L'etranger

[Janus]

Some call it The Stranger and some call it The Outsider. What are your thoughts on it, those of you who have read it. Feel free to discuss the Myth of Sisyphus as well or absurdims in general if you wish.

[Hegemonicretribution]

As you may have guessed from the other thread, I have read this book ;)

I think it is perhaps my favourite existentialist text. It sums up the existentialist view, whilst not being so condescending as to necessarily sugarcoat, or demonise the existentialist's actions without morality.

It also highlights the plight of an outsider, not just as an existentialist, but in the more abstract sense. The alienation experienced by the character was a result of the failure of a sovereign body to even understand him.

The contrast also works very effectively...actually it is a great alround book.

[Janus]

You consider The Stranger to be existentialist rather than absurdist. It seems to me that existentialists believe that we have a certain degree of control over our environments while absurdists believe that we have really non control over it.

Camus explicitly stated that he was not an existentialist in an interview with a French magazine.

[Mariam]

It was said that Camus wrote his novel in order to criticize Sarter's existential point of view, though i find it a mixture of both.
Its not as existential as The Crime and Punishment, and not as absurd as Waiting for Godott.However, it could be seen as a post-modern realistic novel and i dont mean literary realistic, but the way Camus puts it in the first part (before the prison part) it seems so real in a post-moden world, and it could happen to any one.
Last course i had to write an essay about wheather or not you find the protagonist a hero, and way..what do you think??

[Janus]

Last course i had to write an essay about wheather or not you find the protagonist a hero
He's usually considered an anti-hero.

[Mariam]

commonly an anti-hero, but think about the way he accepts his death, think of his leap of faith, the happieness he finds while he's getting closer to death.
some how he's alomst like Sisyphus, that what makes Merusault an unforgetable character as we expect a hero to be like Santiago in The Old Man and The Sea, but he's not...

[Hegemonicretribution]

Well yes I suppose Camus was absurdist, I was using the term loosely. I was never to fond of Satre, and I just saw Camus as a more coherent extension. Anyway, I was thinking about a thread along these lines in the philosophy forum, so we can continue this in there.

I do consider Mersault a hero however, only the ambiguity of the ending could possibly affect the status of Mersault.

[Mariam]

I do agree that he's a hero, because not all could accept their fate with a smile on their faces. Mersault is a post-modern sisyphus, some how sisyphus is absurd for rolling a rock to the top of the mountian and watching it fall is total absurdity.
But i dont think that Camus is it indecating pure absurdity...

[Janus]

Anyway, I was thinking about a thread along these lines in the philosophy forum, so we can continue this in there.
Sure. That seems like a pretty good idea. After all, you are the mod of that forum.

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2006, 06:08 PM
But i dont think that Camus is it indecating pure absurdity...
Neither do I. It seems that if this was his intention that he would have created a more pesimistic tale. Merusault is free to choose the course of action that he wishes, and this can either conform to or reject social expectations, however he is condemned to choose and not merely accept. Even in the latter part of the book, where he induldges in self deception he recognises this for what it is.

The indifference shown for the most part of the book would indicate absurdism to a large extent, but there is preference that suggests something above this...who knows?


Sure. That seems like a pretty good idea. After all, you are the mod of that forum.
Started one now, initially on the concept of nothingness, but feel free to discuss whatever within it.

[The Feral Underclass]

It is above all the single most relevant piece of fiction tabout our condition that has ever been written.

I have quoted 'The Outsider' many times on this board and even have it quoted in my blog.

The last pages of the book sum up clearly Camus' position on life and the struggles within it.

Mersault is neither a hero nor an anti-hero, he is a person forced into an absurd situation without any control over it, no matter how absurd it clearly is.

He makes no statement of intention nor attempts to create/destroy or understand anything. He simply explains his situation and how he feels.

[7189]

Meursault is my hero. He accepts that life is pointless and therefore doesn't bother to conform to the stupid unwritten rules of the society he lives in. His revelation of life's absurdity does not disturb him, in fact, he enjoys it. Unlike the main character from Sartre's 'Nausea', another book of a similar theme and an excellent text to compare with 'The Outsider', he actually makes the most of life, which is in my opinion, the best thing to do.

[Comrade Marcel]

For some reason the ending of this reminded me of the way Native Sun ended. Very unsettling. The stories are actually kind of similiar (different contexts) and both are great works.