Venezuela trains for guerrilla war

[Janus]

BBC News

Under the blazing midday sun, at an army base outside Caracas, middle-aged Venezuelan military commanders were being told how to teach the civilian population in guerrilla warfare.

Hundreds of officers in olive combat dress were shown practical displays of Venezuela's new military thinking: The use of civilians to fight a war of resistance in the event of an invasion.

They are now using this knowledge to train around 2m civilians to become military reservists.

The first half-a-million adults are already being put through the four-month programme. The rest are expected follow over the coming months.

Lt Col Antonio Benavides, of the elite National Guard commando regiment, is responsible for training many of the military professionals who will in turn instruct the reservists.

Lt Col Benavides started the first lesson of the day: The art of camouflage.

"Here we have a hidden underground tunnel system like the Vietcong used in Vietnam against the American aggressors," he said, pointing to the entrance of a dark hole in the ground.
"This is the kind of tunnel that we're now teaching civilians to build."

Lt Col Benavides lined up a small group of civilian reservists to make a point about the art of surprise in guerrilla warfare.

"On the surface they look like ordinary people on the street. But if you look underneath their jackets, you will see they are hiding knifes, catapults and pistols," he told his audience.

"We're not expecting to arm all our reservists with guns. We do want them to make their own home-made weapons. Anything will do, as long as it harms the enemy," said retired Rear Admiral Luis Cabrera Aguirre, who is overseeing the training given to civilian volunteers.

'Deterrent'

It is this kind of territorial guard made up of civilians, President Hugo Chavez of Venezuela is now creating with the help of military drill, weapons training and lessons in citizenship.

President Chavez wants the territorial guard to act as a deterrent for any potential invasion of Venezuela.
In his latest weekly TV show, President Chavez repeated his long-held belief that the US was planning to invade Venezuela, saying that Washington wanted to overthrow him.

General Juan Alberto Hernandez, of the National Guard, told the BBC that a group of Venezuelan officers had taken part in a large-scale military exercise in Cuba.

"They reported back to us that they were impressed with what they saw. Cuba's civilian population was working hand in hand with the professional army to defend the country. This is a lesson we are learning from Cuba."

The concept of a civilian militia is nothing new in Venezuela. Almost half a year ago, small neighbourhood groups of Chavez supporters began holding informal gatherings on a weekly basis. The meetings were limited to military drill.

But the idea has come a long way since. More than 2m adults have signed up to become reservists in a programme run by the armed forces and are now having to give up a Saturday each week.

'Instrument of repression'

At an office inside the headquarters of Venezuela state owned oil company, PDVSA, Alfredo Carquez reflects on his experiences as a new recruit for the territorial guard.

"At first my family wasn't too impressed that when I signed up," said Mr Carquez, a 43-year-old executive who works for the firm.

"But they have accepted it now because I explained to them that I feel obliged to defend my fatherland and any threat to the revolutionary process being carried out by President Chavez."
Mr Carquez and many others like him feel they are privileged to work for the government in relatively secure and well-paid jobs. So they feel they want to put something back into the system.

But it is not just government employees who have become trainees in the reserve. A whole cross-section of society including housewives and pensioners has come forward to serve in the territorial guard.

However, former military officers close to the opposition warn that the territorial guard could be used to quash popular dissent against President Chavez.

Retired Vice Admiral Mario Ivan Carratu Molina said: "Remember that the territorial guard is directly answerable to the president. So he could use it as an instrument of repression against a popular uprising, for example."

There is currently a debate in Venezuela's parliament whether service in the reserve should be made compulsory for all Venezuelans.

Several high-ranking military officers have told the BBC they are reluctant to force citizens into military service.

However, a group of pro-Chavez lawmakers argues that the country needs a well-trained reserve force and that making it compulsory is the only way to make that happen.

So do y'all think? Do you think that there is a chance that the US may invade Venezuela.

[Fawkes]

I think that there is a chance sometime in the future, but currently they're to busy having there greedy eyes set on the middle east. In a way, i hope the U.S. invades Venezuala because the U.S. would fucking get their asses kicked. U.S. soldiers dont know how to fight in a guerilla war. And you cant win a war against an entire nations people

[loveme4whoiam]

Indeed, this is exactly why (at least one reason why) the British lost the American War of Independence. So used to fighting battles in lines, they could not fight a guerrilla war which the US opposed them with. Add that in to an incompetent British general and you suddenly have the United States of America :lol:

I can see this happening in the future, although again I wonder what sort of thing the international community would do if they did invade Venezuala? I dearly hope the British army doesn't follow them in again because it's going to be a bloodbath, and while it'd make an excellent point about American imperialism I would rather our troops stayed alive while that point is made.

[Dreckt]

U.S. soldiers dont know how to fight in a guerilla war.

We don't know that. They failed in Vietnam, but this is almost 40 years later. I do hope the US fails in Venezuela, but seeing how they defeated the "opposition" in Iraq and Afghanistan, well, I don't know.

[Janus]

but seeing how they defeated the "opposition" in Iraq and Afghanistan, well, I don't know.
How have they defeated the insurgency in Iraq and Afghanistan?

[TC]

Uh, yah...i'm sure that the resistance fighters staffing check points and government buildings in ramadi and mosul would be interested to learn that they're defeated lol.

[Atlas Swallowed]

Yeah, they have oil.

[FULL METAL JACKET]

Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2006, 05:29 PM

U.S. soldiers dont know how to fight in a guerilla war.

We don't know that. They failed in Vietnam, but this is almost 40 years later. I do hope the US fails in Venezuela, but seeing how they defeated the "opposition" in Iraq and Afghanistan, well, I don't know.
Yeah we do know that. They haven't crushed the Iraqi guerrillas.

[Rawthentic]

Hmm.. this seems very similar to what happened in the beginning of post revolutionary Cuba. They wanted to do this to obviously defend against a US invasion. A grand part of this was Che's thinking, since he saw how the Arbenz socialist regime was toppled since there were dissidents in the armed forces. He saw how the people were not armed and related it to why Guatemala was defeated by the US. At least in Cuba, the idea was to make a guerilla army out of the people. Not in the literal sense, but in the sense of how the camaraderie in the guerillas was made. I guess it represented the guerillas in the Sierra Maestra but on a much larger scale. I hope they carry out. It creates solidarity and unity, not to mention defense against an invasion.

[Niall]

when america wanted the guatamalen (if thats wrong spelling correct it please) government overthrown in the 50s they just vetoed what the international community said, why would they do anything different now?

[Gryphon]

Where there's Oil, there's Bush!

[ComradeOm]

This is a smart move that will effecivatly nullify the superior US technology in a possible war. Instead of fielding a conventional army that would play to the enemy's strengths, this force should be much more mobile and flexible.

[Tekun]

Niall, its Guatemalan gov ;)
Actually, aside from alienating the gov of Guatemala and Jacobo Arbenz Guzman from the rest of the world, the US supported and militarily aided(specifically, OPERATION PBFORTUNE and PBSUCCESS) the Guatemalan dissidents that would confront and then eventually seize control of the gov

And as seen, a combo of both helped them colonialize Guatemala :angry:


However, I don't believe the US would be stupid enough to invade Venezuela
They realize that such an action would create an anti-imperialist sentiment around the world, and it would be suicidal for US soldiers
Venezuela is an economically sound country, that has the support of its neighbors
As such, it would prove deadly to try and seize it
However, I won't disregard the possibility that they'll take covert actions to overthrow the gov and install a puppet
The US could possibly inject and fund a puppet to run against Chavez or any other leftist leaders (kinda like what is occuring in Peru with Lourdes Flores)
Or they could create internal sabotage and then a coup, similar to what they did against Chavez in 2002

There is an array of methods to overthrow the gov, that Washington has at its disposition
And as a result, I applaud Chavez's preparation and security
However, I do hope that in the near future he can allow the proletariat to seize power and transform Venezuela into a real socialist state

[*PRC*Kensei]

A VERY STUPIT QUESTION:

chaves is president right...

who are they training gerillias for then ? against who ?

[redstar2000]

Originally posted by *PRC*[email protected] 22 2006, 07:47 AM
A VERY STUPIT QUESTION:

chaves is president right...

who are they training gerillias for then ? against who ?
To resist any attempted U.S. invasion (or a "surrogate invasion" from Colombia overseen by the U.S.).

I found this a bit disturbing...


"We're not expecting to arm all our reservists with guns. We do want them to make their own home-made weapons. Anything will do, as long as it harms the enemy," said retired Rear Admiral Luis Cabrera Aguirre, who is overseeing the training given to civilian volunteers.

In the event of a U.S.-sponsored military coup, the civilian reservists are going to have a tough time going up against regular military and police with "home-made weapons". :o

Surely Chavez, et.al., could scrape up enough money to purchase AK-47s (or their equivalent) for all, right?

They might be badly needed. :(

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif

[Niall]

Originally posted by redstar2000+Mar 22 2006, 01:03 PM--> (redstar2000 @ Mar 22 2006, 01:03 PM)
*PRC*[email protected] 22 2006, 07:47 AM
A VERY STUPIT QUESTION:

chaves is president right...

who are they training gerillias for then ? against who ?
To resist any attempted U.S. invasion (or a "surrogate invasion" from Colombia overseen by the U.S.).

I found this a bit disturbing...


"We're not expecting to arm all our reservists with guns. We do want them to make their own home-made weapons. Anything will do, as long as it harms the enemy," said retired Rear Admiral Luis Cabrera Aguirre, who is overseeing the training given to civilian volunteers.

In the event of a U.S.-sponsored military coup, the civilian reservists are going to have a tough time going up against regular military and police with "home-made weapons". :o

Surely Chavez, et.al., could scrape up enough money to purchase AK-47s (or their equivalent) for all, right?

They might be badly needed. :(

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif [/b]
my god, that would be like the zulu warriors against the brit soldiers again

[ComradeOm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2006, 01:03 PM
In the event of a U.S.-sponsored military coup, the civilian reservists are going to have a tough time going up against regular military and police with "home-made weapons". :o

Surely Chavez, et.al., could scrape up enough money to purchase AK-47s (or their equivalent) for all, right?

They might be badly needed. :(

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif
I suspect that they're talking about IEDs and the like rather then guns there.

Just magiking up 2 million rifles, even AKs, isn't easy. I've heard however that Chavez is trying to secure a licence to produce the weapons.

[McLeft]

THis is great, the people themsekves will help save the country against any potential US invasion which i do not see very far. The good thing about this is that people aren't being forced to do this, they are helping their governemtn voluntarily.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Originally posted by redstar2000+Mar 22 2006, 08:09 AM--> (redstar2000 @ Mar 22 2006, 08:09 AM)
*PRC*[email protected] 22 2006, 07:47 AM
A VERY STUPIT QUESTION:

chaves is president right...

who are they training gerillias for then ? against who ?
To resist any attempted U.S. invasion (or a "surrogate invasion" from Colombia overseen by the U.S.).

I found this a bit disturbing...


"We're not expecting to arm all our reservists with guns. We do want them to make their own home-made weapons. Anything will do, as long as it harms the enemy," said retired Rear Admiral Luis Cabrera Aguirre, who is overseeing the training given to civilian volunteers.

In the event of a U.S.-sponsored military coup, the civilian reservists are going to have a tough time going up against regular military and police with "home-made weapons". :o

Surely Chavez, et.al., could scrape up enough money to purchase AK-47s (or their equivalent) for all, right?

They might be badly needed. :(

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif [/b]
I'm surprised! If this is the only problem redstar, Chevez's biggest critic on the left, can scrutinize, then they're probably not doing too bad.

To me this sounds like a fantastic idea. As soon as Chavez begins to socialize everything and maybe stop selling oil to the US (or pehaps raise the price to ridiculous sums =D), the US is sure to find an excuse to invade. It seems that Chavez is taunting the US. He even said he's gonna start developing nuclear power for electricity. I can easily foresee Washington coming up with "evidence" that he's terrorizing his people, giving aid to terrorists like the FARC, making nukes, etc.

[red team]

Originally posted by ComradeOm+Mar 22 2006, 01:42 PM--> (ComradeOm @ Mar 22 2006, 01:42 PM)
[email protected] 22 2006, 01:03 PM
In the event of a U.S.-sponsored military coup, the civilian reservists are going to have a tough time going up against regular military and police with "home-made weapons". :o

Surely Chavez, et.al., could scrape up enough money to purchase AK-47s (or their equivalent) for all, right?

They might be badly needed. :(

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif
I suspect that they're talking about IEDs and the like rather then guns there.

Just magiking up 2 million rifles, even AKs, isn't easy. I've heard however that Chavez is trying to secure a licence to produce the weapons. [/b]
Oh yes, respect intellectual property rights for light personal defense weapons.

That's quite revolutionary. :lol:

If it was up to me, I'll just take the whole rifle apart and reverse engineer the thing.
It's what the Chinese have done with their modification of the AK.

[piet11111]

Chavez is alright in my book but i dont think he will succeed in establishing socialism and if he does succeed his successor will probably tear it down again.

but i do think its best to start producing their own weapons (they could take the designs for the MP-44 and tweak it a little its not like the nazi's are around to object :lol: )
they are to dependant on russia for AK's and need to produce their own weapons.
perhaps they can enter a similar deal as china has with russia to work together in developing weapons.

if Venezuela is making their own assault rifle's anti air missiles and RPG's (maybe even anti air systems like the Tunguska or the SA-11)
then america would have a serious problem if they where planning anything fancy.

[ReD_ReBeL]

is the venezuelan civillians volunteering to be trained in Guerilla Warfare or are thy being forced and dictated to be trained as guerilla's?

[violencia.Proletariat]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2006, 09:26 PM
is the venezuelan civillians volunteering to be trained in Guerilla Warfare or are thy being forced and dictated to be trained as guerilla's?
2 million have volunteered.

[ReD_ReBeL]

thats ace man, Chavez must be doing something right.

[Phalanx]

If the US ever tries to invade Venezuela, I'm going to bet they'll be bombing Chávez first. But, as we've seen with Osama bin Laden, the CIA isn't as competent as they say they are.

If Venezuela tries to make itself another Vietnam, chances are Venezuelan losses will be high. How many millions of Vietnamese were killed by the US killing machine? The Viet Cong had AK-47s but that's about it. Same goes for the Venezuelan militias.

I doubt building homemade weapons will be very successful. Attacking a US soldier equipped with the best killing tools today will easily kill a guerrilla with a knife. Chávez needs to ignore the 'rights' of the Kalashnikov producers and build his own. What are they going to do, SUE him? :lol:

[321zero]

Feb 10 2005
http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20...23420-3113r.htm (http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20050210-123420-3113r.htm)

Russian arms sale to Chavez irks U.S.

By Rowan Scarborough
THE WASHINGTON TIMES

The Bush administration has lodged a formal protest with Russia for agreeing to provide the government of Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez more than 100,000 AK-47 rifles that U.S. officials believe could be used to aid left-wing uprisings in Latin America....

It's a start, if they get into the right hands.

[Niall]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2006, 09:01 AM

Feb 10 2005
http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20...23420-3113r.htm (http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20050210-123420-3113r.htm)

Russian arms sale to Chavez irks U.S.

By Rowan Scarborough
THE WASHINGTON TIMES

The Bush administration has lodged a formal protest with Russia for agreeing to provide the government of Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez more than 100,000 AK-47 rifles that U.S. officials believe could be used to aid left-wing uprisings in Latin America....

It's a start, if they get into the right hands.
hopefully they will, but equally so, hopefully there will be no nedd for them

[Commie Rat]

I doubt building homemade weapons will be very successful.

IED's iraq are proving quite potent against US convoys

[chebol]

1 in 4 venezuelans already own guns.

[ComradeOm]

Originally posted by red [email protected] 23 2006, 12:16 AM
If it was up to me, I'll just take the whole rifle apart and reverse engineer the thing.
It's what the Chinese have done with their modification of the AK.
AFAIK the Chinese purchased the licence (or were given it before the Sino-Soviet split) to produce the original rifles. This is more than a piece of paper and includes the blueprints and advice on manufacturing the piece.

[piet11111]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2006, 12:03 PM
1 in 4 venezuelans already own guns.
standardisation of munitions is the most important aspect of guerilla warfare.
1 in 4 poeple having guns means nothing if they have hundreds of different types of weapons (handguns are only usefull within a 25yard range, rifles are better but bolt action rifle's have to hit on the first shot otherwise there is little chance of making an escape)

Venezuela needs 1 standard issue assault rifle the best being the AK-47 for their environment.
this gives them the advantage of the power of a rifle aswell as the range but without the disadvantage of bolt action and small clip size.

fortunatly the assualt rifle's the americans use are very underpowered and require a lot of maintenance.
the rifle's are better then the vietnam era M-16 but they still are very unreliable.
there are records of enemy soldiers taking 3 or more shots and still being able to stand up and walk away (the fate of these soldiers is unknown but being able to walk away means in my book that they are also capable of firing their weapons)

[bolshevik butcher]

Well this is a good start. 100 000 al47s have been bought so afr. Chavez ahs said they intend to buy more. So i'd assume any 'self-arming' would only be tempory. I certainly hope so.