Bullshit Racist Message Going Around

[andrew_the_fox]

This is going around in both e-mail and on blogs, and I completely disagree with these statements and am against this whole thing but I want to re-post with answers to all these bull shit claims, can anyone help me? This is a disugsting attempt at making racism acceptable and I need you guys to help me write up a leftist response to this.

thanks guys


The letter starts like this::

Before u say i am racist read this...


You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.
You call me "Cracker", "Honkey", "Whitey" and even "The Man" and you think it's OK.
But when I call you, "Nigger", "Kike", "Towelhead", "Sand Nigger", "Camel Jockey", "Beaner" or "Chink" you call me a racist.

You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?

You have the United Negro College Fund.
You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Cesar Chavez Day.
You have Yom Hashoah
You have Ma'uled Al-Nabi
You have the NAACP.
You have BET.

If we had WET(white entertainment television) we'd be racists.

If we had a White Pride Day you would call us racists.

If we had white history month, we'd be racists.

If we had an organization for only whites to "advance" our lives, we'd be racists.

If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships, you know we'd be racists.

In the Million Man March, you believed that you were marching for your race and rights.
If we marched for our race and rights, you would call us racists.

You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you're not afraid to announce it.

But when we announce our white pride, you call us racists.


You rob us, carjack us, and shoot at us.
But, when a white police officer shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running from the law and posing a threat to society, you call him a racist.


I am white.
I am proud.


But, you call me a racist.
Why is it that only whites can be racists?


Repost or Forward if you agree

[Ownthink]

Track the author down and murder him, that's what you do.

[C_Rasmussen]

I dont agree with all of it but I do agree with the concept that theres that double standard playing and I dont like it. Double standard is shit if you ask me. Why can't we all just get along without blacks being superior to whites or whites being superior to blacks?

[WUOrevolt]

Well, there are all these holidays and black pride groups because of the racism and oppression they have recieved.

There are White Pride organizations, but many of them are tied to the KKK, such as the NAAWP, which was started by former grand dragon of the KKK David Duke.

[C_Rasmussen]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2005, 11:31 PM
Well, there are all these holidays and black pride groups because of the racism and oppression they have recieved.

There are White Pride organizations, but many of them are tied to the KKK, such as the NAAWP, which was started by former grand dragon of the KKK David Duke.
Maybe so but keep in mind that if someone started a peaceful white pride organization with no intention of doing harm to another race other races would still look down at that?

[andrew_the_fox]

Heres what I've Come Up With -

You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction. - how often to african americans sneer at you?

You call me "Cracker", "Honkey", "Whitey" and even "The Man" and you think it's OK. - honestly whens the last time you were called any of those words in an offensive non -joking manner?



But when I call you, "Nigger", "Kike", "Towelhead", "Sand Nigger", "Camel Jockey", "Beaner" or "Chink" you call me a racist. - First of all, when have you ever had the balls to call an african american a ni**er to their face? Also when have any of these ethnic groups offended you to give reason to your use of those words?



You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live? - Who says whites commit a lot of violence against different ethnicities? The ghettos are dangerous places to live because of the level of poverty and oppression that is there, being such a racist i find it impossible to believe you would ever go near one for fear of being called a cracker or honkey.

You have the United Negro College Fund. - so?
You have Martin Luther King Day. - so?
You have Cesar Chavez Day. so?
You have Yom Hashoah so?
You have Ma'uled Al-Nabi so?
You have the NAACP. So?
You have BET. So?

If we had WET(white entertainment television) we'd be racists. - idk what to say
If we had a White Pride Day you would call us racists. - idk what to say
If we had white history month, we'd be racists. - idk what to say

If we had an organization for only whites to "advance" our lives, we'd be racists. - Whites have it better then any ethnic group as it is, white people should be helping advance the minorities because they are discriminated against.

If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships, you know we'd be racists.

In the Million Man March, you believed that you were marching for your race and rights.

If we marched for our race and rights, you would call us racists.

You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you're not afraid to announce it.


But when we announce our white pride, you call us racists.


You rob us, carjack us, and shoot at us. - That is an incredibly contradictory statement to the opening statment "I am not racist"


But, when a white police officer shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running from the law and posing a threat to society, you call him a racist.


I am white.
I am proud.


But, you call me a racist.

Why is it that only whites can be racists?


guys try and help me fill in the blanks with intelligent responses so i can repost and forward the real truths not this racist filth

[Xvall]

What a dumbass. This is just a condensation of every piece of Nazi rhetoric circulating the internet. For your amusement; I shall REBUKE.


Before u say i am racist read this...

You're a racist, and why would you announce this before hand? The only reason anyone would think you're a racist from the first sentence is if you declared something like "I'm not racist or anything, but..."; which you did. Were your first sentence anything else the thought of racism wouldn't even have crossed their mind.

Oh yeah, and "u" is not a word. -5 points.


You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.

You're immediately distancing yourself from the audience by implementing a "Us vs. Them" mentality, which not only makes the audience the target of your hatred, but generalizes that "we" sneer at you and just goes to exemplify what an ignorant little piece of shit you are.


You call me "Cracker", "Honkey", "Whitey" and even "The Man" and you think it's OK.

Again with the "Us Vs. Them" mentality! Is this e-mail written to appeal to a white audience, or to tell us colored people just how upset you are that every one of us comes up to you can calls you a deregatory slur. (At least that's what you are insinuating.) And who the fuck would call you "The Man"? You're too stupid to have any authority and no one has any respect for you. Who the fuck are you anyways?


But when I call you, "Nigger", "Kike", "Towelhead", "Sand Nigger", "Camel Jockey", "Beaner" or "Chink" you call me a racist.

I wonder why. See, I always thought that when people called me a "sand nigger" they were trying to be empathetic!


You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?

Hell if I know. Something about living below the poverty line in an environment that provides little means of escaping said predicament.


You have the United Negro College Fund.
You have the NAACP.

Contrary to popular belief, there are other college funds extending to whites. Through my college life alone I've stumbled across advertisements for Polish and Italian Scholarships, along with a number pretaining to certain religions.


You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Cesar Chavez Day.

Because only minorities celebrate that. :rolleyes:


You have Yom Hashoah

Yeah man, what the fuck is wrong with us? Remembering the slaughter of 6,000,000 innocent Jews! HOW RACIST!


You have Ma'uled Al-Nabi

I've never heard of this, and I don't know what the fuck you're talking about. I bet most of the people reading this don't know what the last one is either.


You have BET.

And the women have "Oxygen"! Sexism! What's next - Mexican TV stations!? :lol:


If we had WET(white entertainment television) we'd be racists.

There are "white" television channels. Of course, no one hears about them or watches them because they suck ass and are run by white supremacist organizations. Maybe if you tried appealing to more than .1% of the population you'd be doing a little better.


If we had a White Pride Day you would call us racists.

Because you are a racist, and the only people I know who have suggested this sort of thing are racists too! And they do have Irish, Polish, and other festivals celebrating european nationality - do those not count!?


If we had white history month, we'd be racists.

See above.


If we had an organization for only whites to "advance" our lives, we'd be racists.

See above.


If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships, you know we'd be racists.

See way above.


If we marched for our race and rights, you would call us racists.

That's because everytime you fucking march you have crowds of skinheads waving swastika banners around. And you fucking are racist! Fucking deal with it!


You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you're not afraid to announce it.

Who the FUCK is orange!?


But when we announce our white pride, you call us racists.

I wonder if your next statement implies such a thing.


You rob us, carjack us, and shoot at us.

No, silly me. Accusing "us" (Which you never fully exlain) of robbing, carjacking, and shooting at you isn't generalizing on the basis of race at all.


But, when a white police officer shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running from the law and posing a threat to society, you call him a racist.

No, we don't; police officers do this sort of thing all the time and usually are congradulated by the population. If they are accused of brutality, they usually get away with it. We do have a problem, however, when a police officer shoots a man numerous times for pulling out his wallet.


I am white.

No shit.


I am proud.

Good for you!


But, you call me a racist.

Because you are!


Why is it that only whites can be racists?

http://forum.idg.it/images/smilies/eusa_wall.gif

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2005, 11:20 PM
You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.
You call me "Cracker", "Honkey", "Whitey" and even "The Man" and you think it's OK.
But when I call you, "Nigger", "Kike", "Towelhead", "Sand Nigger", "Camel Jockey", "Beaner" or "Chink" you call me a racist.

When someone is called "cracker" it hardly has the same weight as being called any of those other words because whites have long been at the top and suppressed, conquered, enslaved and murdered those who were not like them. Obviously racism in all forms should be challenged, but attempting to justify your racism because of somebody else's is counterproductive.


You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?

White segregationist policies created the massive black ghettos in many urban cities during the 20th century. These policies ended at roughly the same time as deindustrialization hit, causing jobs and the middle and upper classes to leave the ghetto. This has precipitated a break down in social cohesion and organization which ultimately results in violence. This is true of all people in such areas, whatever their skin color.


You have the United Negro College Fund.

And? Whites are still more likely to go to college because most whites receive a better education and attend schools that aren't falling apart. Funds such as this are a response to historically low college enrollment by blacks.


You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Cesar Chavez Day.

You have President's Day and Columbus Day, not to mention Thanksgiving, and I'd say the motherfuckers celebrated at those did a whole hell of a lot worse things than King or Chavez.


You have Yom Hashoah

I suppost genocide is a minor issue? And considering I had to google this, is it really that prominent?


You have Ma'uled Al-Nabi

You have Christmas, Easter, All Saint's Day.... do I need to continue?


You have the NAACP.
You have BET.

If we had WET(white entertainment television) we'd be racists.

These sort of statements ignore historical reality and the complexity of US race relations. These statements would have validity if everyone started on an even playing field and some were recognized more, or whatever, but that is certainly not the case in the US. I also direct you to this article:

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews...on/12386697.htm (http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/opinion/12386697.htm)


If we had white history month, we'd be racists.


Look at most general K-12 curriculums and tell me that every month is not already "white history month" with a straight face.


If we had an organization for only whites to "advance" our lives, we'd be racists.

If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships, you know we'd be racists.

Once again ignoring historical reality.


In the Million Man March, you believed that you were marching for your race and rights.
If we marched for our race and rights, you would call us racists.

Your race doesn't need to assert itself or its "rights" because it is at the top.


You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you're not afraid to announce it.

But when we announce our white pride, you call us racists.

Because you are. Pan-white nationalism has no historical base in anything except as a racist response to other oppressed nationalisms in an attempt to legitimate its own racism. Black pride is not racism, its taking pride in your people that have been suppressed and denied their own history. White pride has no such base. Furthermore, white pride seeks to divide and disempower, while other nationalisms seek to unite and empower.


You rob us, carjack us, and shoot at us.
But, when a white police officer shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running from the law and posing a threat to society, you call him a racist.

Who is "you?" Do only people of color do these things, or do whites do them as well? is crime motivated by race, or by socio-economic factors? If you said the latter, you're correct. And both of your two examples are illegal, the police do not (technically) exist to dispense justice, only to stop those who break the law and bring them to the courts to punish.


I am white.
I am proud.

White as pan-aryanism does not exist. You are a racist.


But, you call me a racist.
Why is it that only whites can be racists?

Others can be racist, but this is an attempt to spread more racism, not work against racism.


Repost or Forward if you agree

And add your name, address and a recent photo, so we know where to find you.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2005, 11:44 PM
Who the FUCK is orange!?
Those people who go tanning throughout the winter? :lol:

[Black Dagger]

I dont agree with all of it but I do agree with the concept that theres that double standard playing and I dont like it.

You dont' really understand the dynamics of oppression do you? There is a double standard, it's called racist oppression, and 'white' people are rarely if ever the 'victims' of it. Minority/oppressed groups asserting themselves in organisations or programs that aim at self-empowerment is not a double standard, well unless you consider 'white' people oppressed and in need of self-empowerment?



Double standard is shit if you ask me. Why can't we all just get along without blacks being superior to whites or whites being superior to blacks?

*sigh* No one ever mentioned anything about wanting 'blacks to be superior to whites', it's about empowering those that are oppressed, not oppressing white people- that is so obvious it's a chore to type.



Maybe so but keep in mind that if someone started a peaceful white pride organization with no intention of doing harm to another race other races would still look down at that?

Of course they would and rightly so. What purpose would this 'peaceful white pride' organisation serve? 'White' people are not an oppressed minority, nor are they the subjects of historically compounded identity de-valuing stereotypes, and racism.

[andrew_the_fox]

thanks guys these are great, cant wait to reply with this and see who has shit to say, i will have to post some responses if anyone has the balls to even open there mouth after reading this

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 12:04 AM
thanks guys these are great, cant wait to reply with this and see who has shit to say, i will have to post some responses if anyone has the balls to even open there mouth after reading this
They can bring it on. :ph34r:

[C_Rasmussen]

Originally posted by Black [email protected] 2 2005, 11:58 PM

I dont agree with all of it but I do agree with the concept that theres that double standard playing and I dont like it.

You dont' really understand the dynamics of oppression do you? There is a double standard, it's called racist oppression, and 'white' people are rarely if ever the 'victims' of it. Minority/oppressed groups asserting themselves in organisations or programs that aim at self-empowerment is not a double standard, well unless you consider 'white' people oppressed and in need of self-empowerment?



Double standard is shit if you ask me. Why can't we all just get along without blacks being superior to whites or whites being superior to blacks?

*sigh* No one ever mentioned anything about wanting 'blacks to be superior to whites', it's about empowering those that are oppressed, not oppressing white people- that is so obvious it's a chore to type.



Maybe so but keep in mind that if someone started a peaceful white pride organization with no intention of doing harm to another race other races would still look down at that?

Of course they would and rightly so. What purpose would this 'peaceful white pride' organisation serve? 'White' people are not an oppressed minority, nor are they the subjects of historically compounded identity de-valuing stereotypes, and racism.
Well the way black people go about it (from what I've noticed at least) make it seem like they're TRYING to oppress a generation that doesn't even have to do with the unfortunate shit they went through. If they want to blame any generation they should blame my grandma's generation and generations prior.

Whites could hold a rally without having the KKK or neos involved and make it peaceful. It would have to be pretty narrow though or else it would fall under racism but they could rally against double standard seeing as ALL people should be equal without this crap.

[Commie Rat]

White, Proud And Stupid - Propaghandi

[bcbm]

Well the way black people go about it

Go about what? Reacting to 500 years of racism that has, in the past 50 years, mutated from overt, easily fought racism into much more subtle racism that is difficult to pinpoint and fight and left them high and dry?


they're TRYING to oppress a generation that doesn't even have to do with the unfortunate shit they went through

If you think whites today are any more innocent, you're deluding yourself. It doesn't matter if you didn't start it if you aren't doing shit to stop it.


Whites could hold a rally without having the KKK or neos involved and make it peaceful.

A rally for what?

[C_Rasmussen]

Originally posted by black banner black [email protected] 3 2005, 12:30 AM

Well the way black people go about it

Go about what? Reacting to 500 years of racism that has, in the past 50 years, mutated from overt, easily fought racism into much more subtle racism that is difficult to pinpoint and fight and left them high and dry?


they're TRYING to oppress a generation that doesn't even have to do with the unfortunate shit they went through

If you think whites today are any more innocent, you're deluding yourself. It doesn't matter if you didn't start it if you aren't doing shit to stop it.


Whites could hold a rally without having the KKK or neos involved and make it peaceful.

A rally for what?
I just fucking told you what the rally was for. Read up a bit in my last post.

Anyway how they go about "going against whitey". Think for yourself on that one <_<.

No we didn&#39;t fucking start it. Like I said they should blame the elder generation for that not the younger generation. We&#39;re not putting them in plantations and compounds. That was A LONG time ago. Don&#39;t blame us, blame our fucking ancestors.

[Xvall]

How many black people do you know that have expressed these sentiments, or is this what you&#39;ve concluded from watching the American media and listening to people on the internet?

[bcbm]

I just fucking told you what the rally was for. Read up a bit in my last post.

So a rally exclusively for whites to end "double standards?" You mean the "double standards" that exist to make up for 500 years of pro-white double standards and make people actually equal? If you want whites to rally for something, how about rallying to fucking end de facto segregation and truly integrate or build up communities? That sounds more like equality than complaining about BET or AA.


Anyway how they go about "going against whitey". Think for yourself on that one <_< .

Thanks for the non-answer, its really progressing the discussion.


No we didn&#39;t fucking start it. Like I said they should blame the elder generation for that not the younger generation. We&#39;re not putting them in plantations and compounds. That was A LONG time ago. Don&#39;t blame us, blame our fucking ancestors.

I didn&#39;t say you fucking started it: It doesn&#39;t matter if you didn&#39;t start it if you aren&#39;t doing shit to stop it.

[RebelOutcast]

I&#39;d point out that the majority of rapes are committed by white men.
And is it me or do most pedophiles seem to be white?

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

BBBG and BlackDagger have done a good job refuting this, but I just wanted to throw in a little tidbit of knowledge:

"We" don&#39;t "have" BET. BET is owned by White people. :)

[celticfire]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 05:44 AM
http://www.wildfiregames.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/banger.gif
Don&#39;t worry. I&#39;m a white guy and I share your frustration at him&#33;
Please remember he doesn&#39;t speak for all of us, there&#39;s thousands (probably even millions) of progressive whites out there...please remember that&#33; :(

[Bannockburn]

I&#39;m not going to refute any of the claims. I think that has been established already. However, double standards to exist in this world, and they should be recognized. Nevertheless, this particular post isn&#39;t one of them. In all honestly, most of the programs that are “for blacks” or whatever is simply because of racism. If racism did not exist, then there is a very good chance neither would the programs. Hence, this email, and attitudes alike it simply reinforce and show how racist our societies are

[Hampton]

No we didn&#39;t fucking start it. Like I said they should blame the elder generation for that not the younger generation. We&#39;re not putting them in plantations and compounds. That was A LONG time ago. Don&#39;t blame us, blame our fucking ancestors.

Well actually...there are around one millions of them in prison and all have a one in three chance, or 33%, of going to prison during their lives, not to mention that:

In twelve states, between 10 and 15 percent of adult black men are incarcerated.

· In ten states, between 5 and 10 percent of black adults are incarcerated.

· In twelve states, black men are incarcerated at rates between twelve and sixteen times greater than those of white men.

· In fifteen states, black women are incarcerated at rates between ten and thirty-five times greater than those of white women.

· In six states, black youth under age eighteen are incarcerated in adult facilities at rates between twelve and twenty-five times greater than those of white youth.

[Ric_god]

What don&#39;t like about it is the term "We."
Who the fuck is "WE"? Am I part of it, hmm?

Stuff like that only further seperates people who do not need to be separated. There is no need to be "proud" to be black, it implies superiority. The exact same applies for those who are "proud" to be white. If people want to have some sort of celebration or whatever for their heritage, then that&#39;s fair enough and I won&#39;t make a fuss, but personally, I won&#39;t celebrate anything which groups people like that, it seems very unneeded

I cannot understand why, in this day and age, why people still give a damm about skin colour. If you have a passport to a country, then it is your country, black or white.

The whole issue of Nations, however, is another matter entirely.

[tatu]

You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.

What? Every single person who is not white?
What a load of tripe. Well, that’s probably because you’ve got issues of your own to resolve other than you are a complete racist (chip on your shoulder, maybe?).



You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?


The above quote is racist in its own right. It&#39;s obviously suggesting that ethnicities other white people are the only type of humans that maintain, create the poor conditions within a “ghetto”.
In England we have housing estates that can be predominately white areas, believe me when I say this… THEY ARE COMPLETE HOLES&#33; Full of crime, prostitution and poverty. So, regardless of whether you are white, black, yellow, brown etc you are susceptible to all the above. It doesn&#39;t take Einstein to work that one out.

[MiniOswald]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 05:20 AM

You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.

Sorry, my face is just stuck this way :( Im trying to smile at you

[bunk]

Unfortunately most of it is true, there&#39;s no simple answer

[OkaCrisis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 04:19 PM
There is no need to be "proud" to be black, it implies superiority. The exact same applies for those who are "proud" to be white. If people want to have some sort of celebration or whatever for their heritage, then that&#39;s fair enough and I won&#39;t make a fuss, but personally, I won&#39;t celebrate anything which groups people like that, it seems very unneeded
Being proud to be black does serve a purpose when for hundreds of years, and even today, being black was/is made to be a source of shame for black people.

Being proud to be black is being proud to have fought oppression for your rights. Being proud to be black gives power to an otherwise disempowered group of people.

You have to look at it in its historical context. If slavery, victimization, exploiatation and oppression are a part of that history (not that I&#39;m saying that it&#39;s over, because it surely is not), and that group of people have risen above to combat those things, have fought and worked for their "equal" rights in this society, then there is nothing wrong about being proud to be black. Black people&#39;s emancipation should be celebrated, because it represents that capitalist constructs (like racism) can indeed be overcome.

On the other hand, being proud to be white must be looked at in the same way, within its historical context. If colonialism, imperialism, genocide of indiginous peoples, and blatant outright capitalism which is the source of other&#39;s slavery/exploitation/oppression worldwide, and even today characterizes that history, which it does, then anyone who claims to be proud to be white must be proud of all of those historical atrocities, as well as the sick sad state of the world as it exists under capitalism today.

I&#39;m white. And I am not proud.

black banner black gun is exactly right. If you aren&#39;t part of the solution, you&#39;re part of the problem. It&#39;s not good enough to simply not be racist.

I am an anti-racist. For that I am proud.

[Martyr]

Racist means the oppresion of anohters race. I agree with him however the whites do not have as much of a struggle as did the blacks it is still Ironic that if a black man makes fun of a white male or female its funny but if its the other way around its racist and they don&#39;t want to have racism...

[Martyr]

And if I was black arab asian or native or whatever I would be proud so I&#39;am proud to be white.

[Black Dagger]

And if I was black arab asian or native or whatever I would be proud so I&#39;am proud to be white.

So you&#39;re proud to be &#39;white&#39;? Why?

[Ownthink]

Originally posted by Black [email protected] 3 2005, 11:07 PM

And if I was black arab asian or native or whatever I would be proud so I&#39;am proud to be white.

So you&#39;re proud to be &#39;white&#39;? Why?
Because he is a total fucking moron with racist tendencies.


At least that&#39;s my take on it.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 02:33 PM
Unfortunately most of it is true, there&#39;s no simple answer
What about it is true? All of it has been more than refuted, I&#39;m curious to what you&#39;re still finding an issue with.

[LA GUERRA OLVIDADA]

This dude&#39;s logicality is fucking COMPLETELY backwards. If whites had been taken from their homelands by Africans and brought to America and enslaved then whites would have their day. Whites don&#39;t have their day because they&#39;ve been the oppressors for hundreds of years, specifically in this country.

[Xvall]

Originally posted by celticfire+Dec 3 2005, 02:50 PM--> (celticfire @ Dec 3 2005, 02:50 PM)
[email protected] 3 2005, 05:44 AM
http://www.wildfiregames.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/banger.gif
Don&#39;t worry. I&#39;m a white guy and I share your frustration at him&#33;
Please remember he doesn&#39;t speak for all of us, there&#39;s thousands (probably even millions) of progressive whites out there...please remember that&#33; :( [/b]
I completely understand. I wouldn&#39;t think otherwise.

[Ric_god]

Originally posted by OkaCrisis+Dec 3 2005, 11:52 PM--> (OkaCrisis &#064; Dec 3 2005, 11:52 PM)
[email protected] 3 2005, 04:19 PM
There is no need to be "proud" to be black, it implies superiority. The exact same applies for those who are "proud" to be white. If people want to have some sort of celebration or whatever for their heritage, then that&#39;s fair enough and I won&#39;t make a fuss, but personally, I won&#39;t celebrate anything which groups people like that, it seems very unneeded
Being proud to be black does serve a purpose when for hundreds of years, and even today, being black was/is made to be a source of shame for black people.

Being proud to be black is being proud to have fought oppression for your rights. Being proud to be black gives power to an otherwise disempowered group of people.

You have to look at it in its historical context. If slavery, victimization, exploiatation and oppression are a part of that history (not that I&#39;m saying that it&#39;s over, because it surely is not), and that group of people have risen above to combat those things, have fought and worked for their "equal" rights in this society, then there is nothing wrong about being proud to be black. Black people&#39;s emancipation should be celebrated, because it represents that capitalist constructs (like racism) can indeed be overcome.

On the other hand, being proud to be white must be looked at in the same way, within its historical context. If colonialism, imperialism, genocide of indiginous peoples, and blatant outright capitalism which is the source of other&#39;s slavery/exploitation/oppression worldwide, and even today characterizes that history, which it does, then anyone who claims to be proud to be white must be proud of all of those historical atrocities, as well as the sick sad state of the world as it exists under capitalism today.

I&#39;m white. And I am not proud.

black banner black gun is exactly right. If you aren&#39;t part of the solution, you&#39;re part of the problem. It&#39;s not good enough to simply not be racist.

I am an anti-racist. For that I am proud. [/b]
I can understand the terrible ways blacks were treated, that much is obvious. But in this day and age, in this country (UK,) having any sort of this and that "pride" is unneeded. It will only further seperate people, and lead to these sorts of stupid chain emails.

Should slavery,imperialism and oppression be forgotten? Of course not, they are taught in schools as they should be, such as slavery and the civil rights movement. But a celebration of civil rights should be celebrated by everyone, black or white. A white person should be just as proud of equal rights for all as a black person would, I certainly am.

It might seem controversial, but I don&#39;t see heritage as anything to be proud of. Why would one racial group be more proud than another, everyone in this country right now should be proud the equal society that exists.

I don&#39;t feel ashamed for being white, and what terrible things were carried out by white people. Personally, I don&#39;t care, white, black whatever. Terrible things were done by white people, but not by me. I would fight for a black person&#39;s equal rights, so why should a celebration of equality only be for black people? An equal society has been created, why should we not all be proud of that?

But like I said, I&#39;m not really bothered if some racial group do want to celebrate somthing, of course they have the right to do that, and I won&#39;t try and stop it. It&#39;s just that I think it would be nicer to have celebrations by everyone , black, white, asian, for everyone for is truely proud to live in a multi-cultural society.

I too am an anti-racist. But with that comes the belief that somthing should be particular to one race or another, everything should be shared, and should be equal.

For example, in my school recently, there was a day when all the asian kids were taken out of school in a "potential building" day. They were basically being told that they didn&#39;t need to grow up to be cab drivers or work in a corner shop. I cannot see why this was needed. In what way did it promote a multi-cultural school? If anything, it only promoted a image that asian kids are less intelligent, or have less aspirations for their future. Seperation only encourages alienation, and why encourage that? Pride and celebration should be shared, just as our society is.

[Hiero]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 07:33 AM
Unfortunately most of it is true, there&#39;s no simple answer
Can you elaborate on that?

[Black Dagger]

... having any sort of this and that "pride" is unneeded. It will only further seperate people, and lead to these sorts of stupid chain emails.

No it won&#39;t, because &#39;black pride&#39; and &#39;white pride&#39; are not the same thing, the method is different, and the goal is different.



But a celebration of civil rights should be celebrated by everyone, black or white.

No one is talking about celebrating the civil rights movement or not, what is the relevance of this?




It might seem controversial, but I don&#39;t see heritage as anything to be proud of.

It&#39;s not about being &#39;proud&#39; for prides sake, it&#39;s about reversing a negative trend of self-loathing, and feelings of disempowerment, weakness and so forth, that come with hundreds of years of racist oppression, stereotyping and so forth.



Why would one racial group be more proud than another, everyone in this country right now should be proud the equal society that exists.

The UK is an &#39;equal society&#39;? :blink:
You&#39;ve got to be kidding...



I don&#39;t feel ashamed for being white, and what terrible things were carried out by white people.

Yeah yeah, no one is saying that, so don&#39;t bring up the &#39;why should i feel ashamed?&#39; line.



Personally, I don&#39;t care, white, black whatever. An equal society has been created, why should we not all be proud of that?

Like i&#39;ve already said, what &#39;equal society&#39;? And why should anyone be &#39;proud&#39; of a class society?

[OkaCrisis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 11:45 AM
Why would one racial group be more proud than another, everyone in this country right now should be proud the equal society that exists.

An equal society has been created, why should we not all be proud of that?

I too am an anti-racist. But with that comes the belief that somthing should be particular to one race or another, everything should be shared, and should be equal.
My point is that equal societies do not exist. Black and Native people are still overrepresented in prisons, and underrepresented in politics, business, etc. and that&#39;s no accident.

If you&#39;re an anti-racist you have to recognize those things, and fight against them.

[Ric_god]

I&#39;m really not doing the "why cant I be proud?" rubbish. I hate it when people use the term "we" for "us" white people. Or "our" country when talking about immigrants. I concider "We" to be all humans, as I would feel no "siding" to black or white, which is the basis for my arguement. Surely "we" everyone can be proud and fight for equality, not just "we" black people or "we" white people.

As for the civil rights movment, how it is not relevent to Black pride?

I just personally won&#39;t support any racial separation. Yes, certain racial groups are "over-represented" in prisons, and I would fight against that along with other forms on inequality, but I think that the fight should be by everyone, regardless of heritage. I just dont think that a celebration should be limited to black or white people, can we not celebrate and fight for shared equality together?

If I were to go to a Black Pride day celebration, chances are, I&#39;d look like a white spot on a domino. Now dont think that I&#39;m in any way racist, or jelious, or any of that rubbish. It just would be better to have a universally shared celebration by black and white people who all support equality and racialy fairness.

I can certainly see that white history seems to consist of imperialisation and slavery, and there is no reason to celebrate that, but I just feel that anti-racist white people should be able to join in with celebrations of other races heritage, without feeling so out of place.

Black Dagger- I agree with much of what you have said, that alot of British society is unequal, and that reversing negative self image is needed. I just feel such changes are the responsibility of everyone, regardless of racial group.

[eyedrop]

You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.


Thats because you forgot to take of your KKK robe from the last meeting.

[Clutch]

Don&#39;t know if it has been said before either, but, there is no such fucking thing as a "white race."

[Xiao Banfa]

I&#39;m proud of my white pigmentation created by the lack of sun from my ancestors in the british isles. My white prick (smaller than black ones) dribbles glee.

This chat is all very silly.

Just be proud to be a fucking communist&#33;

[Martyr]

Originally posted by Ownthink+Dec 3 2005, 09:15 PM--> (Ownthink @ Dec 3 2005, 09:15 PM)
Black [email protected] 3 2005, 11:07 PM

And if I was black arab asian or native or whatever I would be proud so I&#39;am proud to be white.

So you&#39;re proud to be &#39;white&#39;? Why?
Because he is a total fucking moron with racist tendencies.


At least that&#39;s my take on it. [/b]
Were have I said that I was a racist or have stated that I dislike a certain culture I just don&#39;t appove of someone else making fun of anothers race colour or beliefs whatever that race may be. I simply stated that if you are white, black, asian, native, arab you should not try and act a different race take for instance those white rapper wannabe&#39;s who want to be a "Rebel" in a way I hate that because they are pretending something they are not which is black. And I know that we are all one and there should never be any racist remarks on both sides. Yes the whites oppressed black people yes they oppressed other cultures but it was in past. The Jews were persecuted close to 2000 years and the majority still forgived all those who persecuted them in the past and I never heard them making fun of Germans or Arabs or other cultures. So accept the race that you are in and embrace the good things that came out of it and the hereos that were in your culture and race. And please point out were have I have been racist. If you don&#39;t know what it is here is the definition of a racist from the website www.Dictionary.com

1.The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

2.Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

3.A person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others

[Ownthink]

I simply stated that if you are white, black, asian, native, arab you should not try and act a different race take for instance those white rapper wannabe&#39;s who want to be a "Rebel" in a way I hate that because they are pretending something they are not which is black.
Racist&#33; The genre of rap music is not only "for" Blacks&#33; Anyone that wants to listen to it can&#33; By generalizing this as "black", you are only perpetuating these stereotypes

Oh, and being "proud to be white" is racism, as well.

[Martyr]

^^ um no you did not understand me those who try and act and say they are black are the ones who are fooling themselves. Those who rap I care less just don&#39;t try and be someone else that you are not and be true to yourself and your race and get the facts striaght that your white and not black but still enjoys rap music. And how am I desecrating another&#39;s race by accepting that I&#39;am white.

[Xiao Banfa]

Why are we trying to save these racists and get them to understand fundamental progressive politics? FINAL WORD- People are poor/commit crimes because of ECONOMIC CONDITIONS this aplies in EVERY SINGLE case.
Poor Irish in London, poor Italians in NY. How can a HUMAN BEING be more inclined to commit crimes because of SKIN PIGMENTATION

It&#39;s not really very complicated.

CASE FUCKING CLOSED AND SEALED.

[KGB5097]

The ricial double standard IS wrong, but the answer isn&#39;t allowing for a white person to call a black person "Nigger" and for the black man to beable to respond "Cracker".... the answer is for theese people use something besides their race as a weapon.

Its as simple as that.

[Hampton]

Those who rap I care less just don&#39;t try and be someone else that you are not and be true to yourself and your race and get the facts striaght that your white and not black but still enjoys rap music.

Please tell me what being true to your race means. While hip-hop was invented by young black men in New York City it does not mean that the culture is still limited to that. Anyone who still thinks that only black people can make, listen, or enjoy rap music is fooling themselves.

[Dark Exodus]

Originally posted by [email protected]ec 3 2005, 11:52 PM
, and that group of people have risen above to combat those things, have fought and worked for their "equal" rights in this society, then there is nothing wrong about being proud to be black. Black people&#39;s emancipation should be celebrated, because it represents that capitalist constructs (like racism) can indeed be overcome.


Being proud of something totally random that you have no control over is foolish and only serves to divide people in the long run. People can be proud to have taken part in these movement, but being proud of coming from roughly the same area by pure circumstance is utter bullshit.

If people want to be proud of something then they should do something worth being proud of, rather than claiming it out of race, ancestry or country of origin.


You have to look at it in its historical context. If slavery, victimization, exploiatation and oppression are a part of that history (not that I&#39;m saying that it&#39;s over, because it surely is not)

Then why is that they can ignore the negative aspects of their history? Remember that this slavery, victimisation etc. also happened without white people.

- - -

I can see your point of the statement being a celebration of something previously impossible, but it is illogical and appears to make white people feel victimised.

Giving privilages to a certain race when the generation receiving them has done nothing to recieve them will only cause friction with other races.


Oh, and being "proud to be white" is racism, as well.

Why? (Assuming we are entertaining the concept that being proud of your race is justified in the first place).
Remember that, if we must factor the meaningless equation of race into everything then you would not be typing on that computer if it was not for a white man.
If it is possible to proud because you are black (while ignoring the negative history of this race) then surely it is possible to be proud to be white while doing the same?


Double standards will not help equality.

[Simotix]

Originally posted by Xvall+Dec 3 2005, 05:44 AM--> (Xvall &#064; Dec 3 2005, 05:44 AM)I wonder why. See, I always thought that when people called me a "sand nigger" they were trying to be empathetic&#33;

http://forum.idg.it/images/smilies/eusa_wall.gif[/b]
Oh that is classic. :lol:


Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 05:44 AM


You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Cesar Chavez Day.

Because only minorities celebrate that. :rolleyes:

Just would like to add being of some "minority" heritage, I celebrate MLK Day, Death of Che Guevara and Death of Malcom X. Out of respect, and to help further one what they fell short of.


Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 05:44 AM

You have BET.

And the women have "Oxygen"&#33; Sexism&#33; What&#39;s next - Mexican TV stations&#33;? :lol:

:lol:


Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 05:44 AM


But, when a white police officer shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running from the law and posing a threat to society, you call him a racist.

No, we don&#39;t; police officers do this sort of thing all the time and usually are congradulated by the population. If they are accused of brutality, they usually get away with it. We do have a problem, however, when a police officer shoots a man numerous times for pulling out his wallet.

Very well said. The problem with our police offers should got be that they are racist, it is just that they are trigger happy and such criminal profiling to blacks to justify their actions.


Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 11:41 AM
"We" don&#39;t "have" BET. BET is owned by White people. :)
Oh how I would love to see a white supremists reaction to this truth ...


Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 03:12 PM
Well actually...there are around one millions of them in prison and all have a one in three chance, or 33%, of going to prison during their lives, not to mention that:

In twelve states, between 10 and 15 percent of adult black men are incarcerated.

· In ten states, between 5 and 10 percent of black adults are incarcerated.

· In twelve states, black men are incarcerated at rates between twelve and sixteen times greater than those of white men.

· In fifteen states, black women are incarcerated at rates between ten and thirty-five times greater than those of white women.

· In six states, black youth under age eighteen are incarcerated in adult facilities at rates between twelve and twenty-five times greater than those of white youth.
While this is all good information, what is the percent of white adults, ect? Is there much of a difference?


Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 04:19 PM
There is no need to be "proud" to be black, it implies superiority. The exact same applies for those who are "proud" to be white. If people want to have some sort of celebration or whatever for their heritage, then that&#39;s fair enough and I won&#39;t make a fuss, but personally, I won&#39;t celebrate anything which groups people like that, it seems very unneeded
Being proud to be black does serve a purpose when for hundreds of years, and even today, being black was/is made to be a source of shame for black people.

Being proud to be black is being proud to have fought oppression for your rights. Being proud to be black gives power to an otherwise disempowered group of people.
Woould like to add that - What is wrong with being proud of what you are? There is nothing wrong with it. I am proud to be who I am, and will not be mocked for what some of my southerner ancesters have done. Thier actions are not my actions.


Originally posted by Black [email protected] 4 2005, 04:07 AM

And if I was black arab asian or native or whatever I would be proud so I&#39;am proud to be white.

So you&#39;re proud to be &#39;white&#39;? Why?
See above.


Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2005, 02:15 AM

I simply stated that if you are white, black, asian, native, arab you should not try and act a different race take for instance those white rapper wannabe&#39;s who want to be a "Rebel" in a way I hate that because they are pretending something they are not which is black.
People interperate that they are trying to "act black". Those who say that are racists, they are taking actions and are describing that one only one race act that way.

I have no problem with someone who acts as posted in the quote above, this is because they are simpley doing what they choice to do in a non-harmful way. Can&#39;t hurt a person for wanting to looking or act different then the norm. (as long as it is in a non-harmful way).


[email protected] 6 2005, 05:21 AM

Those who rap I care less just don&#39;t try and be someone else that you are not and be true to yourself and your race and get the facts striaght that your white and not black but still enjoys rap music.

Please tell me what being true to your race means. While hip-hop was invented by young black men in New York City it does not mean that the culture is still limited to that. Anyone who still thinks that only black people can make, listen, or enjoy rap music is fooling themselves.
Exactly, just because it has been sterotyped as a music genre just for African Americans. That does not mean that it is justified. Music, or any other kind of arts, sports, ect should not be classified as for those who are white, black or whatever they may be.

Maybe acting like you how would say a "black person" acts is a bad thing to you, however, to me it is a person acting them selves.

[Hampton]

Exactly, just because it has been sterotyped as a music genre just for African Americans. That does not mean that it is justified. Music, or any other kind of arts, sports, ect should not be classified as for those who are white, black or whatever they may be.

Maybe acting like you how would say a "black person" acts is a bad thing to you, however, to me it is a person acting them selves.

Then that person is acting like themselves, irregardless of their race. They may have been shaped by their race abd the way people acted towards them because of the color or their skin, but to say that they are acting black. And the subtle way you imply that I said acting black is bad, which I didn&#39;t, is not appriciated. I can switch the term, African American, Afro American, or whatever else you wish. I am sure I have called myself them many times.

[Simotix]

Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2005, 12:48 AM
And the subtle way you imply that I said acting black is bad, which I didn&#39;t, is not appriciated. I can switch the term, African American, Afro American, or whatever else you wish. I am sure I have called myself them many times.
Actually, I ment that to the person you were quoting. I just found it more sutable to put it on the problems, my apologies comrade.

[RevolutionarySocialist MadRedDog]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 05:44 AM
What a dumbass. This is just a condensation of every piece of Nazi rhetoric circulating the internet. For your amusement; I shall REBUKE.


Before u say i am racist read this...

You&#39;re a racist, and why would you announce this before hand? The only reason anyone would think you&#39;re a racist from the first sentence is if you declared something like "I&#39;m not racist or anything, but..."; which you did. Were your first sentence anything else the thought of racism wouldn&#39;t even have crossed their mind.

Oh yeah, and "u" is not a word. -5 points.


You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.

You&#39;re immediately distancing yourself from the audience by implementing a "Us vs. Them" mentality, which not only makes the audience the target of your hatred, but generalizes that "we" sneer at you and just goes to exemplify what an ignorant little piece of shit you are.


You call me "Cracker", "Honkey", "Whitey" and even "The Man" and you think it&#39;s OK.

Again with the "Us Vs. Them" mentality&#33; Is this e-mail written to appeal to a white audience, or to tell us colored people just how upset you are that every one of us comes up to you can calls you a deregatory slur. (At least that&#39;s what you are insinuating.) And who the fuck would call you "The Man"? You&#39;re too stupid to have any authority and no one has any respect for you. Who the fuck are you anyways?


But when I call you, "Nigger", "Kike", "Towelhead", "Sand Nigger", "Camel Jockey", "Beaner" or "Chink" you call me a racist.

I wonder why. See, I always thought that when people called me a "sand nigger" they were trying to be empathetic&#33;


You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?

Hell if I know. Something about living below the poverty line in an environment that provides little means of escaping said predicament.


You have the United Negro College Fund.
You have the NAACP.

Contrary to popular belief, there are other college funds extending to whites. Through my college life alone I&#39;ve stumbled across advertisements for Polish and Italian Scholarships, along with a number pretaining to certain religions.


You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Cesar Chavez Day.

Because only minorities celebrate that. :rolleyes:


You have Yom Hashoah

Yeah man, what the fuck is wrong with us? Remembering the slaughter of 6,000,000 innocent Jews&#33; HOW RACIST&#33;


You have Ma&#39;uled Al-Nabi

I&#39;ve never heard of this, and I don&#39;t know what the fuck you&#39;re talking about. I bet most of the people reading this don&#39;t know what the last one is either.


You have BET.

And the women have "Oxygen"&#33; Sexism&#33; What&#39;s next - Mexican TV stations&#33;? :lol:


If we had WET(white entertainment television) we&#39;d be racists.

There are "white" television channels. Of course, no one hears about them or watches them because they suck ass and are run by white supremacist organizations. Maybe if you tried appealing to more than .1% of the population you&#39;d be doing a little better.


If we had a White Pride Day you would call us racists.

Because you are a racist, and the only people I know who have suggested this sort of thing are racists too&#33; And they do have Irish, Polish, and other festivals celebrating european nationality - do those not count&#33;?


If we had white history month, we&#39;d be racists.

See above.


If we had an organization for only whites to "advance" our lives, we&#39;d be racists.

See above.


If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships, you know we&#39;d be racists.

See way above.


If we marched for our race and rights, you would call us racists.

That&#39;s because everytime you fucking march you have crowds of skinheads waving swastika banners around. And you fucking are racist&#33; Fucking deal with it&#33;


You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you&#39;re not afraid to announce it.

Who the FUCK is orange&#33;?


But when we announce our white pride, you call us racists.

I wonder if your next statement implies such a thing.


You rob us, carjack us, and shoot at us.

No, silly me. Accusing "us" (Which you never fully exlain) of robbing, carjacking, and shooting at you isn&#39;t generalizing on the basis of race at all.


But, when a white police officer shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running from the law and posing a threat to society, you call him a racist.

No, we don&#39;t; police officers do this sort of thing all the time and usually are congradulated by the population. If they are accused of brutality, they usually get away with it. We do have a problem, however, when a police officer shoots a man numerous times for pulling out his wallet.


I am white.

No shit.


I am proud.

Good for you&#33;


But, you call me a racist.

Because you are&#33;


Why is it that only whites can be racists?

http://forum.idg.it/images/smilies/eusa_wall.gif

Great answer..I would have thought of just shortly stating the facts that white people are in most countries in no way a suppressed minority, but this is just funny and will annoy this f**king pig to death.

Another thing why should anyone be proud for sth he did not even archieve himself? I&#39;m in no way proud to be white, but I&#39;m also not ashamed of it. It&#39;s just a factual situation. Why would I have any opinion about being white or black. It&#39;s not about how you look, but how you act.

I can understand though that being in a discriminated/oppressed position makes you feel proud for being black or sth, because oppressed groups in general start looking for other people with whom they connect.

Therefore the only right answer that socialists can have with regard to racism is that it is used to divide the working class and to distract attention from the class struggle. This is done by letting distinctions between people with different skin colour or religion become the main focus.

[patrickbeverley]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 06:44 AM

You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?

Hell if I know. Something about living below the poverty line in an environment that provides little means of escaping said predicament.
*applause*

So brilliantly put, I&#39;m not even going to add anything.