the simpsons [Archive]

Angry Young Man

21st March 2006, 12:33

Is it just me, or is Matt Groening a genius in the field of social commentary, particularly using Lisa as the idealist and Mr Burns as a corrupt business man.
And then there's Family Guy, which just mocks all the inequalities and injustices, rather well, I might add.
I can't think of any particular quotes off-hand, but just watch them more carefully.

RebelOutcast

21st March 2006, 13:35

The simpsons is horrible, The lisa character is just another idiot posing as an intellectual while espousing the "American Dream".
The series has been going on for far too long now, but they won't let it die quietly, they've just scheduled another two seasons.

Cult of Reason

21st March 2006, 17:14

I like the Simpson's except for Lisa.

Psy

21st March 2006, 18:19

As far as I can remeber, Lisa was most revolutionary in "Last Exit to Springfield" where Homer lead a labour strike at the Springfield nuclear power plant with Lisa singing:

"Come gather round children, it's high time ye learns
'Bout a hero named Homer and a devil named Burns
We'll march till we drop, the girls and the fellas
We'll fight to the death or else fold like umbrellas.
So we'll march day and night by the big cooling tower
They have the plant, but we have the power.."

Mostly Lisa is just a enivormentalist and harmless to the class system.

Angry Young Man

21st March 2006, 19:01

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2006, 06:22 PM
Mostly Lisa is just a enivormentalist and harmless to the class system.
What about when she talks about social injustices? Anyway, aren't most environmentalists at least moderately left-wing?

Psy

21st March 2006, 19:09

Originally posted by chairmanmick+Mar 21 2006, 07:04 PM--> (chairmanmick @ Mar 21 2006, 07:04 PM)
[email protected] 21 2006, 06:22 PM
Mostly Lisa is just a enivormentalist and harmless to the class system.
What about when she talks about social injustices? Anyway, aren't most environmentalists at least moderately left-wing?[/b]
In "Last Exit to Springfield" Lisa was supporting a labour movment, yes it stoped once they got their dential plan back but it still threatened Burns.

Yes eviormentalist are on the left but are only a small threat to the owning class. As for her talking about social injustices, well she really has never done much about said social injustices.

RebelOutcast

21st March 2006, 20:11

Have you seen the episode where bart gets sent on an exchange programme and in return the simpsons accomodate an albanian? Do you remember how lisa argued against communism?

loveme4whoiam

21st March 2006, 20:19

The Simpsons were my favourite comedy programme, and to a certain extent it always will be. Although it's crown has passed to Family Guy, its still packs in the laughs. I agree though, it has gone on for too long. I even heard they were going to do some movies, but I doubt anything came of that.

There's a book out at the moment by some sociologist or other, stating how The Simpsons has influenced a generation of people in their beliefs. Its not a mick-take, its a genuine sociological look. I haven't read it though, it's bloody enormous.

Psy

21st March 2006, 20:36

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2006, 08:14 PM
Have you seen the episode where bart gets sent on an exchange programme and in return the simpsons accomodate an albanian? Do you remember how lisa argued against communism?
She was defending the myth of the American ideals

Adil: How can you defend a country where five percent of the people
control ninety-five percent of the wealth?
Lisa: I'm defending a country where people can think and act
and worship any way they want.
Adil: Cannot!
Lisa: Can too!
Adil: Cannot!
Lisa: Can too!
Homer: Please, please, kids, stop fighting.
Maybe Lisa's right about America being the land of opportunity,
and maybe Adil's got a point about the machinery of capitalism
being oiled with the blood of the workers.

SanPatricio'sSoul

21st March 2006, 23:17

Originally posted by Psy+Mar 21 2006, 08:39 PM--> (Psy @ Mar 21 2006, 08:39 PM)
[email protected] 21 2006, 08:14 PM
Have you seen the episode where bart gets sent on an exchange programme and in return the simpsons accomodate an albanian? Do you remember how lisa argued against communism?
She was defending the myth of the American ideals

Adil: How can you defend a country where five percent of the people
control ninety-five percent of the wealth?
Lisa: I'm defending a country where people can think and act
and worship any way they want.
Adil: Cannot!
Lisa: Can too!
Adil: Cannot!
Lisa: Can too!
Homer: Please, please, kids, stop fighting.
Maybe Lisa's right about America being the land of opportunity,
and maybe Adil's got a point about the machinery of capitalism
being oiled with the blood of the workers. [/b]
that quote is classic though :lol:

Janus

21st March 2006, 23:33

Well at least the Simpsons isn't just another brainless sitcom that has nothing worth of value. The producers are somewhat witty and are able to comment on the current political situation.

But yeah, I remember that episode. Wasn't Adil's last name Hoxha or something?

Jimmie Higgins

21st March 2006, 23:38

Though the show has had ups and downs in the quality of writing, overall, I think it is one of the best American satires ever... definatley they best satire on TV (although the Daily Show is now a strong contender as well). "Family Guy" may pack in more laughs, but it is more absurdist than satire and also has more reactionary jokes in the name of "shock-value".

All the characters are representations of things in the US population and Lisa represents the liberal idealism. She is not a revolutionary and the writers mock her (and therfore liberal idealism) to varying degrees of sucess. She's also a snob despite her ideals... very fitting since liberals in the US are also some of the biggest snobs.

Homer is a cartoon representation of the American working class... it's sad but in politics he represents mixed consiousness pretty well... having a revolutionary observation one moment and chanting "U-S-A... U-S-A..!" the next. THe writers are astute and clerver, but they are not revolutionaries, so their lampoon of the American worker isn't all that flattering or optomistic.

Mr. Burns will be a long-lasting symbol of American Capitalism like the Monopoly Man or the banker from "It's a wonderful life". He is the best villian of the 90s and I think when people think back about American capitalism at the end of the 20th century, they will think about Enron and Mr. Burns.

Next Season, they need Wolfcastle (the Arnold Swartzenegger character) to become Govoner of whatever state Springfield is in.

South Park sucks.

bed_of_nails

22nd March 2006, 01:39

I adore The Simpsons, actually. It just amuses me in general.

bezdomni

22nd March 2006, 04:08

Psy

22nd March 2006, 04:22

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2006, 11:41 PM
Though the show has had ups and downs in the quality of writing, overall, I think it is one of the best American satires ever... definatley they best satire on TV (although the Daily Show is now a strong contender as well). "Family Guy" may pack in more laughs, but it is more absurdist than satire and also has more reactionary jokes in the name of "shock-value".

All the characters are representations of things in the US population and Lisa represents the liberal idealism. She is not a revolutionary and the writers mock her (and therfore liberal idealism) to varying degrees of sucess. She's also a snob despite her ideals... very fitting since liberals in the US are also some of the biggest snobs.

Homer is a cartoon representation of the American working class... it's sad but in politics he represents mixed consiousness pretty well... having a revolutionary observation one moment and chanting "U-S-A... U-S-A..!" the next. THe writers are astute and clerver, but they are not revolutionaries, so their lampoon of the American worker isn't all that flattering or optomistic.

Mr. Burns will be a long-lasting symbol of American Capitalism like the Monopoly Man or the banker from "It's a wonderful life". He is the best villian of the 90s and I think when people think back about American capitalism at the end of the 20th century, they will think about Enron and Mr. Burns.

Next Season, they need Wolfcastle (the Arnold Swartzenegger character) to become Govoner of whatever state Springfield is in.

South Park sucks.
Don't foget Homers Mom did take part in sabotaging Burns biological weapon research lab yet has been running from the law since.

Psy

22nd March 2006, 04:56

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2006, 04:11 AM
Lisa is not supposed to be a threat to the class system, she is a child!

In "Scuse Me While I Miss The Sky" Bart overloads the power generators while Lisa ponders the ethics of direct action. To me this make Bart more a threat to the class system as he is willing to take action, Bart just doesn't have the ideas to guide his actions.

Eleutherios

22nd March 2006, 07:41

I liked the episode where Homer got into a fight with George Bush Sr. :D

Vladislav

22nd March 2006, 08:02

American Dad is funny

Comrade Marcel

22nd March 2006, 10:18

The Simpson's rocks!

Of course it's not revolutionary or Marxist, but atleast, as Janus pointed out it's not mindless bullshit.

Lisa represents the Michael Moore liberal type. Some of the things she says are mildy progressive.

The best episode was when Homer "steals" the submarine, Russia goes back to Socialism and Lenin bursts out of the monsoleum. :D

Angry Young Man

22nd March 2006, 10:31

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2006, 08:05 AM
American Dad is funny
American Dad is brilliant. Now THAT'S a social commentary. There is no way around it.

Jimmie Higgins

22nd March 2006, 10:32

I love that Mr. Burns privitized light by blocking out the sun... somewhere a PG&E executive exclaimed "D'oh!" when he saw that episode and realized they had taken his idea.

I think because the show is animated they can get away with a lot more political stuff than live action shows... it's like "Boondocks", it's ok if a little cartoon kid is saying something political and provocative, but if Kanye West says somthing much more mild on a NBC fundraiser, it's considered a threat.

Also there is more drug use by main characters (especially children) on that show than any live action show including cop shows and soap operas.

Homer: addicted to moraphine, has perscription pot, licks toads, pops painkillers, inhales fumes...
Marge: "All I'm high on is a little: 'love for my son and daughter'. That's right LSD is the only high I need"
Bart: Slushie-junkie. Purchased a bong at a flea-market
Lisa: Drank some bad water and had a acid-trip from it.
Otto: Crank, Pot, LSD, PCP, etc

Oh, yeah, there was that whole episode where they entire town drank fruit drinks that homer put shrooms in by accident.

1984

23rd March 2006, 14:33

There are many anti-communist quotes on the Simpsons... I remember Homer talking about how "...Socialism works on THEORY." and in the episode they went to China there were some things I got angry with. But there's much more parody of the "American way of life" and society that makes it worthy... and look at Mr. Burns, for instance... :lol: I suppose the makers of the cartoon only had a poor image of Communism or tried to make the parody "neutral" in the long run.

Anyway, there are better cartoons... Family Guy is incredible... The Critic is so acid it's sweet, The Oblongs is quite sad, but true... and the one I enjoy the most, albeit not political at all, is the most intelligent satire of married life I've ever seen... Bob & Margaret.

:lol:

RedStarOverChina

23rd March 2006, 14:38

Originally posted by Psy+Mar 22 2006, 12:05 AM--> (Psy @ Mar 22 2006, 12:05 AM)
[email protected] 22 2006, 04:11 AM
Lisa is not supposed to be a threat to the class system, she is a child!

In "Scuse Me While I Miss The Sky" Bart overloads the power generators while Lisa ponders the ethics of direct action. To me this make Bart more a threat to the class system as he is willing to take action, Bart just doesn't have the ideas to guide his actions. [/b]
I agree 100%.

I LOVE Bart and he's 10 times the rebel Lisa could ever be.

The pizza crazed Anarchist

24th March 2006, 05:48

This one is my favorite episode.

Russian/Soviet Diplomat:The Soviet Union will be pleased to offer amnesty to your wayward vessel.
US Diplomat: Soviet Union? I thought you guys broke up.
Russian/Soviet Diplomat: Nyet! That's what we wanted you to think, hahahahahaha!
Zombie Lenin: Must crush capitalism... grrr

Janus

24th March 2006, 05:55

Yeah, that was a pretty funny episode especially Grandpa's statement:
"My Homer is not a communist. He may be a liar, a pig, an idiot, a communist, but he is not a porn star."

Zombie Lenin: Must crush capitalism... grrr
Lenin: But first I must enact the New Economic Policy grrr...

Janus

24th March 2006, 05:57

Comrade Simpson? Check out this site:Comrade Homer (http://www.onesolutionrevolution.de/zeitung/wire04/homer-en.htm).

LoneRed

24th March 2006, 06:12

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2006, 01:44 PM
The simpsons is horrible, The lisa character is just another idiot posing as an intellectual while espousing the "American Dream".
The series has been going on for far too long now, but they won't let it die quietly, they've just scheduled another two seasons.
you truly deserve to rot in hell for that comment. baseless attack on BY FAR the greatest show on television....Ever!!

Psy

28th March 2006, 05:00

Originally posted by [email protected] 24 2006, 06:21 AM
you truly deserve to rot in hell for that comment. baseless attack on BY FAR the greatest show on television....Ever!!
But it is still flawed. In Separate Vocations Lisa starts to challenge the system by stealing all the answer keys in the school, at the end Lisa back to normal. In "The President Wore Pearls" that is a parody on "Don't Cry for me Argentina" ended with Lisa being transfered but Homer refused to drive her new school, thus totaly ingoring the student strike that had Bart still there (He warned Lisa she was being used) and Lisa coming back.

LoneRed

28th March 2006, 06:14

i dont know how that means its flawed, yes some things dont make sense, like homers multiple head wounds, and aliens and other such things. its not supposed to follow the laws of nature. also those points, the characters arent supposed to stick to everything or belief they have. it would make for a seriously routine and unfunny show.

Ian

28th March 2006, 09:39

Best show ever

ComradeOm

28th March 2006, 14:13

Stop reading too much into it. Its a TV show; nothing more and nothing less.

EDIT> I do love that Comrade Homer site though. Lenny and Carl... how could I not have seen it sooner? :lol:

Comrade Marcel

28th March 2006, 14:30

Originally posted by Comrade [email protected] 24 2006, 05:57 AM
This one is my favorite episode.

Russian/Soviet Diplomat:The Soviet Union will be pleased to offer amnesty to your wayward vessel.
US Diplomat: Soviet Union? I thought you guys broke up.
Russian/Soviet Diplomat: Nyet! That's what we wanted you to think, hahahahahaha!
Zombie Lenin: Must crush capitalism... grrr
I met a persyn awhile ago that actually believes Russia is doing this to "trick" us and take over the west and make us communist.

If only that were true! :rolleyes:

Psy

28th March 2006, 15:08

Originally posted by [email protected] 28 2006, 06:23 AM
i dont know how that means its flawed.
It avoids putting resistance in a positive light, Homer's mom that is by the far more revolutionary characters only had 2 eps (as far as I know).

che's long lost daughter

28th March 2006, 15:12

The Simpsons are I agree one of the best shows America has ever produced. I love it not only because it makes me laugh so hard that I almost rupture internal organs but also how it discusses social issues too. And rebel Outcast saying the shpw is horrible must be out of his mind or has no sense of humour.

vox_populi

28th March 2006, 16:27

Has anyone seen the episode where bart accidently "moons" the american flag? Then everyone starts to hate the simpson because they're un-american.
Then later in the episode when the family is in chruch Lisa says: Why can't we just accept that people have different opinions?" (or something like that)
Then S.W.A.T storms the church and takes the simpson family to alcatraz for re-education...
It's a great episode :D

The Grey Blur

28th March 2006, 16:41

A hot summer's afternoon, Homer and Bart sit outside, basking in the cold air of the refrigerator they have dragged outside. Suddenly, it breaks.

Homer's response is: "Marge, can you turn the oven to cold?"

Oh and that Lenny & Karl thing, hilarious...

RebelOutcast

28th March 2006, 18:31

Originally posted by LoneRed+Mar 24 2006, 06:21 AM--> (LoneRed @ Mar 24 2006, 06:21 AM)
[email protected]r 21 2006, 01:44 PM
The simpsons is horrible, The lisa character is just another idiot posing as an intellectual while espousing the "American Dream".
The series has been going on for far too long now, but they won't let it die quietly, they've just scheduled another two seasons.
you truly deserve to rot in hell for that comment. baseless attack on BY FAR the greatest show on television....Ever!! [/b]
Sh'up foo!
The Simpsons is crap, making two more seasons is like necrophillia, nasty and unecessary.
Family guy, Futurama and FireFly were much better shows yet fox cancelled them.
The Simpsons, the people responsible for it getting re-commissioned and people who think it's still a good show deserve to rot in hell, not me.

LoneRed

30th March 2006, 04:57

Family Guy is one of the worst shows ever, unoriginal to the max, took everything from simpsons and futurama. Its in a style exactly like the simpsons.nuclear family etc... except that family guy is just bathroom humor. he does a lot of the same things (peter) :lol: :lol: -_-

dusk

30th March 2006, 12:15

I like it when they go arty farty.
Like in that episode where the scenery suddenly changed
in to the title-film of catch me if you can.

And Homers mom is alright to.

ComradeOm

1st April 2006, 13:50

Simpsons film confirmed for 2007

Twentieth Century Fox has confirmed that popular animated TV series The Simpsons is to be made into a film.
The movie will be released in the United States in July 2007.

A 25-second trailer for the film has been shown to US audiences at screenings of Ice Age: The Meltdown, promising to introduce "the greatest hero in American history".

It then cut to Homer Simpson, wearing only his underwear, who admitted: "I forgot what I was supposed to say."

The Simpsons revolves around the antics of bald, beer-guzzling family man Homer and his spiky-haired son Bart.
Read the rest at the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/4867252.stm)

Psy

8th April 2006, 02:56

Why can't the Simpsons be more like this

Cult of Reason

8th April 2006, 04:00

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2006, 02:05 AM
Why can't the Simpsons be more like this
They are Stalinists.

1984

16th April 2006, 21:47

I'd like to recommend the book "The Simpsons and philosophy" to anyone on this particular board... it even has an whole chapter on how marxism and class struggle are faced (in a niilistic way, I must say in advance) in the series!

Dr Mindbender

16th April 2006, 22:09

anyone see the itchy and scratchy episdode where Kent Brockman is doing a report- ''we're here in North Korea to show you how American cartoons are made!''
:D
I also liked the episode where Lisa started an anti sexism campaign against the malibu stacy doll. Im still trying to work out her politics... I think shes an anti communist liberal.
<_<
i think american dad is socially more relevant as they talk about recent events and take the piss out of neo con middle america.

Dr Mindbender

16th April 2006, 22:16

Originally posted by Comrade Marcel+Mar 28 2006, 02:39 PM--> (Comrade Marcel @ Mar 28 2006, 02:39 PM)
Comrade [email protected] 24 2006, 05:57 AM
This one is my favorite episode.

Russian/Soviet Diplomat:The Soviet Union will be pleased to offer amnesty to your wayward vessel.
US Diplomat: Soviet Union? I thought you guys broke up.
Russian/Soviet Diplomat: Nyet! That's what we wanted you to think, hahahahahaha!
Zombie Lenin: Must crush capitalism... grrr
I met a persyn awhile ago that actually believes Russia is doing this to "trick" us and take over the west and make us communist.

If only that were true! :rolleyes: [/b]
what :o ?

And live under Stalinism!?!

drain.you

16th April 2006, 23:27

Someone mentioned Firefly, that was an awesome program. The film was pretty good but didnt have the same feel.

As for simpsons, great laugh and seems to have mixed political messages though this is because it is just a cartoon, not some secret code promoting communism lol. Reading too much into it in my opinion but the Marx/Lenin thing is interesting. Most of characters are named after people Matt G know/knew though...

Psy

1st January 2007, 19:07

fiddlesticks

29th June 2009, 14:00

The simpsons is a fantastic animated show, as is family guy & futurama, though south park tends to be painfully silly for the most part.

Pirate Utopian

29th June 2009, 17:46

The simpsons is a fantastic animated show,
Nercomancer!

as is family guy & futurama, though south park tends to be painfully retarded for the most part.
How the fuck is Family Guy a good show? It's not funny, the jokes are so random and over the place.
The jokes dont even further the plot or have anything at all to do with the story, they arent even jokes they're just random references to pop culture and celebrity stuff.
All the flashbacks every 2 minutes are annoying too.

How on earth is Family Guy fantastic while South Park is "retarded for the most part"?
South Park may be way past it's peak and the episodes are getting worse everytime (although the Pan Flute episode was rockbottom) but even the worst South Park episode is more clever and funny than the best Family Guy episode.

Stranger Than Paradise

30th June 2009, 12:26

Having seen Season 9 on DVD I notice on the commentaries they don't say much about Cuba in "The Trouble With Trillions and just said the Russian bit was funny in "Simpson Tide"

I did notice when watching "The Joy of Sect" that Lisa was willing to surrender for good grades, this points to the fact Lisa lost her rebellious spirit against the educational system form "Separate Vocations".

Lisa is a Liberal reformist in my opinion. Bart is more revolutionary for me, he is the one that regularly questions authority and hierarchy in the show. Lisa abides by these authorities and accepts them as legitimate structures.

Psy

30th June 2009, 17:20

Lisa is a Liberal reformist in my opinion. Bart is more revolutionary for me, he is the one that regularly questions authority and hierarchy in the show. Lisa abides by these authorities and accepts them as legitimate structures.
Yet in Separate Vocations Lisa did steal the Teacher Editions that sabotaged the ability of the school to teach the curriculum, of course she only rebelled when she lost hope due to the career aptitude test saying she was best for being a home market.

taryn

30th June 2009, 18:35

I kind of think The Simpsons is past its prime. It doesn't make me laugh like it used to. I like some Family Guy; I thought this scene was funny:

Peter: Ground Zero. So this is where the first guy got AIDS.
Brian: Peter, this is the site of the 9/11 terrorist attacks.
Peter: Oh, so Saddam Hussein did this?
Brian: No.
Peter: The Iraqi army?
Brian: No.
Peter: Some guys from Iraq?
Brian: No.
Peter: That one lady who visited Iraq that one time?
Brian: No. Peter, Iraq had nothing to do with this. It was a bunch of Saudi Arabians, Lebanese, and Egyptians financed by a Saudi Arabian guy living in Afghanistan sheltered by Pakistanis.
Peter: So...you're saying we need to invade Iran?

Also, I enjoyed Carl Sagan's Cosmos edited for rednecks. :lol:

rednordman

30th June 2009, 19:11

anyone see the itchy and scratchy episdode where Kent Brockman is doing a report- ''we're here in North Korea to show you how American cartoons are made!''
:D Sorry to pick an acient post of yours, but I swear blind that in that perticular scene, they actually say 'Korea' not 'North Korea'. I was wondering whether or not it was made at a time when the South was still a dictatorship?

Psy

30th June 2009, 19:36

While Daria and Jane from Daria never really tried to change the system I have to admit they were far more observant then Lisa Simpson

Daria - In sum, my world would be made fairer by the simple step of eliminating all money. Politicians could serve the people they represent, instead of the ones paying for their attack ads. CEO's could stop fouling the planet and cheating their workers just to keep their stock prices pumped. And, of course, promising young students such as myself, could actually study, instead of spending their time groveling in scholarship essays.
Jane - Wow. You're really going to send that in?
Daria - Why wouldn't I?
Jane - The whole point of these scholarships is to show how marvelously well-adjusted you are. You're coming across all observant and honest. You know, anti-social.

Manifesto

21st July 2009, 18:33

Lisa is not supposed to be a threat to the class system, she is a child!

One of my favorite episdes was (paraphrase):
Homer: I want to be a stonecutter, but I can't get in unless I save a stonecutter's life or I'm related to one.
Grandpa: I'm a stonecutter.
Homer: Did you hear something?
Grandpa: I'm a stonecutter!
Bart: Dad, I think Grandpa's trying to say something.
Grandpa: I'm a stonecutter!
Homer: You're a stonecutter?!
Grandpa: I am! Well, let's see [goes through cards in wallet]...I'm the president of the gay-straight alliance...for some reason, I'm a communist...ah, here it is! Stonecutters!
Homer: I'll be taking this....and I'll take the communist one too!

:D

Futurama is a brillant show too.

Also, The Oblongs has a lot to do with class division. I love that show!
Yeah the Simpsons is ok and all but how that is still going for so long and Lisa is just annoying and very Capitalist and how Futurama was instead canceled I will never know (it will be back in 2010!). Also The Oblongs does show class division quite well with how the large amount of workers that live in the Valley that is polluted and the few families that live on the hill are all rich that live better than everyone else.