testicles]

Why is this guy restricted, he has made one post and that is it.

[Connolly]

do you protect similarly oppresive governments?

We dont.

[JimmyC]

It's easy to be Marxist and anti-Stalinist in 2006. The trick would have been to be anti-Stalinist AND living in the USSR in 1935.

Let's play a game:

It's 1935.

You're an American, and you stand on a soap box in Time Square, NYC, and proclaim, "F. D. Roosevelt is a bastard, and his policies are for shit!"

What happens to you?


It's 1935.

You're a Russian, and you stand on a soap box in Red Square, Moscow, and proclaim, "Stalin is a bastard, and his policies are for shit!"

What happens to you?

[LSD]

After finding this forum I've searched for critical opinions concerning the Eastern bloc and communist countries and I haven't found any.

Then you obviously didn't look very hard.

I would advise that you browse through the History forum because it's replete with analyses of the various twentieth century "socialist" states.

Additionaly, every so often a new cappie comes along and accuses us of trying to "revive" the Soviet Union. Instead of reposting all the old arguments, though, how about I just link to the last thread on this subject:

Repetition of History (http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/index.php?showtopic=44889&hl=)


I searched for "Prague Spring" and I found nothing. I searched for "1953","1956","1968" and "Spring Uprising" but I didn't find anything either.

That's odd because I got 20 hits for "prague spring" and hundreds for the various dates you posted.


But I've found admiration for madmen. Stalin's pretty much admired around here.

:blink: He is?

That's funny, because I thought that we had a pinned thread in History called "the Crimes of Stalin"! :lol:

[LSD]

It's 1935.

You're a Russian, and you stand on a soap box in Red Square, Moscow, and proclaim, "Stalin is a bastard, and his policies are for shit!"

What happens to you?

You're arrested, charged with treason, and thrown into a Gulag.


Let's play a game:

It's 1935.

You're an American, and you stand on a soap box in Time Square, NYC, and proclaim, "F. D. Roosevelt is a bastard, and his policies are for shit!"

What happens to you?

You're arrested, charged with treason, and thrown into jail à la Eugene V. Debs.


It's easy to be Marxist and anti-Stalinist in 2006. The trick would have been to be anti-Stalinist AND living in the USSR in 1935.

That would have been more than a "trick", it would have been suicide. Just like being "anti-American" in the fifties. That's how despotic regimes stay in power, whether they're capitalist or "socialist": they punish those who defy them.

Again, though, none of this is "new information".

[JimmyC]

Let's play a game:

It's 1935.

You're an American, and you stand on a soap box in Time Square, NYC, and proclaim, "F. D. Roosevelt is a bastard, and his policies are for shit!"

What happens to you?



You're arrested, charged with treason, and thrown into jail à la Eugene V. Debs.


LSD you are so happless. You know the truth. And this may come as a shock to you, but FDR had PLENTY of enemies during his time. You wish that would have happened to the anti-FDR guy. Come on, don't be such a prig.

[Senf_in_Genf]

http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/index.php...37&hl=1956&st=0 (http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/index.php?showtopic=50237&hl=1956&st=0)

Oh no, I can find absolutely no hints of sympathy for Stalin.

Oh well, and when I search for any of the words mentioned above I'll get results.
Too bad, I simply get irrelevant ones. And I'm searching for comments to these Eastern Bloc related incidents rather than Stalin's death or oh-so-evil Capitalist conspiracies.

[KC]

You wish that would have happened to the anti-FDR guy.

Sorry, but it did happen to him:


Originally posted by wikipedia.org
On June 16, 1918 Debs made an anti-war speech in Canton, Ohio, protesting World War I, and was arrested under the Espionage Act of 1917. He was convicted and sentenced to serve twenty years in prison and disenfranchised for life.
Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_V._Debs)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0a/Debs_penitentiary.jpg/200px-Debs_penitentiary.jpg
Debs in the Atlanta Penitentiary

[LSD]

Originally posted by JimmyC+--> (JimmyC)LSD you are so happless. You know the truth. And this may come as a shock to you, but FDR had PLENTY of enemies during his time.[/b]

And many of them ended up in prison.

Not all of them, obviously, but then republican liberalism has to maintain a public face of "legitimacy" doesn't it.

That doesn't negate the fact that open criticism of the war was pretty much outlawed by Roosevelt, nor that thousands ended up in prison solely due to their opinions, statements, or ethnicity.


Originally posted by [email protected]
Oh no, I can find absolutely no hints of sympathy for Stalin.

Why would link to a thread that was predominantly anti-stalin in order to prove that this board is "sympathetic" to Stalinism?

I'm really quite confused... :unsure:


Senf_in_Genf
And I'm searching for comments to these Eastern Bloc related incidents rather than Stalin's death or oh-so-evil Capitalist conspiracies.

Which incidents in particular?

I'm virtually certain that if you search hard enough, you'll find a thread discussing the issues you're looking for; but it should be noted that this is a political message board, not an historical one.

That means that while we do adress matters of history, we don't address all of them. Specifically, we may not address every single issue of historical imperialism as they tend to be redundant in their details.

I mean what is there to actually "debate" on the "prague spring"? What do serious progressive communists have to say about Soviet imperialism other than that it was bad?

Frankly, the only reason why there may not be that many topic no the Soviet Union's misdeeds is precisely because, for the most part, we are so unanimous on them.

It's the same reason that you won't see a debate on the revolutionary war at a pro-American website. It's simply not an issue.

[Senf_in_Genf]

Originally posted by LSD+Jun 10 2006, 06:14 PM--> (LSD @ Jun 10 2006, 06:14 PM)
Originally posted by JimmyC+--> (JimmyC)LSD you are so happless. You know the truth. And this may come as a shock to you, but FDR had PLENTY of enemies during his time.[/b]

And many of them ended up in prison.

Not all of them, obviously, but then republican liberalism has to maintain a public face of "legitimacy" doesn't it.

That doesn't negate the fact that open criticism of the war was pretty much outlawed by Roosevelt, nor that thousands ended up in prison solely due to their opinions, statements, or ethnicity.


[email protected]
Oh no, I can find absolutely no hints of sympathy for Stalin.

Why would link to a thread that was predominantly anti-stalin in order to prove that this board is "sympathetic" to Stalinism?

I'm really quite confused... :unsure:


Senf_in_Genf
And I'm searching for comments to these Eastern Bloc related incidents rather than Stalin's death or oh-so-evil Capitalist conspiracies.

Which incidents in particular?

I'm virtually certain that if you search hard enough, you'll find a thread discussing the issues you're looking for; but it should be noted that this is a political message board, not an historical one.

That means that while we do adress matters of history, we don't address all of them. Specifically, we may not address every single issue of historical imperialism as they tend to be redundant in their details.

I mean what is there to actually "debate" on the "prague spring"? What do serious progressive communists have to say about Soviet imperialism other than that it was bad?

Frankly, the only reason why there may not be that many topic no the Soviet Union's misdeeds is precisely because, for the most part, we are so unanimous on them.

It's the same reason that you won't see a debate on the revolutionary war at a pro-American website. It's simply not an issue. [/b]
Oh, trying to dodge. I hope it isn't doomed to fail.
You should read this long text.


Which incidents in particular?
I hoped these years would ring a bell.
But how about the uprising in the GDR in 1953, the Spring Uprising in Hungary in 1956 and the Prague Spring in 1968.

[KC]

If you want to know people's opinions on these events, why not start threads about them?

[Senf_in_Genf]

Originally posted by Khayembii [email protected] 10 2006, 06:38 PM
If you want to know people's opinions on these events, why not start threads about them?
Because the evil Zionist-Nazi-Capitalist conspirators from Mars (evil Capitalist trade mark) would shadow me if i did so. :rolleyes:
Now what's this very thread about? Whether I drink evil Capitalist coffee from Brazil with or without evil capitalist sugar?

[overlord]

Because the evil Zionist-Nazi-Capitalist conspirators from Mars (evil Capitalist trade mark) would shadow me if i did so.

Yeah, they'll stick you on a production line against your will man! :rolleyes:



Now what's this very thread about? Whether I drink evil Capitalist coffee from Brazil with or without evil capitalist sugar?

OOOOOOO! you're so evil! Coffee is evil! Free trade is evil! Everything is evil!

And if you're looking for admiration of madmen look for threads with this absolute retard bobkindles. I don't know how someone can be so dumb and not die from it.