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Atlas Swallowed
3rd February 2006, 09:43
http://informationclearinghouse.info/article11768.htm

For those who support the US government. The system is failing, no more checks and balances. We are stuck with a cabal of blood thristy war profiteers running the country without any real opposition. If constitutional democracy were still working Bush and his merry band of blood suckers would be in jail or at least Bush and Cheney would be impeached. This country is run by true terrorists whose bodycount is much higher than the terrorists they are pretending to be fighting.

amanondeathrow
5th February 2006, 03:12
If constitutional democracy were still working Bush and his merry band of blood suckers would be in jail or at least Bush and Cheney would be impeached.
When has this "Democracy" every worked correctly?

Tormented by Treachery
5th February 2006, 05:22
Originally posted by Dee's [email protected] 5 2006, 03:31 AM

If constitutional democracy were still working Bush and his merry band of blood suckers would be in jail or at least Bush and Cheney would be impeached.
When has this "Democracy" every worked correctly?
Right between the enslavement of the Africans/rape of indian land and the children dying in coal mines. Woops, that's all of our history. Never mind then...

Atlas Swallowed
5th February 2006, 13:29
It has always worked it was designed to benefit the elite class and it always has. Am I supporter of Democracy going by the examples that history provide no. It sounds good in theory, but in practice is lacking, like another idealogy we all know and love. I was hoping to get a response from those who support the US government and see what thier defense might be. I myself can not think of one, Bush is proving the system is a flop and making it damned obvious.

Hegemonicretribution
5th February 2006, 13:38
Originally posted by Atlas [email protected] 5 2006, 01:48 PM
Am I supporter of Democracy going by the examples that history provide no. It sounds good in theory, but in practice is lacking, like another idealogy we all know and love.
This is because, like communism, a nation has never experienced democracy, ever. You can call the USSR communist, but it is far removed from what communism was written to be, or what a communist sees it as, the word has dual meaning.

The same is true of democracy, on the one hand it is the idealised electoral process, where even in the representitive for, all have a say and all can vote. Then you have the bastardised version of it as it exists much of the world over. These oligarchies are just that, technically not democratic at all. Maybe those prevented from voting are kids, criminals, or crazy, but this is all subjective. Technically democracy has never existed, ever, on a large scale.

You can argue that the U.S. is more liberal than some "democracies" such as the DPRK, but you cannot effectively argue the U.S. is democratic, it is self evident that this is not the case.

viva le revolution
5th February 2006, 15:36
There is no such thing as 'democracy' in the capitalist world. The candidtes are not from amongst the actual working class majority because thanks to a little thing known as campiaign funds and funding, the candidates are always from the bourgeoisie. the only 'consolation' is that every four years the people are allowed to 'choose' which set of oligarchs will oppress them. True democracy cannot exist until as such time as the working class takes power and institue democratic centralism where the people get to choose and recall at any time candidates truly representative of the people, ie, the working class.

Columbia
6th February 2006, 22:06
I'm just curious...

Why was this posted on the OPPOSING IDEOLOGIES portion of the site?


It doesn't make sense.


Seems like plain ol' fashion America bashing. And pretty boring as they go: A few little kiddies.

ZZzzzz. You know these kids thought every day of their lieves of becoming Americans.

Well, come on...who doesn't think of becoming an American!?!?

WE have the best people, best government, best economy, and HOT guys.

But why is this post here? It's a strict Commie Comments post!

amanondeathrow
7th February 2006, 03:31
But why is this post here? It's a strict Commie Comments post!
It clearly says "or those who support the US government." This is the only forum where you can find such people on this board.

Atlas Swallowed
7th February 2006, 14:19
Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2006, 10:31 PM
I'm just curious...

Why was this posted on the OPPOSING IDEOLOGIES portion of the site?


It doesn't make sense.


Seems like plain ol' fashion America bashing. And pretty boring as they go: A few little kiddies.

ZZzzzz. You know these kids thought every day of their lieves of becoming Americans.

Well, come on...who doesn't think of becoming an American!?!?

WE have the best people, best government, best economy, and HOT guys.

But why is this post here? It's a strict Commie Comments post!
Read a little slower, you may actually comprehend what your reading, maybe big maybe. The rest of your post is too idiotic to deserve a response.

Hegemonicretribution
7th February 2006, 17:45
Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2006, 10:31 PM
Well, come on...who doesn't think of becoming an American!?!?




Me for one, and despite what many Americans may think, the rest of the world. If you decide to go see it one day you will see that there is a very anti-American sentiment around much of the globe.


WE have the best people, best government, best economy, and HOT guys.
Completely subjective, and in the latter case, rather shallow.


But why is this post here? It's a strict Commie Comments post!
Because it is the the correct forum, and no it is not. In order to be at least partially objective it would be handy to see a defence of this, and that could not be found anywhere on this site but in OI. No real capitalist, communist or anarchist supports America as such, at least in the elevated way required for such a defence, so it is the American nationalists this is equally addressed to. The title may be leading, but this is all something that is open to debate. So far there has been none.

Columbia
7th February 2006, 20:04
Hegemonicretribution wrote (regarding who wouldn't want to become an American):

Despite what many Americans may think, the rest of the world.


HAHAHA!!! One of the most IDIOTIC statements around! As hundreds of thousands nationalize each year, and the same number tries to kill themselves to enter illegally, and people from Cuba crash and overload their boats trying to get here...

(I could go on but you get the idea.)

The statement was made tongue in cheek, but there is, of course, a great deal of truth about it.




If you decide to go see it one day you will see that there is a very anti-American sentiment around much of the globe.


I've been to Europe twice and Asia once. I've seen positive feelings toward Americans, and negative ones since the Iraq War. But it doesn't phase me in the least. My life will not be "decreased" by such feelings, and the same population a year before were all PRO-AMERICAN, with the French President stating, "WE ARE ALL AMERICANS!" What's far more important is that Americans have a good feeling about America.

I think Europe doesn't "like" President Bush. Who cares what you think about us, or anyone for that matter.

The world is just one terrorist attack away from becoming Born Again America Lovers.

France takes an anti-war/anti-American stance, and the Muslim youth still torch its cities.

Denmark maintains is neutrality, and then when a "anti-Muslim cartoon is published, BANG!"

The Isle of Man has one great similarity to America: It can afford to be its own state, regardless of the views of other countries. But, as isolated as you are, you couldn't hide from the Nazis and you won't be able to hide from the fascism that will one day spread through Europe like wildfire.

Personally, I think twice in 100 years is too much, and if I had the ear of the President when the shit hits the fan in Europe, I would advise him to let you all kill yourselves. That's not an anti-European view, as much as it's a view of being tired over your "Let's all demobilize only to have our asses handed to us." sentiment.

My idea of the next Marshall Plan is to pull up a chair and get a good laugh off of you all.

Delirium
7th February 2006, 21:06
Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2006, 08:29 PM

I've been to Europe twice and Asia once.





Yeah, how did Club Med treat you?


The world is just one terrorist attack away from becoming Born Again America Lovers.

France takes an anti-war/anti-American stance, and the Muslim youth still torch its cities.

Denmark maintains is neutrality, and then when a "anti-Muslim cartoon is published, BANG!

This makes no sense,

You are saying that muslim youth rioted because France didn't send troops to iraq?

And that the real uproar is not over cartoons but Denmark's neutrality.

You are just plain stupid, the world does not revolve around the u$, countries have thier own issues that aren't found on Fox.


But, as isolated as you are, you couldn't hide from the Nazis and you won't be able to hide from the fascism that will one day spread through Europe like wildfire.

Wow, not just a dumbass but a fascist dumbass.

Hegemonicretribution
7th February 2006, 23:53
Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2006, 08:29 PM
HAHAHA!!! One of the most IDIOTIC statements around! As hundreds of thousands nationalize each year, and the same number tries to kill themselves to enter illegally




I could say much the same about your statement. I was going to say most of the world, but I can defend the "rest of the world." You seem to imply that most of the world want to enter America? I would like to see you properly assert that over 2.5billon people around the globe, or more, wish to live in the US.

Wow, a few from quite a few varried nations try to enter America. Rember the American' ideology is far reaching, as is its media, and to this end I will grant America an advantage with regard to propoganda. However are you asserting that a majority of (I'll take your example
and people from Cuba crash and overload their boats trying to get here...) Cubans actually want to (and oppinion polls would suggest otherwise unless you can provide better evidence to the contrary) enter America?

The percentage that try and enter are actually a minority.


The statement was made tongue in cheek, but there is, of course, a great deal of truth about it.
That which you convince yourself of.


and the same population a year before were all PRO-AMERICAN
You have been to all of Europe? It is fairly diverse, I have been to more than 10 countries in Europe and have had various impressions, both pre and post war. Also depending on the circles you ran in whilst there you will get a very different reaction. You might have even gotten mistaken for a tourist, and they fancied your cash?

In Asia, as well, the reaction will largely depend upon where you were. Although I have spent little time there so my knowledge is more limitted. My Vietnamese relatives aren't too pro American, but I won't even rely upon such an examle for obvious reasons.


with the French President stating, "WE ARE ALL AMERICANS!"
Look for a few minutes at the nature of the site. Does it suggest that we will accept the views of a president as representive of the electorate?


What's far more important is that Americans have a good feeling about America.
I thought all the world wanted to be American? :lol:

Are American lives superior in someway? Does that majority of the globe not matter as long as the minority in America have a sustained lifestyle?


I think Europe doesn't "like" President Bush. Who cares what you think about us, or anyone for that matter.
At least we agree on the first count here, very perceptive of you. In response to your second statement see above. ^


The world is just one terrorist attack away from becoming Born Again America Lovers.
Could you expand upon this, I am still hoping it doesn't mean what I think it does.


France takes an anti-war/anti-American stance, and the Muslim youth still torch its cities.

Anti War=Anti American...actually never mind.

The Muslim youth however, are battling against non-Muslims, and especially Westerners. That was an issue with Europe, but they are still pissed with you guys, or so I hear :D


The Isle of Man has one great similarity to America: It can afford to be its own state, regardless of the views of other countries.
I admit there are benifits to my location, but they are not takem for granted, and I don't feel "national" pride. However it is still a crown dependancy, so it is not completely unique.


But, as isolated as you are, you couldn't hide from the Nazis and you won't be able to hide from the fascism that will one day spread through Europe like wildfire.
The Isle of man wasn't particuarly affected by the war. There was a Manx regiment at the time, but on the island itself was quite safe. Quite a lot of child refugees were sent here.

What are you getting at with this though, you seem to have started a new discussion, although I am intreged.


Denmark maintains is neutrality, and then when a "anti-Muslim cartoon is published, BANG!"
I know,I did not see that coming :o


Personally, I think twice in 100 years is too much, and if I had the ear of the President when the shit hits the fan in Europe, I would advise him to let you all kill yourselves.
I would love to hear where you get these predictions from, well at least as long as it isn't from where I am guessing.


That's not an anti-European view,
Not exactly pro-Euroean as such though is it?


as much as it's a view of being tired over your "Let's all demobilize only to have our asses handed to us." sentiment.
I am sure your history classes were different to mine, and I would take varried reading of history over Hollywood anyday ;)

But seriously though...what? :lol:


My idea of the next Marshall Plan is to pull up a chair and get a good laugh off of you all.
It must be great looking the world through your eyes. Is the sky pink, sea orange and with you as the next Adonis? Or perhaps you enjoying being made to look rather foolish, and get kicks from this? Or perhaps you really do exist within your own dogma, wherby I lose by default for not being American?

Actually, that was most unlike me, and I appologise, I will wait for your reply before I start to make judgements here, but I assumed from your post that such "banter" is par for the course?

This is fun :D

Tormented by Treachery
8th February 2006, 01:21
Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2006, 08:29 PM
What's far more important is that Americans have a good feeling about America.
See, I waded through the rest of your bullshit, but this one I couldn't let slide.

First of all, I have a very, very bad feeling about the United States.

And it would seem that most Americans agree (http://poll.gallup.com/).



"State of the Country" satisfaction rating: 62% Dissatisfied, 35% Satisfied.

"Economic Confidence" rating: 59% fair/poor, 39% excellent/good."

"Presidential Approval" rating: 54% disapprove, 43% approve."

What America were you talking about?

Here are some more. (http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm)

And we don't even get taught about this kind of thing!

http://chris.erway.org/albums/vietnam/025617_R1_11A_11.sized.jpg

Atlas Swallowed
8th February 2006, 02:04
My wife and I have actually considered leaving the US as other people have.

http://www.escapeartist.com/

I guess I am not going to get a defense of the failing of US democracy from Colombia, it seems she would prefer a faschist dictatorship anyhow. Since the US government is going that way she is probably happy about it.

One of my favorite flash animations. I dedicate this to Columbia,
enjoy.


http://www.takebackthemedia.com/bushnonazi.html