White Nationalism

[Abood]

What's the difference between white nationalism and national socialism?

[AdamCecil]

Isn't it that White Nationalism chooses to go after every race that isn't the "perfect" white one?

[VonClausewitz]

White nationalism - White supremacy basically. If you're not white and anglo-saxon descended, you're an unter-mensch who isn't deserving of life. The KKK are white nationalists, so are the National Front.

National Socialism - Socialism within national borders. Unless you meant Nazism ?

Nazism - Aryan Supremacists - Germanic/Nordic blood descent, white, pathological hatred of Jews, Hitler and other 'Leader' worship. They try to cling to some kind of socialistic belief, but it all looks hollow when you consider their generally genocidal tendeancies.

[Abood]

National Socialism - Socialism within national borders. Unless you meant Nazism ?
Isn't National Socialism the same as Nazism?

[VonClausewitz]

Well, literally no - it's two distinct ideas, but no-one ever makes the distinction, so unless your talking with either someone who knows, or is extremely pedantic, the two terms are pretty inter-changable.

[bezdomni]

National Socialism is somewhat synonymous with fascism. Fascism is independent of race, whereas Nazism/White Nationalism...et cetera are both nationalist and racist.

Pure nationalism only presumes that your nationality is superior. For example, Mussolini said that Italy was glorious and deserves the right to meddle in all of the Italians affairs and control all Italians so their state can have glory.

Nazism and racist nationalism say that nationality x is the best because we also have ethnicity x. All people who are of nationality y and race y are inferior and are our slaves.

If you want a historical example:
Mussolini/Franco - Pure Fascist/National Socialist
Hitler - Nazi/Aryan Nationalist/Racist Nationalist

[Forward Union]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2006, 03:44 PM
National Socialism - Socialism within national borders. Unless you meant Nazism ?
Find one single national socialist organisation that fit's that ideological description. Or one source that agrees with you.

National socialism and Nazism are exactly the same thing.

[Atlas Swallowed]

Who cares they bleed the same.

[black magick hustla]

National Socialism (Nazism): Basically fascism with a racist vendetta. It isn't necessarily centered around the Germanic race though.

White nationalism: White supremacy. It can take many forms though. The KKK is white nationalist and they advocate a form of "white bourgeois democracy".

[VonClausewitz]

Additives free, you didn't read how I further elaborated on that did you ?

I'm sure the myraid [insert country name] Socialist Party, could fit that description, I'm sure that there is an organistation out there that fits it well, after all, the far left is always making up new political denominations, it stands to reason that the centrists/rightists will aswell.

[JKP]

The word nazi comes from the German pronunciation of national. (nazi-nal)

[Zingu]

Originally posted by Additives [email protected] 25 2006, 09:39 PM
National socialism and Nazism are exactly the same thing.
I beg to differ. The term "National Socialism" was used by a Frenchman (forgot name) back in 1889. Sorry it doesn't fit the leftist dogma of things, but its true.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2006, 03:28 PM

If you want a historical example:
Mussolini/Franco - Pure Fascist/National Socialist
Hitler - Nazi/Aryan Nationalist/Racist Nationalist
I'm not sure I'd agree with this characteristic, at least in Franco's case. He was certainly a Castillian supremacist, given his treamtnet of minority groups and languages within Spain.

[JKP]

Originally posted by Zingu+Mar 25 2006, 10:18 PM--> (Zingu @ Mar 25 2006, 10:18 PM)
Additives [email protected] 25 2006, 09:39 PM
National socialism and Nazism are exactly the same thing.
I beg to differ. The term "National Socialism" was used by a Frenchman (forgot name) back in 1889. Sorry it doesn't fit the leftist dogma of things, but its true. [/b]
That's just a word. He didn't have fascist idealogy behind it. Unless you have evidence to the contrary.

[Zingu]

Originally posted by JKP+Mar 26 2006, 09:50 AM--> (JKP @ Mar 26 2006, 09:50 AM)
Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2006, 10:18 PM

Additives [email protected] 25 2006, 09:39 PM
National socialism and Nazism are exactly the same thing.
I beg to differ. The term "National Socialism" was used by a Frenchman (forgot name) back in 1889. Sorry it doesn't fit the leftist dogma of things, but its true.
That's just a word. He didn't have fascist idealogy behind it. Unless you have evidence to the contrary. [/b]

...In 1889 Barres had been elected to represent the eastern city of Nacy in parliament as a follower of General Boulanger, a soldier who had promised to cleanse France of corrupt parliamentary politicians. Barres's electoral campaign, moreover, has exploited antisemitism of the Nacy population.
Increasingly he saw nationalism as the solution to all problems. A few weeks before the Aigues-Mortes massacure, Barres wrote a series of pieces for the daily Le Figaro, under a headline that needs little elucidation: 'Against forgeigners'. These articles were published at a time of poor relations between Italy and France, when Italian immigrants were regarded as potentional spies. Barres was not directly responsible for the events at Aigues-Mortes, but his novels and political journalism linked popular xenophobia with the intellectual origins of fascism. In 1898 Barres referred to himself as a 'national socialist'.

Maurice Barres, wrote the novel Le Jardin de Berenice.

[Disciple of Prometheus]

Hitler and the Nazi's where National Socialist, and the term Nazi comes from National Socialism because in German it is Nationalsozialismus, and the Nazi's were known as the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, or the NSDAP, so Nazism, and National Socialism is the same thing entirely.

Mussolini and the Fascists were not National Socialist because they did not endorse the racial hygiene ideaology that Hitler did, and they also favored a Corpratist economic system, not an manipulated Socialist system that Hitler had.

Also the Frenchman I believe your reffering to might be Comte de Gobineau, perhaps? If so, to my knowledge he did not use the term National Socialism, however he did give Hitler ammo for his racial doctrine.

Also White Nationalism is concerned with "white rights," and say stuff like "we want to see the liberation of our people," and such, but I feel they are only "selling snake oil," when they say this, because I saw on their websites members of various rascist organizations.

[JKP]

Originally posted by Zingu+Mar 26 2006, 12:43 PM--> (Zingu @ Mar 26 2006, 12:43 PM)
Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2006, 09:50 AM

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2006, 10:18 PM

Additives [email protected] 25 2006, 09:39 PM
National socialism and Nazism are exactly the same thing.
I beg to differ. The term "National Socialism" was used by a Frenchman (forgot name) back in 1889. Sorry it doesn't fit the leftist dogma of things, but its true.
That's just a word. He didn't have fascist idealogy behind it. Unless you have evidence to the contrary.

...In 1889 Barres had been elected to represent the eastern city of Nacy in parliament as a follower of General Boulanger, a soldier who had promised to cleanse France of corrupt parliamentary politicians. Barres's electoral campaign, moreover, has exploited antisemitism of the Nacy population.
Increasingly he saw nationalism as the solution to all problems. A few weeks before the Aigues-Mortes massacure, Barres wrote a series of pieces for the daily Le Figaro, under a headline that needs little elucidation: 'Against forgeigners'. These articles were published at a time of poor relations between Italy and France, when Italian immigrants were regarded as potentional spies. Barres was not directly responsible for the events at Aigues-Mortes, but his novels and political journalism linked popular xenophobia with the intellectual origins of fascism. In 1898 Barres referred to himself as a 'national socialist'.

Maurice Barres, wrote the novel Le Jardin de Berenice. [/b]
An anti-semitic conservative; close, but he's no Nazi.

[Zingu]

All I am saying is that the term "National Socialist" has been used by other political stratums. Its sort of how Stalinism is also equated with communism by the mainstream.

[Dooga Aetrus Blackrazor]

National Socialism is an ideology involving socialism within a single nation. It has nothing to do with race. It was the stated ideology of the Nazis, but they did not conform to socialist ideals. Nationalism is quite contrary to mainstream socialist ideology.

White Nationalism is wanting to achieve a nation containing only people of the white race.

[Forward Union]

Originally posted by Zingu+Mar 26 2006, 06:18 AM--> (Zingu @ Mar 26 2006, 06:18 AM)
Additives [email protected] 25 2006, 09:39 PM
National socialism and Nazism are exactly the same thing.
I beg to differ. The term "National Socialism" was used by a Frenchman (forgot name) back in 1889. Sorry it doesn't fit the leftist dogma of things, but its true. [/b]
pre 1930's the term NAZISM didn't exist. But now the term National Socialism and Nazism are synonimous.

[Forward Union]

Originally posted by Dooga Aetrus [email protected] 28 2006, 08:33 PM
National Socialism is an ideology involving socialism within a single nation.
Back this idiocy up.

[Disciple of Prometheus]

Originally posted by Dooga Aetrus [email protected] 28 2006, 08:33 PM
National Socialism is an ideology involving socialism within a single nation. It has nothing to do with race. It was the stated ideology of the Nazis, but they did not conform to socialist ideals
National Socialism fought for the "liberation," and the "exhalation," of the Nordic/Germanic people of Europe; hence why they initially tried to deport those deemed "unclean," but upon finding nowhere that would allow this massive immigration, the started the ghetto plan, then the camp plan. The executed jews, homosexuals, the mentally handicap, the senile elderly, black people, and all others who were "racially impure," and "physical inferior," to the Aryan superman ideal. So in other words, race hygiene, and eugenics were the corner stones of the Nazi ideology. Tell all the Nazi soldier veterans, and jewish survivors that I have talked to that said the exact same thing, that were wrong.

[Dooga Aetrus Blackrazor]

Originally posted by Disciple of Prometheus+Mar 28 2006, 11:16 PM--> (Disciple of Prometheus @ Mar 28 2006, 11:16 PM)
Dooga Aetrus [email protected] 28 2006, 08:33 PM
National Socialism is an ideology involving socialism within a single nation. It has nothing to do with race. It was the stated ideology of the Nazis, but they did not conform to socialist ideals
National Socialism fought for the "liberation," and the "exhalation," of the Nordic/Germanic people of Europe; hence why they initially tried to deport those deemed "unclean," but upon finding nowhere that would allow this massive immigration, the started the ghetto plan, then the camp plan. The executed jews, homosexuals, the mentally handicap, the senile elderly, black people, and all others who were "racially impure," and "physical inferior," to the Aryan superman ideal. So in other words, race hygiene, and eugenics were the corner stones of the Nazi ideology. Tell all the Nazi soldier veterans, and jewish survivors that I have talked to that said the exact same thing, that were wrong. [/b]
National Socialism is historically associated and synonymous with Nazism because National Socialism, as an ideology, is not known about. I do not support National Socialism and find it contradictory, but it does exist. Therefore, I think it takes priority over the definition of National Socialism as Nazism because National Socialism as a nationalist form of socialism is the original definition and a more logical definition in accordance with the name.

Trotsky even used it to refer to socialism in one country. Just because something is the most widely known definition doesn't mean it's a reasonable one.

[JudeObscure84]

National Socialism and most white supremisist theory is based on a syndicalist or guild socialist structure. They, like the Fascists, wanted to undue everything that the Enlightment stood for, namely Liberalism(capitalism), Socialism, and Communism and turn back the clock to nationalist, communal, blood and soil type of living. They believe this to be true socialism and brotherhood.

They think both Liberalism and Communism are an invention of the Jews to unite the world and bring down thier national soverignty. They are anti-globalization, protectionist, anti-communist, and believe in violence to solve thier means.

They are a pathalogical movement based on violence. They are similar to the anarchist, and had that pre-punk attitude that embodies neo-nazi punks today.

[Disciple of Prometheus]

Originally posted by Dooga Aetrus [email protected] 28 2006, 11:24 PM
National Socialism is historically associated and synonymous with Nazism because National Socialism, as an ideology, is not known about. I do not support National Socialism and find it contradictory, but it does exist. Therefore, I think it takes priority over the definition of National Socialism as Nazism because National Socialism as a nationalist form of socialism is the original definition and a more logical definition in accordance with the name.


Did you not see the first post I wrote in this thread? Nazism=National Socialism, the term "nazi," came from the shorting of National Socialism, though it has to be in Deutsche to see it. They never were, and never will be separate.

[Dooga Aetrus Blackrazor]

Originally posted by Disciple of [email protected] 28 2006, 11:42 PM

Did you not see the first post I wrote in this thread? Nazism=National Socialism, the term "nazi," came from the shorting of National Socialism, though it has to be in Deutsche to see it. They never were, and never will be separate. [/quote]
Nazism and National Socialism mean the same thing to most people. I never denied that, but there are other definitions for National Socialism - definitions that make more sense, in my opinion, given the name. Either way, this argument is moot, in my opinion, because I am sure with both oppose National Socialism as Nazism or as a nationalist, socialist ideology.

[JudeObscure84]

He's right Slobadan Milosovich had a National Socialist party too. It wasnt quite Nazism but it was close.