Why the rampant crime?

[Karl Marx's Camel]

I've heard from various people now, that crime has increased dramatically since Chavez came to office. That Caracas is one of the most insecure cities in the world.

Why?

[Dreckt]

Who said that and/or what is your source? Do you have statistics, etc?

[Janus]

Is this from the discussions on Wikipedia? I would think that crime would decrease since Chavez became president.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

No, it is not from Wikipedia.

There have been 9,000 killed each year, against 3,000 in the beginning of the 90's, with a peak of 15,000 i 2003.

[Guerrilla22]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2006, 07:20 PM
I've heard from various people now, that crime has increased dramatically since Chavez came to office. That Caracas is one of the most insecure cities in the world.

Why?
Because Chavez stirred up the lower class and now they're not going to take it anymore.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Heh, if they were only going after the capitalist class, the bourgeois would have been eradicated years ago, no?

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Poverty is down 13% so I would have thought crime would have followed suit... don't about half of Venezuelans carry hand guns at all times though?

[bolshevik butcher]

I think it's closer to a quarter.

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2006, 07:20 PM
I've heard from various people now, that crime has increased dramatically since Chavez came to office
Since Chavez has been in office crime has indeed increased. In fact, just last week I saw a mugging happening on the Falls Road in Belfast, the criminal obviously a Chavez supporter

In other startling news, clocks have continued to tick since Chavez took office

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Poverty is down 13% so I would have thought crime would have followed suit...

That is the problem. It is not going down. It is rising.

[McLeft]

And your sources are?

I suppose is one of those press agencies known as "prensa amarillista".

Why don't you take a look at the good things Chavez has done and comapare them with the bad ones (i don't think there's any btw). Try to be more optimistic, simply because he is in favour of the majority, and the people love him and just because he has won 11 democratic elections you don't have to go around saying that crime has increased under of him. Sorry if you felt i was harsh but speculation simply angers me.

[drain.you]

I thought it was 3/5 people in Caracas that carry weapons. Which statistic is true? *confused*

[Messiah]

The least you could do is actually provide some sources. It's hard to take this as anything more than slander when your argument consists of "So, I was talking to a buddy of mine and he said..."

[Amusing Scrotum]

Originally posted by NWOG+Jun 4 2006, 06:47 PM--> (NWOG @ Jun 4 2006, 06:47 PM) There have been 9,000 killed each year, against 3,000 in the beginning of the 90's, with a peak of 15,000 i 2003. [/b]

Well, the first question I'd ask is how much has the population increased over the last decade? 10%? 20%? 50%? From that, we'd be able to see, in context, how much murder has increased in Venezuela.

Once we knew that information, we'd need to check as to whether there's been some restructuring of the Police in Venezuela. Are there now, for instance, more Policemen? Or has there been some kind of to make people more willing to report violent crime when it occurs? There's been some kind of bureaucratic change within the British Police force regarding how assault is reported....which has meant that the number of reported "violent assaults" has ballooned, yet in reality, they've likely gone down. I mean now, if the Police stop a fight on a Saturday night, they take statements, give out crime numbers and so on; where as, in the past, they would have just broke up the fight. So, it's probably wise to see whether anythings change over the last decade in the Venezuelan Police.

Those are the first two things I'd advise you to do in order to try and understand these numbers....in context. Because numbers on their own, can be quite misleading.


McLeft
....and comapare them with the bad ones (i don't think there's any btw).

Yeah, the continued rule of capital in Venezuela is, well, uh, mmm....an anomaly!

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

I just checked on "the revolution will not be televised" and apparently it's 1 in 4 Venezuelans who carry hand guns...

And NWOG where does the rising poverty statistic come from according to the Guardian poverty is down from 50% to 37%...

[Ander]

Originally posted by [email protected] 5 2006, 12:32 PM
And NWOG where does the rising poverty statistic come from according to the Guardian poverty is down from 50% to 37%...
Read it again and you will see that he said poverty has decreased while crime has increased.

[YKTMX]

A couple of things:

1) "Crime" may have increased, but until we see some real figures on it, it's impossible to tell what "sort" of crime is increasing (if it is).

2) The police in Caracas, as in most SA cities, are, or were, famously corrupt. People would be reluctant to get involved with the judicial system, even if they were a victim of a crime. It might be the case that crime has not increased but the reporting of crime has increased, as confidence in the institutions of the state grows. This would give the impression of an increase in the crime level, even if this was not the case. Indeed, it could even be the case that actual criminal activity was decreasing, but the official crime statistics were increasing. I don't know if this is the case, but it's a possibility.

[Tekun]

"Crime" stats are debateable

The fact of the matter is that Venezuela is far from achieving a successful socialist revolution
Venezuela is merely moving to the "left"
Therefore, the fact that much of the wealth is still in the hands of government officials, CEO's, and capital owners is the reason that crime rises
Although poverty might be decreasing, it still exists and as a result, crime is still a significant element in Venezuelan society
No matter how much to the right or left a country moves, as long as the wealthy control the government and country, poverty and crime will be noticeable

The achievements of Chavez will be dwarfed once the ppl take control of the government and start uplifting themselves
Only then will crime decrease, or cease to be altogether

Yet for the time being, as long as the ppl don't control the means of production and wealth, crime will rise

[Zero]

My guess is that there is a resurgency since under Chavez you won't get shot if your accused of robbery.

Those silly silly Democratic Socialists, what with their tollerance and all. [/sarcasm]

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Originally posted by Jello+Jun 5 2006, 03:38 PM--> (Jello @ Jun 5 2006, 03:38 PM)
[email protected] 5 2006, 12:32 PM
And NWOG where does the rising poverty statistic come from according to the Guardian poverty is down from 50% to 37%...
Read it again and you will see that he said poverty has decreased while crime has increased. [/b]
oh yeah, read that wrong