PACE is challenging to the communist world

[Hopes_Guevara]

PACE winter session: alleged secret detentions, crimes of totalitarian communist regimes, human rights violations in the Chechen Republic

Strasbourg, 12.01.2006 – Alleged secret detentions in Council of Europe member states, the need for international condemnation of the crimes of totalitarian communist regimes and human rights violations in the Chechen Republic are among subjects scheduled for debate during the Winter Session of the Council of Europe Parliamentary Assembly (PACE) in Strasbourg from 23 to 27 January 2006.

This is exerted from the official website of PACE (http://assembly.coe.int/ASP/Press/StopPressView.asp?CPID=1718).

Obviously, this is a challenge of PACE to the leftist countries: Vietnam, China, DPRK, Cuba, Venezuela, Brazil, Bolivia,... And I am sure that these countries will raise their voice in defense of communism and against PACE's statements.

I think, we, in the name of communist youth of the largest communist forum, express our points against PACE's statements on the so called "the crimes of totalitarian communist regimes". And it'd better that an admin should write an article on this.

Do you agree?

[Amusing Scrotum]

Moved to Politics, a more appropriate forum in my opinion for this topic and the (potential) discussion on the implications of PACE's actions.

[WUOrevolt]

Well first of all, I would hardly consider countries like the DPRK and China to be leftist. And it is cowardly to just challenge the so called communist countries on their human rights violations and not challenge America and Britian for their support of the monarch in Nepal and the occupation of Iraq.

[Janus]

The use of totalitarian communist regimes only adds further confusion to the word communism. None of those nations mentioned are communist though Cuba could be considered socialist. The DPRK is totalitarian and ruled by a dictator with a personality cult but definitely doesn't adhere to communism.

[ComradeOm]

Am I the only one that noticed that aside from the traditional "communist bloc" countires, whom every organisation have been attacking for the past 60 years, PACE will be discussing rights abuses in liberal Europe and Russia? Furthermore, how do Venezuela, Brazil and Bolivia qualify as "totalitarian communist regimes"? Were they mentioned by name?

And why on earth should I consider protesting on behalf of totalitarian "communist" regimes? I couldn't give a damn about the heads of China Inc

[Hopes_Guevara]

So, do you think that all of the countries where the communist parties are seizing the power aren't leftist and it'd better that they should be thrown into rubbish bin? If so, it's poor for leftist movements now! :( I hope some day I will witness a genuine communist party (in your points) set up and it'll be better that one or all of you here will become leaders of it. I will be please to join it if you allow me to. :D .

But it is the story of future. When I brought this topic up I just wanted to know your opinions about PACE's plan but not to argue if the countries are leftist. However, you seem not to care that... You seem to prefer condemning these countries to be against PACE's statemens.

And, "totalitarism" is a fucking term which the bourgeoise like to use to attack communism.

[вор в законе]

The issue does not only concern the communists but it raises a more general question on democracy and on the right of each people to decide by himself what he wants and what he does not.

Mass movements must take place and the Communist Parties of Europe must immediatly take initiatives on both national and international levels aimed against the endorsement of this draft resolution from the plenary session of PACE to be held on January 23.

[redstar2000]

This is what is actually proposed...

http://assembly.coe.int/Mainf.asp?link=htt...5/EDOC10765.htm (http://assembly.coe.int/Mainf.asp?link=http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/WorkingDocs/Doc05/EDOC10765.htm)

It is so ludicrous that I doubt if anything will come of it at all...except some hot air from the more reactionary delegates.

The "source" is the infamous Black Book of Communism...which I think even most bourgeois historians regard as fantasy.

So...not to worry. :)

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/123.gif

[Amusing Scrotum]

More on this from BBC News....


Originally posted by MPs condemn communist-era crimes
Parliamentarians from across Europe have condemned the crimes committed under communism.

The Council of Europe's parliamentary assembly said it "strongly condemned the massive human rights violations" committed in the old Soviet bloc.

The council - a European human rights watchdog - has 46 member states. Its parliamentary assembly meets four times a year to debate human rights issues.

Communists and many socialists in the assembly opposed the resolution.

The resolution called on all communist or post-communist parties among the member states to condemn past communist abuses "without any ambiguity".

Goran Lindblad, an MP of the conservative Swedish Moderate Party and leading voice behind the resolution, told the BBC that "the purpose is to give moral restitution to those victims who suffered under communist regimes".

He said: "It's also very important to have an awareness campaign, so people will never repeat this mistake.

"If you go to a regular school in my country, for example, and ask the children, they don't know anything about the Berlin Wall."

Tougher proposals calling for official government condemnations of communist crimes and fresh investigations into such crimes failed to win enough support.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4650316.stm

[Faceless]

perhaps among the more disturbing points issued in this PACE document I found were these:


47. Communist symbols are openly used, and public awareness of communist crimes is very poor. This is particularly obvious when compared to public knowledge of nazism crimes. The education of young generations in many countries certainly does not help to decrease this gap.

there are numerous references to nazism, it also makes clear that whilst nazism is often illegal and display of nazi symbolism too, communist symbols are not. The obvious direction is for a consensus whereby communist symbolism and ideology is treated legally like that of nazism


It should be clear, however, these are crimes committed in the name of communist ideology which are condemned, and not any particular country. Russians themselves were the first and most numerous victims of the communist ideology.

Inspite calling on Communist parties to distance themselves from "totalitarian regimes" (a laughable and no doubt rhetorical request of stalinist parties) they are quick to generalise the root of the suffering caused by such regimes as not being national and therefore the ideology is the perpetrator. You may laugh at their logic, but I think it is very clever and calculating. This ideology is merely specified as a reference to class struggle. Most of us would fall under it.


4.5.3. launch a national awareness campaign about crimes committed in the name of communist ideology, including the revision of school books and the introduction of a memorial day for victims of communism and the establishment of museums

Naturally the conclusion is for a renewed ideological offensive upon the concept of communism by equating the "history of the ideology" (whatever that means) with the actual historical acts of the Communist regimes


7. It seems that a sort of nostalgia for communism is still alive in some countries. That creates the danger of communists taking over power in one country or another. This report should contribute to the general awareness of the history of this ideology.

Here again the overtly political aims of the document are made very clear.

Incidentally, on Cuba I found the following article and a number of others written by people with axes to grind putting the estimate of Cuban atrocities at about 100,000. The PACE figure at 150,000 (for all Latin America for which only Cuba is listed as a totalitarian communist regime) is a huge overestimate then based upon these figures.
http://www.nocastro.com/archives/gohome.htm
It seems that the majority of these dead is accounted for by those who "went missing" trying to escape at sea. (around 80,000) but the figure also includes many of those who would have been killed during the revolution. I for one would not condemn that as an atrocity but as legitimate targeting.

As you can see from the link, the calculations are no doubt collaborations between extreme right groups and the Miami mafia.


btw, the only reason i read this thread was cos i thought it was an attack on all those liberals with their rainbow flags with funny languages on them. never mind