I need proof

[Abood]

I had a conversation on msn messenger with a miami girl while i had Fidel Castro as my Display picture, she got offended and said castro is an evil dictator, blah blah..
What i need is, any figures, information about what "crimes" he commited, or important laws affecting Cuba during his reign. Anything would be appreciated, thanks.

[silentprotest]

Best place to start is probably talking about the Cuban revolution, and make a point about the previous regime, as that was a real fascist dictatorship.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

The Cuba Truth Project (http://www.cubatruth.info)

The Truth About Cuba (http://www.freepeoplesmovement.org/ry/rys5a.html)

Let's Talk About Cuban Democracy (http://www.freepeoplesmovement.org/ry/rys5b.html)

[FULL METAL JACKET]

Aren't there any neutral sources you can post?

[Sentinel]

Originally posted by FULL METAL JACKET
Aren't there any neutral sources you can post?

Define what you consider "neutral" in this case. I think such sources can be rather hard to find when it comes to revolutionary issues, as they affect everyone.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

There's no such thing as a "neutral source" in class society.

Despite that, facts are facts. The statistics on the Cuba Truth Project site come from the United Nations, which of course is clearly not biased towards Cuba.

[norwegian commie]

the "horrors" done by Cuban goverment or Fidel are nothing but bullshit, during his rule he has not approved torturing, claiming it eas a tool of batista not him. After the overthrowing of the criminal MAFIA related Dictatorship regime, the ones promoting these things where imprisoned. (im not talking about the average joe, but rich mobsters exsploiting the corrupt leadership) The ones fighting for this regime were killed, naturlly they were criminal mobster related selvfish bastards not accsepting the new socialistic society. Homosexuality are NOT illegal in Cuba, and human rights are FOLLOWED.

Anyways the girl yo talked with was a "florida cuban" or a exile cuban" they fled away from the reformation done to their land (they were landowners and had houndreds of workers recieving a small pay) their land were then given to the people working on it.

They felt that equality in a society was terrible since now they couldnt get their ass washed by som black guy named "Fred". So she probably doesent even haVe any good ressorses on what she are saying other than her parents statements, wich is bullshit! So if you are looking for evidence on crimes, well you could go to thetrouthaboutcuba but that is not actually a place to look for facts, all i can say to you is VIVA FIDEL! VIVA CUBA!

[Zeitgeizt]

There is no such thing as a "neutral source". It is a bourgeois concept created by the bourgeoisie in order to pass of their analysis as OBJECTIVE. There is very little objectivity in politics, it is something we are just going to have to come to accept...you actually have to brave and accept reality as imperfect.

Neutral source = liberal nonsense. If you think in terms of neutral sources you will find yourself with no backbone, and landing in obscurity...

Take this as a warning and trust it:

Neutral Source or "Political Objectivity" = piss poor politics and liberalism.

[FULL METAL JACKET]

Then you might as well post the right wing sites as well.

Just because a socialist set up those sites doesn't mean everything on is a fact.

[Abood]

Anyways the girl yo talked with was a "florida cuban" or a exile cuban" they fled away from the reformation done to their land (they were landowners and had houndreds of workers recieving a small pay) their land were then given to the people working on it.
How can you assume that?! In fact, she's originally nicaraguan.


There is no such thing as a "neutral source". It is a bourgeois concept created by the bourgeoisie in order to pass of their analysis as OBJECTIVE. There is very little objectivity in politics, it is something we are just going to have to come to accept...you actually have to brave and accept reality as imperfect.
Huh? I don't understand? What's neutral sources got to do with liberalism?

[el Rebesnét del Tio Canya]

All authoritarianism is bad and say that in Cuba there is dictatorship, but the cuban people is no hunger. Better than the capitalist near countries like Haiti.

[viva le revolution]

Look up Unicef's statistics on Cuba. They are pretty up to date.

[norwegian commie]

Anyways the girl yo talked with was a "florida cuban" or a exile cuban" they fled away from the reformation done to their land (they were landowners and had houndreds of workers recieving a small pay) their land were then given to the people working on it.



How can you assume that?! In fact, she's originally nicaraguan.

¨
how? well the eksile cubans recive lots of money from the US goverment to spread ant-castro propaganda and arming themselves against Cuba. Thats how! guess who started the truthaboutcuba website... They are florida cubans!

But anyways shes a nicaraguan castro hating girl... so fucking what? how many people doesnt hate Castro? are one girl really soppose to convince me from my admiering of Fidel. no way!

as i said before these ideas have no hold in reality and is picked up by her parents or whatever. The same way we knew hitler was an asshole before we read about him, she knows Fidel is a murderer. Her parents are probably not eksactly Sandinists either.

[Abood]

well the eksile cubans recive lots of money from the US goverment to spread ant-castro propaganda and arming themselves against Cuba.
I know that. But you still can't assume that all floridians are originally cubans.


But anyways shes a nicaraguan castro hating girl... so fucking what? how many people doesnt hate Castro? are one girl really soppose to convince me from my admiering of Fidel. no way!
Did I ever say that?! what I said is is that I need to prove her wrong!! Don't take stuff too personally!


as i said before these ideas have no hold in reality and is picked up by her parents or whatever. The same way we knew hitler was an asshole before we read about him, she knows Fidel is a murderer. Her parents are probably not eksactly Sandinists either.
Why the hell are you comparing Castro with Hitler? Especially that you said you support Castro! There is no doubt Hitler was a murderer! All you need is eyes! But there is no proof that Castro is one!

[YKTMX]

SocialistAdvocate:

You've claimed elesewhere you're a "Libertarian Marxist", so why would you want to go out your way to be an apologist for Castro?

Why don't you think about whether Cuban state capitalism is worth defending.

[Abood]

You've claimed elesewhere you're a "Libertarian Marxist", so why would you want to go out your way to be an apologist for Castro?

Why don't you think about whether Cuban state capitalism is worth defending.
Being a libertarian marxism doesn't necessarily mean I hate Castro. Castro hasn't done the best thing by taking over - Yes. But he has improved Cuba by a lot - never forget that! I'm a libertarian marxist because I believe it's a better and easier way to reach communism, because it gives workers the power from the beginning, instead of telling them "work now and get power later". Obviously I would support Cuba much more if there was a dictatorship of the proletariat, but I support Castro much much much much x100 more than someone like Bush! And I know he's not as bad as most people view him as... And I am not against authoritarian marxism if the authority doesn't get corrupt, but does that really happen?

[YKTMX]

Being a libertarian marxism doesn't necessarily mean I hate Castro.

It's not about personal attitude to Castro. It's about whether one thinks Castro's Cuba is a reasonable model for the rest of the world i.e whether it is 'socialist'.

Surely someone who describes themself as a 'libertarian' will be able to see that it is not.



And I am not against authoritarian marxism if the authority doesn't get corrupt, but does that really happen?

Marxism is about working class self-governance. The 'authority' in Cuba is not in the hands of that class, so whatever else it is, Cuba is not 'socialist'. It might progressive or "better" than it was before, but not 'socialist'.

[norwegian commie]

QUOTE
well the eksile cubans recive lots of money from the US goverment to spread ant-castro propaganda and arming themselves against Cuba.


I know that. But you still can't assume that all floridians are originally cubans.



have i? she was a castro hating latin amerikan living in florida so i gessed on Cuba. If you dont like it sue me, its not the end of the world.

QUOTE
But anyways shes a nicaraguan castro hating girl... so fucking what? how many people doesnt hate Castro? are one girl really soppose to convince me from my admiering of Fidel. no way!



Did I ever say that?! what I said is is that I need to prove her wrong!! Don't take stuff too personally!

Just saying Fidel rules, my point is that the propaganda is bullshit!

QUOTE
as i said before these ideas have no hold in reality and is picked up by her parents or whatever. The same way we knew hitler was an asshole before we read about him, she knows Fidel is a murderer. Her parents are probably not eksactly Sandinists either.



Why the hell are you comparing Castro with Hitler? Especially that you said you support Castro! There is no doubt Hitler was a murderer! All you need is eyes! But there is no proof that Castro is one!

:lol: wtf have i said such a thing? NO! i love Fidel, i woul not do so if he was a murderer!

When atleast i was a kid, my father told me that Hitler was a murderer, he hated jeewes and Commies and he said that Hitler was evil and that he sucked.
At that time i did not know if that was true, i took my fathers word as good fish. In the same way the Castro haters influence their kids to hate Castro, only the different is that Hitler was a murderer Castro is not.

But in the child that later grows up most likely as a anti-castroist s eyes are Castro the things her parents have said to him/her. Like me, i knew capitalism was hell long before i read a single history book. And i knew guevara and Fidel wee good guys, this can alsoe work the other way around

I dont think castro is a murderer! they do!
I hate when people twist what im saying, takeing it completely out of context. Get a life!