how should revolutionaries act?

[red_rapper]

in the movement, we encounter the lil stuff that make up the big things. i'm talking bout environment, child labour, religion and other cultural stuff. i'm part of our youth movement here in the phil. and i don't like it when my comrades here tell me that we should look at the big picture. yes, we should look at the big picture but we must also work on the small issues to change the big picture. issues like smoking, child labour, environmental concerns, religion and others. if we are to focus on the system, would it not be good to also pay attention to the lil things so that people would feel more comfortable when we introduce the movement?

this will also be going out to the issue posted by distorted morality about christianity.

[violencia.Proletariat]

What the hell does smoking have to do with communism?

[apathy maybe]

Who gives a shit what it has to do with communism? Communism is not the only thing you know.

As far as I call tell the person is saying that the revolution is not the only thing. We have to worry about what is happening a local level (pollution, child abuse, whatever) as well as look at the big picture.

This way people would be more inclined to take "communism" or anarchism or socialism more seriously. If they see anarchists or whoever working on things that affect them directly.

So fight against shit in your local community, and mention that you're a communist. People will take communism more seriously when they see that you (as supposedly intelligent educated person) are a communist. And that you do shit besides crap on about workers. Good idea me thinks.

[red_rapper]

i'm glad somebody understands my point. i've seen the film "challenges of cuba" and it talked about how cuba was able to produce much out of the lil things they had and how important sustainable development is. i guess smoking is not part of a sustainable developement.

[Delirium]

Many people here take the stance that people have the right to do what they want with thier lives/bodies as long as it is not harming another person.

I support this idea, and therefore i consider drugs, smoking, sex, ect... non issues as long as your pleasure is not attained by the exploitation of others.

As for local issues such as environmental degredation, homeless abuse, police brutality, child labor, or whatever. These are issues that need to be adressed on a local level, by the community. This is the way in which we will gain respect of working class peoples and begin to sow the seeds of communism.

[Kalki Avatar]

The first guy has a good idea.

The last guy thinks being as far left and anti mainstream as possible is the most important part of being communist is being unacceptable to everyone but the most anal who don't really like you but don't want to seem prejeduce.

[Wanted Man]

This is actually a pretty interesting topic, which a comrade wrote about in the Summer of 2004 for the magazine of our youth movement.

He classified two different sorts of communisms related to bricks: the "loose brick" communism, and "flying brick" communism. The former literally being people complaining about a brick in the road being loose, and the latter being comrades rioting by throwing bricks at cops because of subjects like war, the G8, etc.

The "loose brick" communists accuse the "flying bricks" of only trying to change the big picture without working for the common man, while the "flying bricks" say that the "loose bricks" should look at the big picture instead of simply petitioning the government about minor local issues. To be pleased about such minor achievements is "opportunism", according to them.

So of course, you need a bit of both worlds.

[violencia.Proletariat]

How can you put smoking on a list with child abuse and pollution? They are totally unrelated!


As far as I call tell the person is saying that the revolution is not the only thing. We have to worry about what is happening a local level (pollution, child abuse, whatever) as well as look at the big picture.

This way people would be more inclined to take "communism" or anarchism or socialism more seriously. If they see anarchists or whoever working on things that affect them directly.

And this is a new discovery? NEFAC along with most other groups already does this.

[Messiah]

I guess this is sort of Chomsky's practical approach to anarchism and politics in general. Yes, we have ideals, and the ideals are what we always have to keep in mind but in the process we can not abandon the little things. The example he used in one of his interviews was that he votes in local elections because he thinks funding schools and firefighters is important, and healthcare and what have you. Even though some anarchists call him a traitor and what have you for voting, he says he votes where he thinks it matters. That is to say, the closer to the grass roots, the better.

It's the little things that make up the big things. Or did I totally miss the point here?

[Fistful of Steel]

Paying attention to the bigger picture is good, but the details also have to be taken account. You can't lose site of the picture for the details, but you don't want to ignore them completely as that would be pretty useless if you live undyingly for some lofty ideal while ignoring inconsistencies in life.

[leftist resistance]

In my opinion,there are somethings we can't do much about.
Eg. smoking.Even though it has been scientifically-proven that smoking increases a person's chances of developing cancer and other chronic diseases,people are still turning a blind eye.Images that depicts the after-effects of smoking are pasted on cigarrete boxes as a deterrent but people still buy it.It is a personal choice of the individual.

Although I think it is good to highlight the other issues you mentioned like environment,child labour,etc because those are things we can and must do something about.

By the way,what do you exactly mean by the 'big' and 'lil' pictures?

[Noah]

Hmm large cigarette companies make alot of money, if people stopped buying the cigarettes the government would have less money to make bombs with.

Grow your own cannabis instead and share it for free with your friends.

I think, you need a bit of both worlds. You need to do small things, within school for example and change things that might not be directly linked to communism but improves circumstances.

But also doing bigger things like joining large protests and rallies.

Both of these together, working hand in hand, will eventually change the frame of mind (class conciousness) of the working class to prepare them for revolution.

[drain.you]

for a second i imagined this thread being' how should revolutionaries.....style their hair'. oh well lol.

dont think you can have a guide of how a revolutionary should be. everyone has their own views on everything, hell, we cant even agree on how the revolution itself should be.

the 'little stuff' comes after the revolution obviously. the revolution is the lefties taking power from the capitalists and setting up their own way of doing things, their own society, complete with 'issues like smoking, child labour, environmental concerns, religion and others'.

and you cant decide the 'little issues' before the revolution because it will be the people who decide, not a handful of elite. sure you could go and ask everyone what they want now but that wont reflect what they'll want after the revolution even if the revolution begin 2moro.

[Wanted Man]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2006, 01:55 PM
Hmm large cigarette companies make alot of money, if people stopped buying the cigarettes the government would have less money to make bombs with.

Grow your own cannabis instead and share it for free with your friends.
Hmm large food companies make a lot of money, if people stopped buying the food the government would have less money to make bombs with.

Grow your own food instead and share it for free with your friends.

So where do you pull the line on what you should and shouldn't buy under capitalism?

[Messiah]

Growing your own food where ever and when ever possible is a great idea. The practice of utmost self-sufficiency should be something we should all practice. Or, thrift at least. Sometimes we simply don't have the means to grow our own food or whatever else, but I think everyone can be a more aware "consumer" as it were.

You have to face the realities of living in a capitalist society, but it doesn't mean you can't do certain things on your own either.

[Tickin' TimebOmb John]

i have 2 agree with drain.you, that when issues like the enviroment become important is following a revolution. Campaignin about pollution in todays capitalist society is pointless, unless its part of a larger program for complete societal change e.g. communism, as pollution is never goin 2 be cut significantly when big business rules the roost, as the things that are causin some of the most damagin pollution make em too much money. this is jus one exaample altho tis true for other issues that have been mentioned, facin these issues within capitalism is irrelevant as the neccesary changes in such areas will never come about.

as 4 smokin i dont see what the problem is, as long as people dnt force it on others, its a personal choice.

wetha people grow their own food or not is irrelevant, that whole back-to-the-land argument really annoys me. its neccesary to be a consumer within a capitalist system to survive, so consume, as long as you act against consumerist and corporate goals on a larger scale.

[AK47]

Yes, the small things are important. The little isues need to be followed up. Your communist/anarchist lenz has to cause action. Be it war on drugs or overdevelopment/ urban sprall or funding education or whatever. It is just some people can't see the trees through the forrest or visa virsa.

[RaiseYourVoice]

I also agree, leftists should engage in local politics and social life to show the people we are there for them, that will make them more open for our messages too.

i was on a conference this weekend with alot of marxists... they wanted to wait till the dawn of world revolution for any action... no protests, no politics, with coca cola on the table and nike shirts.... they said one could integrate into the system till there is a new one. well thats not really helping our cause i think.

Fight for justice and show solidarity with the oppressed, thats the road to at least more support i think.

making smoking a leftist issue is rather counterproductive i think because its more of a personall choice. child labor, enviromental destruction etc. are good points though because they are directly linked to capitalism

[red_rapper]

thanks for all your thoughts comrades!

being a political activist and cultural rev is a good way in winning the struggle.

let fix some stuff on my first message. being involved in local issues is a way of empowering young people to being socialy involved. after they are into sociatal change, we must never forget in bringing their consciousness to the system level. forgetting to raise the level of environmental activist and other activist that are not political activist yet to a level where they can see the relationship between capitalism and destruction and socialism and sustainability.

all of us should try to make sweeping activities to empower more youth the be involved and then bring them to the movement. it is hard to tell people something that they can not yet comprehend.

[Noah]

So where do you pull the line on what you should and shouldn't buy under capitalism?

Well people don't need cigarettes to live..but obviously people need food to live.

[Iroquois Xavier]

Its the little things that make the big things happen.

[Tickin' TimebOmb John]

QUOTE
So where do you pull the line on what you should and shouldn't buy under capitalism?



Well people don't need cigarettes to live..but obviously people need food to live

there are lots of things that are not essential to life, but that we still do, buying a computer with which to use the internet is not essential, but still most individuals on this website will own a cpu. there are loads of other examples. boycotts of certain business will not end capitalism, nor will it end that business, even in an extreme situation where it did it wld jus b replaced by anotha business, tackling issues from a consumerist angle, like boycotts n such dnt endorse radical change 2 the system, more small reforms that do very little 4 anyone.

[Brekisonphilous]

Well, I do stuff in my community to combat local problems until the revolution. I pick up a lot of litter just to clean things up. I volunteer. and still promote the big picture while focusing on the little ones that ultimately effect our lives the most directly.

[Orange Juche]

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2006, 08:12 PM
I guess this is sort of Chomsky's practical approach to anarchism and politics in general. Yes, we have ideals, and the ideals are what we always have to keep in mind but in the process we can not abandon the little things. The example he used in one of his interviews was that he votes in local elections because he thinks funding schools and firefighters is important, and healthcare and what have you. Even though some anarchists call him a traitor and what have you for voting, he says he votes where he thinks it matters. That is to say, the closer to the grass roots, the better.

It's the little things that make up the big things. Or did I totally miss the point here?
I see what you're saying, but they guy voted for John Kerry. He said "John Kerry was the only option" (I saw the words come out of his mouth about 20 yards away). He's a sellout. I have little to no respect for anything he has to say politically.

[Guest]

Originally posted by [email protected] 10 2006, 11:39 PM
Well, I do stuff in my community to combat local problems until the revolution. I pick up a lot of litter just to clean things up. I volunteer. and still promote the big picture while focusing on the little ones that ultimately effect our lives the most directly.
Well, stuff like this is charity, and it gives big business a reason not to do shit. For example, if you pick up littler, now the government doesn`t have to bother with a trash program. If you donate to red cross to help with relief stuff, now Bush can continue using the troops in war and he doesn`t have to worry about cleaning up at home. So maybe that example isn`t the best but I agree with you in the general sense --

In terms of focusing only on the big picture. Some people say revolution and nothing else, and that is silly, because you need stepping stones to get there. Most people are not born revolutionaries, they become revolutionaries through struggle, which is usally from reforms. So for example you and some others mobilize against environmental destruction and win a reform, that`s cool. When those others continue seeing forests destroyed even though they won that reform, they will start to understand the big picture. ;)

That`s according to Lenin -- that the `big picture` type change (revolution) won`t come through itself, but through little stuff, like reforms.