Anarco-Communist or Leninist?

[Comrade Corinna]

I do have to admit, although I have been a leftist for a few years, the thing with all these "isms" still confuses me. I have a vague idea of what each "ism" might mean, but I wouldnt assume im right because im probably not and I dont want to over-generalize.

Anyway, Im trying to see about which "ism" fits me... I know that most people here are communists, but different types, obviously.
I dont consider myself an anarchist, I do think there should be some type of government. Certainly not a bourgeois one or a dictatorship, but not complete "no rules everyone do what they want" because in my opinion, it would be rather difficult to maintain a socialist economy.
The one thing I am sure of is that I am NOT a Stalinist. While it may be true that Stalin made the Soviet Union into a superpower, his actions were not justified.
I am very against a totalitarian state, I think individual social freedoms are important. I believe in equality, but not sameness.
My results on the "Political Compass" test were:
Economic left/right -10.00 Social libertarian/authoritarian -7.38

I am an advocate of equal distribution of wealth. The classic capitalist response is "But they dont have the incentive to work hard! We would end up like the Soviet Union!" and the response to is "It is against human nature to work for the common good." My answers to that are
- What IS human nature anyway?
and
-To avoid the fate of the Soviet Union is our incentive to work for the common good.

So anyway, yeah, thats what I think, what am I?
(SO sorry if this is the thousandth "What am I?" post... if it is... feel free to slap me in the face... or pretend to :P )

Oh one more thing what is the definition of "anarco-syndicalism?"

[rioters bloc]

Originally posted by Comrade [email protected] 22 2005, 06:56 AM
I dont consider myself an anarchist, I do think there should be some type of government. Certainly not a bourgeois one or a dictatorship, but not complete "no rules everyone do what they want" because in my opinion, it would be rather difficult to maintain a socialist economy.
it does depend on what kind of 'government' you want, to an extent - if you don't want the abolition of the state, then neither anarchism nor communism is for you, as they both call for a classless, stateless society. a communist 'state' is [in marxist-leninist terms] the necessary period between capitalism and communism, where there is a dictatorship of the proletariat...aka as socialism.

anarchism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism) is not about an absence of law or 'rules' - any more so than communism is



Oh one more thing what is the definition of "anarco-syndicalism?"

i'll just quote wiki as it's amazing :P


Anarcho-syndicalism is a branch of anarchism which focuses on the labor movement, hence the "syndicalism" qualification. Anarcho-syndicalists view labor unions as a potential force for revolutionary social change, replacing capitalism and the state with a new society democratically self-managed by workers. Anarcho-syndicalists seek to abolish the wage system and most forms of private property, which leads to class divisions. The basic principles of anarcho-syndicalism are:

1. Workers’ solidarity
2. Direct action
3. Workers' self-management

more here :) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-syndicalism)

[Punk Rocker]

Fuck the "isms"! All the factions in the left have fought each other for two long, it's the reason socialism has failed before. Stalin killed Trotsky, Kruschev betrayed Mao, China fought Vietnam. We need to put aside our differences and unite against the common and eternal enemy.

[KC]

Fuck the "isms"! All the factions in the left have fought each other for two long, it's the reason socialism has failed before.

So you think that the "isms" themselves and not the different ideas that seperate them are what divide the left? The words themselves? Care to explain?

[anomaly]

Judging by your 'beliefs', I'd say you are a Leninist, unfortunately.

But, judging by your poltical compass, I'd say you're more an anarcho-communist.

[Comrade Corinna]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2005, 01:12 AM
Judging by your 'beliefs', I'd say you are a Leninist, unfortunately.

But, judging by your poltical compass, I'd say you're more an anarcho-communist.
whoa way to confuse a girl!
I guess I am just one big massive contradiction! At least Im without a doubt, a commie of some kind!

Why "unfortunately" Leninst?
Lenin was a cool guy

[Led Zeppelin]

My answers to that are
- What IS human nature anyway?
and
-To avoid the fate of the Soviet Union is our incentive to work for the common good.


The human nature "argument" is basically crap, and can be disregarded as such.

As for incentives to work for the common good, well that's the incentive, to work for the common good.

I'd say you're a Leninist, luckily. :)

[Comrade Corinna]

Originally posted by Marxism-[email protected] 23 2005, 12:21 PM

My answers to that are
- What IS human nature anyway?
and
-To avoid the fate of the Soviet Union is our incentive to work for the common good.


The human nature "argument" is basically crap, and can be disregarded as such.

As for incentives to work for the common good, well that's the incentive, to work for the common good.

I'd say you're a Leninist, luckily. :)
The idea of working for the common good makes some people say "yeah right, like that would ever work" and that without the money incentive it would cause stagnation, sameness, and be pretty much like the Soviet Union. Then I say, well there it is. You want to work for the common good, even if you arent the unselfish type to help people, you work hard because you would much rather not live in a place like the former Soviet Union. The USSR would be the picture of "this is what happens when you do NOT work to your ability"

I just got in an arguement with a Stalinist in another thread in another section, and he claims I am not a Leninist, but just stupid and ignorant and bourgeois sympathetic.
I do know that Stalinists are not looked favorably upon at RevLeft, but I am curious as to how seriously I should take them?

EDIT: Just found out that he was accepted into the Commie Club. So it means he must be a fairly informed poster and not really disliked for supporting Stalin, but I still took offense to what he said.

[Wanted Man]

I'm with the "70-30" position on Stalin, which means his contribution was 70% positive and 30% negative. Anyway, it is possible to be a Leninist and have a high "libertarian" score on the Political Compass, because the "Social Lib/Auth" result depends a lot on your opinion on things that aren't bound to communist ideology at all(unsurprisingly, since it's not a test for communists when it comes to social issues) like gay marriage, premarital sex etc. Leninists should support gay rights, the right of sex between consenting individuals, the collapse of the current "moral" and family values just as much as other leftists.

Anyway, I'm not going to turn this into a Stalin topic, but in regard to your inquiry about that, if a person is rude to you about a subject that he thinks you don't know enough about, don't bother arguing with him, he'll just keep being a jerk. More rational forms of defence of Stalin have been heard, and that does not include calling your opponents names. :)


I am an advocate of equal distribution of wealth. The classic capitalist response is "But they dont have the incentive to work hard! We would end up like the Soviet Union!" and the response to is "It is against human nature to work for the common good." My answers to that are
- What IS human nature anyway?
and
-To avoid the fate of the Soviet Union is our incentive to work for the common good.
So how long have you specifically been interested in communism? Just wondering, because you make some very intelligent points here. Good luck to you, I'm sure you'll learn a lot. :)

[Led Zeppelin]

The idea of working for the common good makes some people say "yeah right, like that would ever work" and that without the money incentive it would cause stagnation, sameness, and be pretty much like the Soviet Union. Then I say, well there it is. You want to work for the common good, even if you arent the unselfish type to help people, you work hard because you would much rather not live in a place like the former Soviet Union. The USSR would be the picture of "this is what happens when you do NOT work to your ability"


That's true, most people say that today, that's why we don't live in a Communist society at the moment, Communists are of the opinion that the consciousness of the people (or working class) will rise over time, with the aid of a party, the party being the most advanced section of the working class.

So, basically, what people say today doesn't matter, it is our job to make them change their mind, and I think they will once they realize that what we say is logical and "makes sense".


I just got in an arguement with a Stalinist in another thread in another section, and he claims I am not a Leninist, but just stupid and ignorant and bourgeois sympathetic.
I do know that Stalinists are not looked favorably upon at RevLeft, but I am curious as to how seriously I should take them?

Don't sweat it, he shouldn't have "attacked" you like that, my advice is to ignore it.

Oh, and you are a Leninist. :D

[Wanted Man]

Originally posted by Marxism-[email protected] 23 2005, 03:29 PM
That's true, most people say that today, that's why we don't live in a Communist society at the moment, Communists are of the opinion that the consciousness of the people (or working class) will rise over time, with the aid of a party, the party being the most advanced section of the working class.
Which is perfect evidence that greed is not a part of "human nature". Good post ML. How would that make sense anyway?

We pull back our hand when we burn ourselves, we attack when we're cornered, we run when we realise we'll die if we won't, and we'll steal when we want to get richer.

Which one of those does not make sense? ;)

[SonofRage]

Take this quiz: http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=6916

[Comrade Corinna]

I scored as
You scored as Communism.
Green

100%
Socialist

100%
Communism

100%
Democrat

100%
Anarchism

83%
Fascism

17%
Nazi

0%
Republican

0%



The percentages are BELOW their respective parties, not above like it looks. I am kind of disturbed by the "17% Fascist" results, I guess that comes from my belief in a moderate use of propaganda?

[Comrade Corinna]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2005, 03:04 PM



So how long have you specifically been interested in communism? Just wondering, because you make some very intelligent points here. Good luck to you, I'm sure you'll learn a lot. :)
I have been a communist since I was 16 (I will turn 20 tomorrow on Thanksgiving) I just started thinking more for myself, not what my parents/teachers/friends said. In high school it was more like "dude, I'm a Communist" and i would just believe in the idea and not really do anything about it, now I am actually thinking and writing about how it could really work, and what must be done. I'm becoming more of an activist, and more frusterated than ever.

[Wanted Man]

Well, if we have to throw around political quizzes, this one (http://www.orgburo.com/pofoquiz/pofo.php) is undoubtedly the best one of all. Hope you're not tired of filling in circles yet. ;)

Anyway, glad to hear it, in what country do you live? Got any party which you would support?

[Punk Rocker]

So you think that the "isms" themselves and not the different ideas that seperate them are what divide the left? The words themselves? Care to explain?

Different ideas are good, it's the factions that divide the left.

I like Lenin's idea of Democratic Centralism, "freedom to criticize, but unity in action".

[Gura]

Originally posted by Comrade [email protected] 23 2005, 05:06 PM
I am kind of disturbed by the "17% Fascist" results, I guess that comes from my belief in a moderate use of propaganda?
Those sorts of questions (on thet, not yours) annoy me. "Propaganda" does not necessarily mean totalitarian-style propaganda. Posters are propaganda, they are not inherently "fascist".

[RedKnight]

Corinna seems like a democratic socialist to me. As for me I took one test and it said that I'm an anarchist, and the other said that I'm a borderline social liberal. I feel however that I'm a libertarian socialist. I oppose both big government as well as big buisness. Plus I support the free market, yet oppose capitalism.

[viva le revolution]

Communism

100%
Socialist

100%
Democrat

100%
Anarchism

83%
Fascism

58%
Green

25%
Republican

17%
Nazi

0%
.................................................. .................................................. ...................



Fascism????? WTF????

[Comrade Corinna]

Originally posted by viva le [email protected] 24 2005, 04:52 AM
Communism

100%
Socialist

100%
Democrat

100%
Anarchism

83%
Fascism

58%
Green

25%
Republican

17%
Nazi

0%
.................................................. .................................................. ...................



Fascism????? WTF????
That's really weird. How can one be 83% Anarchist and 58% Fascist? I also got a small percentage as "Fascist," I think that may come from questions about propaganda, totalitarianism, size of government, etc


For the person who posted the link to the longer test, I got Communism, and it had me as some kind of a moderate Marxist.

[Comrade Corinna]

Originally posted by [email protected] 24 2005, 04:35 AM
Corinna seems like a democratic socialist to me. As for me I took one test and it said that I'm an anarchist, and the other said that I'm a borderline social liberal. I feel however that I'm a libertarian socialist. I oppose both big government as well as big buisness. Plus I support the free market, yet oppose capitalism.
I have taken many tests, all of them have said communist or socialist. One of them compared to politicians of history and of today, and i was somewhere between Hillary Clinton and Lenin.

[RedJacobin]

i'm not sure it's such a good idea to base your politics on internet quizzes (or quizzes in general).

who knows what sorts of biases are designed into the test? ex: the "world's smallest political quiz" is so obviously skewed to promote libertarian politics.

the "political compass" site that seems really popular has a lot of problems too. for one, surveys should have a 5-point answer scale so people aren't forced into agreeing or disagreeing with a statement on which they don't have an opinion or need more elaboration.

quizzes are fun and all, but their results shouldn't be taken too seriously!

edit: one more thing -- i think the need people have to slap a label on themselves is more reflective of capitalist consumer-identity politics ("it's all about me and my identity and self-expression") than anything even vaguely resembling marxism. i know that i've been guilty of it many times. study, investigation, and reflection -- instead of the quickness to drop a label.

[Lord Testicles]

Originally posted by [email protected] 24 2005, 07:23 AM
i'm not sure it's such a good idea to base your politics on internet quizzes (or quizzes in general).
I agree it is totally idiotic to base your ideas on a quiz, but its a bit of fun.
heres how i scored


You scored as Communism.


Socialist
100%

Anarchism
100%

Communism
100%

Democrat
100%

Green
83%

Republican
33%

Nazi
0%

Fascism
0%



Remember kids just cos the quiz says so doesnt make it true!

EDIT : Spelling.

[Amusing Scrotum]

I scored -

Socialist - 100%

Communism - 100%

Democrat - 83%

Anarchism - 83%

Green - 58%

Fascism - 42% :o

Nazi - 0%

Republican - 0%

The strange thing is I didn't even rate propaganda that highly. Perhaps it's how you answer on the "gun control" question. I clicked the middle circle.

[Punk Rocker]

You wonder why it's saying everyone is a fascist? Your revolutionary beliefs are in you heart, you can't just graph them out with some computer test.


Corinna seems like a democratic socialist to me. As for me I took one test and it said that I'm an anarchist, and the other said that I'm a borderline social liberal. I feel however that I'm a libertarian socialist. I oppose both big government as well as big buisness. Plus I support the free market, yet oppose capitalism.

Dude, that makes no sense. The free market is capitalism. Big business is free market. How are you a socialist?

[ComradeOm]

Originally posted by Armchair [email protected] 24 2005, 07:30 PM
Fascism - 42% :o
So now I've got you down as Marxist, anarchist, Maoist and fascist? I give up :lol:

[Amusing Scrotum]

So now I've got you down as Marxist, anarchist, Maoist and fascist? I give up :lol:

It makes debates more fun though. :)

I wonder what I'd be called, maybe a MarMaoAnFas. :wacko: :lol: