what is sectarianism?

[peaccenicked]

" * A strong or excessive devotion to a particular form of religion, often leading to a resolute prejudice against other beliefs.
www.reasoned.org/glossary.htm

* Sectarianism is prejudice or discrimination based on religion or cultural association (ie discrimination shown by Catholic and Protestant groups in Northern Ireland towards each other).
www.peaceprg.co.uk/key_terms.htm

* a narrow-minded adherence to a particular sect or party or denomination; "he condemned religious sectarianism"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

* Sectarianism is an adherence to a particular sect or party or denomination. It also usually involves a rejection of those not a member of ones sect. A sectarian conflict usually refers to conflict along religious lines such as the conflicts between Catholics and Protestants in northern Ireland and western Scotland, or between Shia and Sunni Muslims. Often it is promoted by a group within the dominant community, such as the Orange Order in Ulster.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sectarianism"

These definitions from google give a broad sense of sectarianism but it has to be said that the term is sometimes abused. All debate can be closed by the use of this denounciation. Discussions should be either classed as fruitful or useless or perhaps frivolous. I have abandoned using the s word except when I am talking about the dangers of narrow-mindedness.

[321zero]

"Sectarianism" has a leftist pedigree not fully addressed by your quotes. In leftist circles it could be defined as placing the interests of your particular organisation above the needs of the class.

The trouble with this of course is that many organisations will argue that they represent the best expression of the interests of the working class. In each instance it is possible (tho given the number of such orgs stastistically unlikely) that they're right. ;)

One of my touchstones is that the best, the only, method of getting closer to the revolutionary 'truth' is to keep on debating and to out egos aside, so a commitment to democracy within the workers movement is essential. If you find yourself taking undemocratic measures for the sake of your organisation then you're sectarian, and already betraying interests of the class.

Of course I could be wrong about this. You gotta keep an open mind. :D

[321zero]

I have abandoned using the s word except when I am talking about the dangers of narrow-mindedness.

Probably a good idea. "Sectarian!" is one of the classic throwaway insults used on the left. More heat than light, y'know.

[bezdomni]

Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2006, 12:51 AM
"Sectarianism" has a leftist pedigree not fully addressed by your quotes. In leftist circles it could be defined as placing the interests of your particular organisation above the needs of the class.

The trouble with this of course is that many organisations will argue that they represent the best expression of the interests of the working class. In each instance it is possible (tho given the number of such orgs stastistically unlikely) that they're right. ;)

One of my touchstones is that the best, the only, method of getting closer to the revolutionary 'truth' is to keep on debating and to out egos aside, so a commitment to democracy within the workers movement is essential. If you find yourself taking undemocratic measures for the sake of your organisation then you're sectarian, and already betraying interests of the class.

Of course I could be wrong about this. You gotta keep an open mind. :D
YOUR DEFINITION OF SECTARIANISM IS SO SECTARIAN! :P

A sectarian is a person who is too dogmatic in their "beliefs" (be it anarchism, leninism, maoism or trotskyism) to fucntion.

Unfortunately, the word gets tossed around to describe anybody who disagrees with somebody else. IE, I could call anaomaly a sectarian anarchist if I really didn't feel like arguing with him; or he could call me a sectarian leninist if he didn't feel like arguing with me. ;)

It's also pretty prevalent amongst parties. All of the "splits" between parties result in, or are caused by severe sectarianism.

[Amusing Scrotum]

As Comrade Stalin put it in his musical Lenin on Ice: EVERYONE&#39;S a sectarian except I&#33; <_<

Really all groups are sectarian to a degree....and so is every Revolutionary Leftist. When it actually matters, is when people hold view X which means they can&#39;t do Y....and really that is sometimes justified, and sometimes not justified.

It all depends, really, on your personal political orientation.

[bezdomni]

As Comrade Stalin put it in his musical Lenin on Ice: EVERYONE&#39;S a sectarian except I&#33; dry.gif
:blink:

[redstar2000]

On the "left", I don&#39;t think it has an objectively demonstrable meaning; it&#39;s just something that you can label your adversary when you run out of arguments and evidence...it "sounds bad".

It would make just as much sense to call the person who disagrees with you "immoral". :lol:

Come to think of it, even that still happens occasionally. :o

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif

[Severian]

Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2006, 06:51 PM
"Sectarianism" has a leftist pedigree not fully addressed by your quotes. In leftist circles it could be defined as placing the interests of your particular organisation above the needs of the class.
I&#39;d call that "factionalism".

"Sectarianism" originally refers to a political group which acts like a religious sect and defines itself by graven-in-stone doctrines rather than by the needs of the living class struggle.


In addition, like everyone who claims to have in his pocket a panacea for the sufferings of the masses, he [Lasalle] gave his agitation, from the very start, a religious, sectarian character. In fact, every sect is religious. And just because he was the founder of a sect, he denied all natural connection with the earlier movement, both in Germany and abroad. He fell into Proudhon’s mistake of not seeking the real basis of his agitation in the actual elements of the class movement, but of wishing, instead, to prescribe for that movement a course determined by a certain doctrinaire recipe.
.....
You yourself know the difference between a sect movement and a class movement from personal experience. The sect seeks its raison d&#39;être and its point d&#39;honneur not in what it has in common with the class movement, but in the particular shibboleth distinguishing it from that movement.
From Marx&#39;s letter to Schweitzer (Lasalle&#39;s successor) (http://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1868/letters/68_10_13.htm)

"Sectarian" certainly can be used as a content-free insult, and probably it usually is. But it does have an actual meaning as well, which is worth thinking about and trying to avoid.

Nobody is free from sectarianism; it&#39;s a product of the situation most of us operate in. It has to be guarded against.

Those who think they have no problem with sectarianism are probably the biggest sectarians of all.