The fall of Romania after the 89' ,,revolution''

[Andrei]

Hello comrads,I'm new in here.I wanted to ask you what is your opinion about Romania after the worse revolution from 89'. Considering that all of the capitalists I asked didn't even had a clue just where is Romania situated on the Globe,I wanted to find out what do other socialists know about my country...

I'm waiting for your replyes and thank you for your time!

[kingbee]

From what I've read Ceauşescu was a bit of a nutter, who had some strange ideas which ruined things. Romania was the only country from the bloc not to have any foreign debt: at the expense of not having any food for it's own citizens, the attempt to have a baby boom ruined the economy, and he built one of the world's biggest palaces in a moment of narcissism.

He also admired Juche, which says a lot.

[Cheung Mo]

He was a Stalinist, he was pro-US, and he was anti-woman/anti-choice.

Anybody who likes this fucker should be relegated to Opposing Ideologies.

[Matty_UK]

My sister visited Romania while she was teaching English in Hungary, from what she said Romania seems to have been completely ruined by the bastard. She described how angry she felt seeing his huge palace surrounded by such poverty, and also how his attempt at a baby boom had led to a situation where Bucharest is full of homeless children sniffing glue, living in sewers and getting murdered by cops.

I haven't studied him in depth, but from everything I do know it seems impossible for there to be any redeeming qualities in the slightest.

[Cheung Mo]

Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2006, 11:15 PM
My sister visited Romania while she was teaching English in Hungary, from what she said Romania seems to have been completely ruined by the bastard. She described how angry she felt seeing his huge palace surrounded by such poverty, and also how his attempt at a baby boom had led to a situation where Bucharest is full of homeless children sniffing glue, living in sewers and getting murdered by cops.

I haven't studied him in depth, but from everything I do know it seems impossible for there to be any redeeming qualities in the slightest.
I'll name one: He supported Dubcek. Sort of ironic when one considers that Ceaucescu broke with Moscow over too much political liberalisation while Dubcek did the exact opposite and broke over too little.

I think it's telling that Washington did more for Ceaucescu than they did for Dubcek.

[ComradeOm]

Romania is interesting though as it remains, to my knowledge, the only Eastern Bloc nation in which the old Communist Party survived in power, albeit under a different name.

[Jadan ja]

Welcome, Andrei.

As far as I know Romania (together with Albania) was probably one of the worst countries in the Eastren Block, both economically and politically. While the country was hungry, Ceaucescu built megalomanic palaces (probably inspired by North Korea). He also illegalized abortion and contraception (why???).

I would like to know what are your opinions on Ceaucescu? What are the views on him of Romanians today?


Romania is interesting though as it remains, to my knowledge, the only Eastern Bloc nation in which the old Communist Party survived in power, albeit under a different name.

In most Eastern Block countries new governments and ruling parties were composed of fromer members of communist parties (which quickly changed names).

[greymatter]

Originally posted by Jadan [email protected] 8 2006, 01:42 PM
In most Eastern Block countries new governments and ruling parties were composed of fromer members of communist parties (which quickly changed names).
That's because everyone who had a university education an experience in politics was a member of the communist party. In Yugoslavia, you had to join in order to get accepted to university.

[Andrei]

Comrads,I read all the posts and I have to admit that most of you socked me! First of all,please dont' call him names because crazy or not he was a leftist...Jadan ja asked me about the opinion of Romanians about him and you will be surprised to find out that most Romanians actually regret he was shot(on Christmas day :angry: ). Yes,it's true, we had a rough life under him,but the curent situation of the country isn't his fault,it's the fault of the former communists which arranged his death (Ion Iliescu and the others from the Social Democrat Party our days).
Yes,maybe he had some mental problems,but look at the current status:we are a very poor country,nothing was built here in 15 years,we work as slaves in Spain and we are the garbage of all Europe.He didn't gave us money,but self-respect.
You speak about his Palace,well at least he built something for him and for us in this God forgotten country! And by the way,some sayd he had 1 mild. $,surprise: he never had,he was borned poor,he died poor.

Are you guys even leftists? You critisize every communist ruler,when you should take a good look at your own life! Guys like Ceausescu rose up from the poor and made hymself heard in the world! What have you ,,smart asses'' realised?

[Connolly]

No doubt people were better off under the former communist regimes. Soviet Russia springs to mind.

But, however, there is a progression and disassociation away from these styles of government.

We, in the west (western Europe, USA, "democracies"), although still limited and exploited, enjoy many freedoms, however useless they may be. Something ex communist states werent in abundance of.

Our vision of communism is a solid one. We will not settle for another "communist" dictatorship.

We want socialism and communism. Nothing less, and definitely not another Ceausescu or Stalin.

Communist Romania may have been better than now, But that dosnt mean its the best Romania can be. It can be socialist, it can be communist - under workers control - not under minority dictatorship.

The Marxist left must address the failures of the past and learn from its failures, "ex-Romania" is not our model.

Although im sure someone on this board will agree with your position.

[Janus]

Are you guys even leftists? You critisize every communist ruler,when you should take a good look at your own life!
What's your point? The same could be said of Hitler

Most of us here simply want to achieve actual communism and not live under some dictatorship by an elite.

[kingbee]

In most Eastern Block countries new governments and ruling parties were composed of fromer members of communist parties (which quickly changed names).

Not neccessarily: many right wing governments got in after the fall of the wall. The lefties were then voted back in later as people were unhappy at (frankly absurd) economic promises failing.


Are you guys even leftists? You critisize every communist ruler,when you should take a good look at your own life! Guys like Ceausescu rose up from the poor and made hymself heard in the world! What have you ,,smart asses'' realised?

Because good communists are people who govern well, rather than those who "rise up" and make themselves infamous!

How exactly did Ceausescu give you self-pride? I can't see how many people support this guy.

[Jadan ja]

In Yugoslavia, you had to join in order to get accepted to university.

???

You had to join what? My parents (and grandparents) were never members of the party (not even members of SKOJ), but all of them studied in universities.


Not neccessarily: many right wing governments got in after the fall of the wall. The lefties were then voted back in later as people were unhappy at (frankly absurd) economic promises failing.

Even those right wing parties and governments were mostly composed of former communist party members.


Comrads,I read all the posts and I have to admit that most of you socked me! First of all,please dont' call him names because crazy or not he was a leftist...Jadan ja asked me about the opinion of Romanians about him and you will be surprised to find out that most Romanians actually regret he was shot(on Christmas day ). Yes,it's true, we had a rough life under him,but the curent situation of the country isn't his fault,it's the fault of the former communists which arranged his death (Ion Iliescu and the others from the Social Democrat Party our days).
Yes,maybe he had some mental problems,but look at the current status:we are a very poor country,nothing was built here in 15 years,we work as slaves in Spain and we are the garbage of all Europe.He didn't gave us money,but self-respect.
You speak about his Palace,well at least he built something for him and for us in this God forgotten country! And by the way,some sayd he had 1 mild. $,surprise: he never had,he was borned poor,he died poor.

Are you guys even leftists? You critisize every communist ruler,when you should take a good look at your own life! Guys like Ceausescu rose up from the poor and made hymself heard in the world! What have you ,,smart asses'' realised?

I am more than suprised by your reply (I didn't expect a positive view of him)! Looks like even the most cruel and economically unsuccesful (do you agree that Nikolai was economically unsuccsesful?) socialist states were better compared to what came after.

But I am very interested in what you (and other Romanians) think: What do you see as a positive thing from his period (what are the good things he did)? Dont you agree that many of his policies were bad (prohibition of abortion and contraception)? Can you give me any percentage (give me approximation if you don't know any results of surveys) how many Romanians view him as a positive person in Romanian history? Did an average Romanian lived better during socialism or now?

[Andrei]

First of all I would like to answer kingbee about the self-respect. I saw earlier on TV a news about the romanians working in Spain,and the Spanish introduced a new condition: the romanian workers must be tested for Ebola,pleague and other tropical diseases before working there.
No one can take that test because these diseases never occured in Romania.
Do the Spanish think we are africans?They think we are a colony or something?
Another example: An American movie producer wanted to make a shoot of a film in Romania which consisted in making a hole in the floor of the Antipa Museum,which is a national monument and older than his retarded country.
No one has respect for us anymore!!!
I would prefere to be called by europeans ,,communist bastard!'' than ,,poor guy,do u know how to write?''

For Jadan ja
Well I can't give you the results of a survey,because most of the the surveys made here are fake to trick the people.But what I can tell you is that alot of romanians regreat the actual communist period,not just Ceausescu.
You see,the ordinary romanian isn't interested in politics,he just wants a decent life,no matter the regime:democratic,communist or even fascist!
So,after 16 years of ,,democracy'' the people draw a line and saw:no medicins for old people,low wages,unemployment,coruption of justice,and most important NOTHING(0) was built here in 16 years...
Ceausescu offered us a stabil job,quite good wages,a medical and educational system and actually a link with the West(he had connection with americans).
Prohibition of abortion and contraception where introduced because the communist wanted to increase the population of the country (during communists our population more than doubled).
And my most strong argument for beying an old fashioned fanatic communist is that before 89' I had a happy life(no problems with food and money) and now,after my mother retired from her job,we live with 50 EUROS per month,that's her pension!!!
How about that?