the embargo on cuba [Archive]

Dr. Rosenpenis

15th February 2003, 18:22

I agree completely, the embargo on Cuba is riduculus! The only reason why George Dubaya is enforcing the embargo is because he wants to appease to the Cuban immigrants in Miami. The Americans also don't want to see Cuba prosper, which is too late beacuse they're already the most succesful nation in Latin America. The embargo is the sort of cowardly actions taken by America to keep the world under control and the populace aginst Communism. How can they call the USA free, when you can't even buy a friggin' Cuban cigar?!

deimos

15th February 2003, 18:58

What happens in cuba when castro dies?He's not among the youngest...

Larissa

15th February 2003, 19:35

Embargo info at:

http://www.cubacentral.com/petition/

InnocentCivilian

15th February 2003, 21:21

officially, raul castro is second in command but he isn't that young....i was thinking about it a while back and i don't think america has much of a chance of getting a US backed regime over there....its a land of revolutionaries and they would rise up against it....

i think this is beyond immature as far as the attitude of the USA goes

thanks for the link Larissa

CheViveToday

15th February 2003, 21:47

Let's hope so! I would HATE to see a strong American Capitalist presence in Cuba after the passing of Fidel and Raul. Also, the embargo should end definately end. It is pointless. Hell, it was pointless 40 years ago.

Latin America

16th February 2003, 03:04

I hate this Embargo, I think the USA will never, never Help another country to succed, especially if the country is cuba. I just hope someday this embargo will end!
(sorry for my writting, my english sucks)

Charred Phoenix

16th February 2003, 03:16

It probably has something to do with the fact that all through an American's life the government tries to force the person in question to believe that communism is synonymous with evil, most of them know that they'll be persecuted if they dare to research it so they just assume the government is right.

bluerev002

16th February 2003, 05:36

The Embargo on Cuba is pathetic indeed, but look were its coming from: the US. Pretty pathetic act from a pretty pathetci Country, if i do say so myself.

Interesting letter Larissa, I think we should have that posted all over the site so ppl could sign it. I have a bit of doubt that that stubborn Bush will have his mind chanbed though, but its always worth a shot, I hope my spot of doubt will be erassed.

InnocentCivilian

16th February 2003, 20:46

good point bluerev002......i was just highlighting the patheticness (is that a word?)

i don't think anyone has to look any further past this embargo in order to find evidence that the USA is one bias and messed up nation.....thats my opinion anyway

apathy maybe

16th February 2003, 21:49

Speaking of countries that ignore UN resolutions, the embargo has been condemned many times by the UN with at most three countries opposing, the US, Israel and Micronesia. Now the US for obvious reasons, Israel for if they did condemn it they would be hypocrites and Micronesia (a small country of many islands in the Pacific and former colony of the US) would not get aid from the US.

bluerev002

17th February 2003, 07:12

[quote]Quote: from InnocentCivilian on 8:46 pm on Feb. 16, 2003
good point bluerev002......i was just highlighting the patheticness (is that a word?)

LOL! ^.^. i dont know if it is a word, but i guess you know what it means. and to think they shoulda taught me that in school! these American skool systems arent so great are they?!! Tee hee

Charred Phoenix

18th February 2003, 05:24

patheticness (is that a word?)

No, the word is pathos.

Dench

18th February 2003, 12:56

The strongest reason tho the embargo is the US´s fear of a communist country to sucéed economicly, whitouth the embargo Cuba would be a good place to live (i don´t really know how the living-standards are like now).
The us hated, and feared Che, and the embargo is a product of that fear...
-----------------------------------------
ARM THE HOMELESS !!!

ComradeJunichi

18th February 2003, 13:23

Stop *****ing about the past, and the embargo on Cuba and stop blaming everything on the embargo. Sure, if the embargo was dropped Cuba would be better, but will it be dropped? No, so you drop the *****ing. Think of ways to work around it, because complaining about it won't do a damned thing.

Lefty

18th February 2003, 20:27

Is it that time of month, Joon?

ComradeJunichi

18th February 2003, 20:30

No. Are you jealous?

My point is to get people on here to think progressively, which also involves critical thinking instead of constant rhetoric being thrown around.

Lefty

18th February 2003, 20:34

Jealous of what, and what you just posted certainly isnt progressive thinking or constructive criticism. What do you suggest to improve Cuba's economy with a crushing embargo on it?

Pete

18th February 2003, 20:41

"Stop *****ing about the past, and the embargo on Cuba and stop blaming everything on the embargo. Sure, if the embargo was dropped Cuba would be better, but will it be dropped? No, so you drop the *****ing. Think of ways to work around it, because complaining about it won't do a damned thing. "

I'll take Joon's side on this one. The Embargo is keeping capitalism OUT of Cuba. Imagine what would happen if American Corporations could take over Cuban media? I think the Embargo, although flawed, strengthened the Revolution!

"Cuba would be a good place to live (i don´t really know how the living-standards are like now). "

From talking to some Comrades on this board I hear that Cuba is the envy of Latin America. They have better education and healthcare then the rest of the Americas, except maybe Canada. Cuba is a good place to live, American proganda tries to show that it isnt!

Lefty

18th February 2003, 21:02

Keeping capitalism out of Cuba, sure. Of course, it is keeping trade out of Cuba, too. And because of this, the people feel as though they cannot rise in economic status, which isn't cool. And then they come to America, where they feel that they can rise in economic status. Those words are directly from my previously-Cuban amigo's mouth, less than a minute ago.

Pete

18th February 2003, 21:35

Canada trades with Cuba. I have had someone scream at me for saying "Castro" once.

themanwill

18th February 2003, 21:35

Noam Chomsky tells all about the embargo and the relationship between Cuba and the US Rogue States. The Best bit is the mexican ambassadors response to JFK trying to organise colliective security in defence against Cuba back in the 60's in Mexico: The ambassador said he would regretfully have to decline because, if he were to tell Mexicans that Cuba was a threat to national secuirity, 40 million Mexicans would die laughing!

PunkRawker677

18th February 2003, 21:39

Joon. Why the hell not ***** about it? The more *****ing, the more people will hear about it. In miami, support for the embargo is drastically lowering. Why? BECAUSE TOO MANY PEOPLE WERE *****ING! Now we have more people *****ing.. just a lil' bit more *****ing and who knows what can happen!

Dr. Rosenpenis

18th February 2003, 22:25

The embargo is not being enforced because they fear communism, they have learned that Americans will believe anything their told, so even if Cuba succeeds, they will claim it's unfree. The embargo is enforced because they want to gain popularity among the Cuban-Americans in Miami that hate Cuba and Castro's regime.

ComradeJunichi

18th February 2003, 22:29

Evan
what you just posted certainly isnt progressive thinking or constructive criticism

I said my point was to get other to think that way.

What do you suggest to improve Cuba's economy with a crushing embargo on it?

I don't know. Cuban economy isn't going to collapse soon, and the embargo has been gotten used to already. Cuba still trades with other nations, and such.

And because of this, the people feel as though they cannot rise in economic status, which isn't cool. And then they come to America, where they feel that they can rise in economic status.

Rise in economic status?

PunkRawker677

Joon. Why the hell not ***** about it? The more *****ing, the more people will hear about it. In miami, support for the embargo is drastically lowering. Why? BECAUSE TOO MANY PEOPLE WERE *****ING! Now we have more people *****ing.. just a lil' bit more *****ing and who knows what can happen!

Do you honestly think that the US, still living in it's Cold War mentality, will lift the embargo on Cuba - a socialist state? It's not happening, not any time soon. Think it would be better to ***** about something that's not going to change, or work ways around it - the embargo.

Lefty

19th February 2003, 00:56

rise in economic status: make more money, feel less oppressed

and punkrawker is right, raising awareness is kinda the point of *****ing, and the more people that *****, the more will hear about the injustices that are being done, and eventually our "pointless *****ing" will help far more than you trying to quiet our "pointless *****ing"

And what did you think I was jealous of?

ComradeJunichi

19th February 2003, 01:20

Ofcourse, it might be easier for a rise in economic status in the US.

Yeah, you're "pointless *****ing" on the online messageboard will save the Cuban people and the American government will lift the embargo. Thinking of ways to work around the embargo, and such helps more than *****ing about an embargo which will not be lifted by McCarthyist America.

You asked if it was 'that time of month', I said 'no, are you jealous?'. Implying, that it was your time of month and it wasn't mine.

Charred Phoenix

19th February 2003, 07:29

Stop *****ing?
Hey, yeah, and while we're at it, let's take down the www.che-lives.com site! I mean, after all, injustices can't be stopped, so why should we bother *****ing about them.

Posting in this forum about the embargo WON'T get rid of it on its own, but it will help, someone may read this and then try and do something about it, that way we spur other to action AS WELL as doing something ourselves.

I suggest that members of this board that are interested in lifting the embargo on Cuba join together to write a pamphlet on the Cuban embargo and then each person prints a set off and distributes them as they see fit, if we can educate people on this matter, we will be moving closer towards lifting it than if we just fight amongst ourselves about what we should be doing....

oki

19th February 2003, 15:34

capitalism has allready entered cuba.they mostly relie on the tourists now,build huge hotels,and cubans make more money working at a hoteldesk then they do beeing a doctor.tourists get hasseled for a few dollars,a pair of jeans or even the soap from their hotelroom.it's simply a new class difference on the island,and if they don't watch out it will destroy cuba.but yea,the embargo is making the country so poor,and makes it nessesairy for them to look for income like tourism.

Lefty

19th February 2003, 20:55

1. that was a pretty worthless comeback, joon.
2. I read these boards for quite a while before actually joining. Our pointless *****ing might be heard by someone. And jeez, it's not like this is all I do to help the movement. I've written 3 anti-war editorials so far, and put flyers and posters up everywhere in my school. And organized a protest. What have you done to help the movement, Joon?

Guardia Bolivariano

19th February 2003, 21:28

Quote: from CrazyPete on 9:35 pm on Feb. 18, 2003
Canada trades with Cuba. I have had someone scream at me for saying "Castro" once.

What happened next?

ComradeJunichi

19th February 2003, 22:35

Charred Phoenix
Stop *****ing?

Yeah, did you read something wrong?

Hey, yeah, and while we're at it, let's take down the http://www.che-lives.com site! I mean, after all, injustices can't be stopped, so why should we bother *****ing about them.

Yeah, why bother *****ing about them? Do something about them.

Posting in this forum about the embargo WON'T get rid of it on its own, but it will help, someone may read this and then try and do something about it, that way we spur other to action AS WELL as doing something ourselves.

Like I've said before, do you actually think America is going to lift an embargo off of Cuba as long as it stays socialist? Think logically.

Lefty
1. that was a pretty worthless comeback, joon.

Pretty worthless insult or joke or whatever you meant it to be. Why the hell did you say it anyway? It had no point in the thread.

2. I read these boards for quite a while before actually joining. Our pointless *****ing might be heard by someone.

Heard, and more rhetoric following ultra liberal revolution is cool leftists. You can't blame all of Cuba's problems on the US. Open up your minds.

And jeez, it's not like this is all I do to help the movement. I've written 3 anti-war editorials so far, and put flyers and posters up everywhere in my school. And organized a protest.

LOL! Now you're a revolutionary. What the hell does this have to do with anything at all? I never said anything about you helping the revolution.

What have you done to help the movement, Joon?

I'd prefer to educate myself before going around acting like I know, and claim to stand up for a belief that I barely know about. Flyers, posters, speeches in school, Amnesty International, gone out to the ghetto's of Seoul to help feed and build homes for the hungry and homeless (habitat for humanity), visit MokPo orphanage (and several others in Seoul) monthly to help out, set up a small organization, made one pamphlet, organized a assembly with the assistance of my counselor and group about the hungry/poor/homeless, and whatever. That doesn't matter.

Charred Phoenix

20th February 2003, 08:48

So you don't even ***** about it, you just know about it? -_^

ComradeJunichi

20th February 2003, 14:59

You can criticize the embargo, you can't blame all of Cuba's problems on the US. Find ways to criticize it, not just say "Amerikkk sux0rs because they dropped this trade stopping majig on Cuba and stuff".

Put yourself in Kennedy, or any other high ranking official, at that time period. Two superpowers of the world, you and the Soviet Union. Constant rivalry, and now it's at your doorstep, 90 miles south of you! Theories and rumors are coming up that Soviet missiles are being set up in Cuba, a SOCIALIST country! Now what do you do to stop a poor little country who has the aid of the only other superpower.

Every country has the right to protect their sovereignity, so they dropped an embargo on Cuba hoping it would change their minds. So, it's all okay and over right? Wrong. A way to criticize the embargo, is how it was placed. The embargo was placed rather prematurely if you remember.

That's just one thing to give an example.

I don't ***** and whine about it because Cuba ain't getting off the embargo, it's gonna stay. I am trying to think of a way to work around it with another solution. I know someone who has connections, and I'm going to Cuba next year or so, and maybe I'll get to present my solution.

Larissa

20th February 2003, 16:54

http://playagiron.org/ppr/embargo.php

An interesting view about the embargo on Cuba.

Lefty

20th February 2003, 20:24

All hail the glorious revolutionary Joon. What's the point of protesting, anyway? It doesn't matter, the leader's opinions won't be changed. You have helped me to see the light, Joon. I will now sit in my room for every minute possible, avoiding all human contact.

ComradeJunichi

20th February 2003, 21:39

Stop withdrawing to sarcasm to run from argument, and stop calling me Joon like you know me. Because you don't know me, I don't know you and I don't give a shit about you and quite frankly I wouldn't give a shit if you died, don't call me 'friend' or whatever either.

I never said anything or implied anything about being a revolutionary, infact I don't consider myself anywhere close. I prefer to study before fighting for something.

Don't put words into my mouth, I told everyone to stop *****ing about something that won't be changing.

Lefty

21st February 2003, 05:12

Yes, we should quit *****ing about the war, too. That won't change, eh, Joon? Eh, old buddy old pal?

Charred Phoenix

21st February 2003, 08:27

Junich, why do you keep falling back on the argument that you prefer to learn /before/ you fight for someone, there has to be a certain spot where you make up your mind and fight for what you believe in, or perhaps Che was just an ignorant child fighting for something he knew nothing about?

ComradeJunichi

21st February 2003, 15:34

It's Junichi, not Junich.

I'm not falling back on an argument. I'm saying I'd prefer to educate myself before I try and fight for what I believe, because obviously if I'm fighting for something I barely know about it would be pointless. When the hell did Che get involved with this? I'm talking about myself, not Che.

Liberty Lover

22nd February 2003, 04:18

The U.S. government has only one prerequsite for the lifting of the embargo on Cuba:

Democratic elections

If Castro cared about his people then he would meet this demand

Pete

22nd February 2003, 04:25

"We are seeking something new that will allow a perfect identification between the government and the community as a whole, adpated to the special condition s of the building of socialisim and avoiding to the uptmost the common places of bourgeois democracy"
Che Guevara "Man and Socialism In Cuba"

Cuba has developed it's own form of government. The leaders are elected. There is an opposition party, but it operates completely different then America does, and America is hardly democratic (ELECTORIAL COLLEGE = REPUBLIC). In Cuba the leaders start intiatives, and then the workers either do them or don't. The entire society is setup as a school, so the leaders teach the people and the people who have become educated enough become part of the leaders, yet stay one wtih teh people. This is a like 'tuning fork' (che), the people and the leaders come together and talk until an intiative that benifits the whole of society is created. Worker councils talking with Castro are much more democratic then Representives doing as they please.
Aristotle said that the mass rule could either be pure as a "Polity" as Cuba is surely close to, or corrupt as a "Republican Democracy" AMERICA.

Liberty Lover

22nd February 2003, 04:35

Cuba is based on a one party system. The only people who may consider this democratic are the people who agree with that one particular party. So the philosophy of Castro is "Fuck everyone who dosn't agree with me"

Pete

22nd February 2003, 04:44

His philosphy is actually "If my intiative fails and the workers tell me I'll stop that intiative"

I just realized this, but you are in the from forum LL. Quit posting here!!!

There are opposition parties in Cuba...they just are not popular becasuet he people WANT communism. America says 'fuck everyone who doesnt agree with me' how many times has bush said that basic thing?

Liberty Lover

22nd February 2003, 04:48

The only way we can know whether or not Cuban's "WANT communism" is through democractic elections.

pastradamus

22nd February 2003, 04:50

Democratic elections,you guys should try that in america.

Pete

22nd February 2003, 04:51

THEY HAVE ELECTIONS GET THAT THREW YOUR FUCKING SKULL ASSHOLE GET THE HELL OUT OF THIS FORUM AND GO SIT ON YOUR FUCKING FINGER. IF YOU READ WHAT WE SAY YOU WILL REALIZE THAT REPEATING THE SAME FUCKING WEAK POINT ALL THE TIME WITHOUT FUCKING PROOF IS A TRAP AND WE WILL SNAP ON YOU LIK ETHIS. FUCK. SHOW INTELLIGENCE FUCKER!! GET THE HELL OUT OF THIS FORUM AND STAY IN YOUR FUCKING CAGE AND GROW A FUCKING BRAIN!!

shit that needed to come out.