Do you support the 9/11 Attacks?

[SunnyInSoCal]

Do you advocate such acts?

[KC]

No.

[bcbm]

No. If they hadn't used civillian airliners, the Pentagon one probably could've been justified though.

[KC]

If they hadn't used civillian airliners

Or if they didn't run them into buildings packed with civilians.

[drain.you]

Sabotage, yes. Terrorism, no.
9/11 was an act of terror.

I wouldn't have been remotely bothered if there had been no civilian casualities but there was, and not just a few, there was alot of them.

[bcbm]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 02:06 AM

If they hadn't used civillian airliners

Or if they didn't run them into buildings packed with civilians.
Um.. did you bother to read the qualification on that statement? :rolleyes:

[drain.you]

Um.. did you bother to read the qualification on that statement? :rolleyes:
lol. Quality.

[Tekun]

I don't support acts of terror against civilians
But, in the words of X, this was just a case of the chickens coming home to roost
It was unfortunate, yes, but it was inevitable

Read this:
http://www.kersplebedeb.com/mystuff/s11/churchill.html

[TupacAndChe4Eva]

I support the principle, i.e. attacking the United States, and specifically the centre of its financial area, the World Trade towers.

No-one can justify the loss of life, so it would be futile for me to even attempt to. However, desperate times create desperate situations, and these lead to extreme actions.

I agree with the " Chickens coming home to roost" analogy.

Shit on the poor, and they will rise and bite you in the ass.

[Tekun]

^Feelin u bro

Im a fan of Pac and Che also

[Orthodox Marxist]

I support the principle, i.e. attacking the United States

As do I but only against military targets

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

I do not and will never support terrorist actions against civilians, whether committed by governments or groups like Al-Qaida

[Luís Henrique]

Next what? If we support Kristalnacht?

Luís Henrique

[Amusing Scrotum]

Shit on the poor, and they will rise and bite you in the ass.

From what I know, most of the attackers were bourgeois reactionaries, hardly poor workers'. Though I could be wrong.

9/11 was merely a new order trying to impose itself on the old order, not a great act of revenge on the behalf of the worlds poor or have I completely misunderstood the principles of Political Islam? ....because last time I looked they weren't saying much about the poor or the workers' and we all know they absolutely hate Communism.

[SunnyInSoCal]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 10:49 AM
I support the principle, i.e. attacking the United States, and specifically the centre of its financial area, the World Trade towers.

No-one can justify the loss of life, so it would be futile for me to even attempt to. However, desperate times create desperate situations, and these lead to extreme actions.

I agree with the " Chickens coming home to roost" analogy.

Shit on the poor, and they will rise and bite you in the ass.
It was said that the 9/11 attacks were caused by "shitting on the poor." But can the poor of America really be considered to be all Middle-Eastern Islamic young men who see America as the infidel against Islam? I think to say that the poor were rising up against the rich is nice propoganda, but it really doesn't have any basis.

[Hiero]

The attacks made not progress to the working class movement.

Any attack on American soil does not stop the imperialist ventures of the US.

Also the attack on civilians does not help anything. They were just pointless.

[Tekun]

Originally posted by Armchair [email protected] 4 2005, 01:37 PM

Shit on the poor, and they will rise and bite you in the ass.

From what I know, most of the attackers were bourgeois reactionaries, hardly poor workers'. Though I could be wrong.

9/11 was merely a new order trying to impose itself on the old order, not a great act of revenge on the behalf of the worlds poor or have I completely misunderstood the principles of Political Islam? ....because last time I looked they weren't saying much about the poor or the workers' and we all know they absolutely hate Communism.
Thats true, they basically did it out of religious fervor
They had nothing to do with uplifting the poor an the workers
Like the brother said, they hate socialism

[Ownthink]

The attacks were not because they were thought of as infidels.


It was because they were thought of as infidels and they were America.

The fact that America has the imperialist history it does is the reason that people hate it.

Remember, it is never Religion ALONE as a reason. It is always fighting back at the murdering Imperialists while at the same time caliming Religious justification. If America was not murdering Imperialists who treated the worlds poor like shit, would 9/11 have happened? No.

But as for the attacks on Spain, I really don't know. But England is definitely Imperialist.


Not saying I support these atrocious acts against Civilians, because that is just wrong. I'm just saying that it wasn't because "theywere religious crazies who only attacked America because they were infidels". Religion was just used as a reason to justify these attacks.


If it was using explosives against the Pentagon, and it was not targeted at civilians, but still used the "we did it because Allah told us to" front, I'd still support it.

[drain.you]

Remember, it is never Religion ALONE as a reason. It is always justified by Religion
I like that quote, seems well said.

[The Grey Blur]

:lol: It was all planned and executed by the American Government in conjunction with the oil barons of course - it gave them an excuse to start wars and occupy oil-rich countries such as Afghanistan & Iraq. Every leftist should know that.

[Ownthink]

Originally posted by Rage Against The [email protected] 4 2005, 04:24 PM
:lol: It was all planned and executed by the American Government in conjunction with the oil barons of course - it gave them an excuse to start wars and occupy oil-rich countries such as Afghanistan & Iraq. Every leftist should know that.
I have reviewed all there is to review and it seems extremely suspicious.

[ack]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 07:36 AM
Do you advocate such acts?
Terrorism is never reasonable.
What good will attacking the civilians of a country do?
Especially when you don't know how many of them support the country's actions.
Would you attack a Democrat for a Fascist's actions?
If you would, you're smoking something serious.

[ack]

Originally posted by Red Marxist [email protected] 4 2005, 01:29 PM

I support the principle, i.e. attacking the United States

As do I but only against military targets
Excuse me for disagreeing, but I don't. It wouldn't exactly be fun if the country where I live was attacked.

[ack]

Originally posted by Red Marxist [email protected] 4 2005, 01:29 PM

I support the principle, i.e. attacking the United States

As do I but only against military targets
Excuse me for disagreeing, but I don't. It wouldn't exactly be fun if the country where I live was attacked.

[bolshevik butcher]

I fail to see justification for an attack on american working people. It also gave the U$ state levereage to fruther restrict civil liberties and intervine in other countries affairs.

[Bannockburn]

The world trade center was full of workers. Horrible. If however, the pentagon and the white house, or capital building were hit with planes with no civilians, then I would have support it fully.

[The Grey Blur]

For God's sake, how many times to you have to be told people!?!??!!? - BUSH KNOCKED DOWN THE TOWERS!!!!!

[refuse_resist]

I believe Ward Churchill said it best... the chickens came home to roost.

[rioters bloc]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 09:42 PM
But, in the words of X, this was just a case of the chickens coming home to roost

I believe Ward Churchill said it best... the chickens came home to roost.

so who was it? :lol:

what do people think about the twin towers as phallic symbols? i had to facillitate a discussion at uni about the impact of september 11 on australia's mass consciousness and had to refer to this article about phallic symbols. argh. horrendous.

[Guerrilla22]

The Pentagon was a legitmimate military target and they got what they deserved. However, I dodn't support attacks made in the name of religious extremism. Howver the people in those towers were largely just a bunch of capitalist and technocrats. Ward Churchill did say that in his book, the Politics of Chickens Roosting. I had him as a proffesor at the University of Colorado, he's a great guy.

[MeTaLhEaD]

inside job

[Qwerty Dvorak]

well conspiracy theories aside, i dont think any good came from it.

but if it WASNT an inside job, then i will say they had it coming.

[Atlas Swallowed]

Inside job. The Bush adminstrations fake terrorism to get thier oil wars.

A man in a cave on dialises orchestrated an attack with five airliners and not one properly trained pilot. The steel in the world trade center melts at lower tempature than any steel in the world. The US airdefense was nonexistent magically on that day. The official story is a fairy tale. Got to fight Osama bin Goldstein and the Al CIAeda network. It all bullshit.

[Un-Amäraкin Bastard]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 10:46 PM
The world trade center was full of workers. Horrible. If however, the pentagon and the white house, or capital building were hit with planes with no civilians, then I would have support it fully.
I cannot support the attacks on the Twin Towers with planes full of people. I however would have fully thought it perfectly fine if they just hit the other targets with planes not loaded with passengers. It was inevitable, any way you put it, as long as America held true to it's foreign diplomacy...

[bcbm]

Osama bin Goldstein

Whoa, wait a minute, what?

[red_che]

Only fascist-imperialists and terrorists do such acts as the 9/11 attacks. Revolutionaries will never do anything like that.

[TupacAndChe4Eva]

Aren't the US justified targets?

I'm sorry, but their imperialist policies towards the Middle East and Latin America means they are open to attack. Religion is used to justify the attacks, as a lot of narrow-minded people see America as "free". They refuse to see that it is the USA's fault they were attacked, so they blame it on religion.

They support the false Zionist state of Israel. They mercilessly bomb Iraqi villages, massacring many Civilans, hoping to root out one " Terrorist".

Would you call Nelson Mandela a terrorist? If you would, get off the site.

[kingbee]

of course not.

i do seem to remember that when it happened, myrmiad of che was banned for supporting it by malte.

[Atlas Swallowed]

Originally posted by black banner black [email protected] 5 2005, 04:13 AM

Osama bin Goldstein

Whoa, wait a minute, what?
It is a joke. Emmanuel Goldstein is the governments bad guy in George Orwells 1984. He does not actually exist in the book, he is used by the government to scare the populance into believing they need the government to protect them, when it is infact the government that is perpatrating the attacks.

[*Exodus]

No you can't justify killing civillians

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by [email protected] 5 2005, 02:02 AM
well conspiracy theories aside
It isn't some crackpot conspiracy theory; it's hard facts.


i dont think any good came from it.
Of course no good came from it; it simply gave the capitalists an excuse to go to war and fund their death-industries.

[andrew_the_fox]

Originally posted by Ownthink+Nov 4 2005, 04:44 PM--> (Ownthink @ Nov 4 2005, 04:44 PM)
Rage Against The [email protected] 4 2005, 04:24 PM
:lol: It was all planned and executed by the American Government in conjunction with the oil barons of course - it gave them an excuse to start wars and occupy oil-rich countries such as Afghanistan & Iraq. Every leftist should know that.
I have reviewed all there is to review and it seems extremely suspicious.[/b]
that idea shouldn't be dismissed comrades. tell me it doesn't make sense. There is so many disputable events and people stepping on their own foot about their accounts of what happened. There is a ton of research to support that it was all a sham.

For example do you remember when a plane hit the pentagon?


http://www.apfn.org/apfn/dea-77.jpg

nah.. me either

[Yazman]

I believe that something along the lines of the 11/9/2001 attacks on the USA were simply inevitable, given their foreign policy and their lengthy history of crimes against humanity. With that said, it is a shame that so many innocents died in the World Trade Centre, although I do not condemn the attack on the Pentagon.

Regarding the theory that it was all planned by the US government, there are a lot of things that some could say point to this being true, and a lot of issues and situations that do seem frighteningly suspicious, but I am not willing to accept such theories until there is concrete evidence of their truth.

[The Grey Blur]

Originally posted by [email protected] 5 2005, 03:57 PM
I believe that something along the lines of the 11/9/2001 attacks on the USA were simply inevitable, given their foreign policy and their lengthy history of crimes against humanity. With that said, it is a shame that so many innocents died in the World Trade Centre, although I do not condemn the attack on the Pentagon.

Regarding the theory that it was all planned by the US government, there are a lot of things that some could say point to this being true, and a lot of issues and situations that do seem frighteningly suspicious
What is this crap!? You're falling into their trap -
There is evidence enough to indicate beyond reasonable doubt that the American Government planned and coordinated the 9/11 attacks; you admit yourself it seems "frighteningly suspicious", why don't you trust your judgement? -I believe it is because the American system you live in has manipulated and twisted everyones thoughts and feelings so much that you can't see even the truth under your noses.


I am not willing to accept such theories until there is concrete evidence of their truth.
First off there is pretty damning evidence; enough to convict in any court in the world, secondly, if you are "not willing to accept such theories" you are a brainwashed fool; American society can't handle the truth, it would result in the overthrow of the Bush administration (if not the capitalist system itself), thus you must put faith in the research and evidence that suggest the 9/11 attacks were an Imperialist propaganda coup; it's the left thing to do.

[enigma2517]

We had a discussion about 9/11 conspirarcies on this board before. Even though I am one of the people that certainetly believe there is a lot of very conflicting evidence, others helped me come to the conclusion that it isn't useful to our leftist movement at all.

http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/index.php?showtopic=41869

Take special note of what Gravedigger says.

As for the justification of 9/11? Read "You Can't Blow Up a Social Relationship"

http://libcom.org/library/YouCantBlowUpASocialRelationship

[Yazman]

I am not American, I am Australian. I wouldn't be surprised for one second if my judgment was correct.

I never said I was not willing to accept such theories, I said that I would like more concrete evidence as opposed to circumstantial evidence. Listen, comrade; I do not believe that Osama bin Goldstein was responsible, nor do I believe that the boogeyman "al qaeda" exists - they have yet to provide evidence that it does exist.

At the moment I am not leaning either way - calling a person such as ME a brainwashed fool is ridiculous - I pay very little attention to mainstream media, and when I do pay attention to it, I take it with a grain of salt. I would be very careful throwing around such terms as "brainwashed" in here.

I do believe the Iraq/Afghanistan invasions were planned for a long time beforehand, although they did not necessarily need the 11/9 attack in order to invade. They would have done so anyway, WTC/Pentagon attacks or not.

[PRC-UTE]

Originally posted by Atlas [email protected] 5 2005, 03:20 AM
The steel in the world trade center melts at lower tempature than any steel in the world.
I read somewhere that it didn't have to melt. It just had to get hot enough to buckle and bend under the extreme weight.

There could be a conspiracy involving the US government in all this, though I wouldn't give them that much credit. I imagine the simplest explanation is true.

[Bannockburn]

Its hard to say. I'm sure something will come out showing American involvement. It depends what you mean though. Did they know about it? Sure. Did they prevent it? No. Did they want to prevent, no. Did they collaborated with OBL, doubtful. Did they take the opputunity to use it towards their advantage, absolutely.

[Yazman]

I think Bannockburn has essentially captured it.

[Severian]

Some good information examining the 9/11 conspiracy theories - and explaining what's wrong with a worldview based on conspiracy theories. (http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/conspiracism-911.html)

[kingbee]

What is this crap!? You're falling into their trap -
There is evidence enough to indicate beyond reasonable doubt that the American Government planned and coordinated the 9/11 attacks; you admit yourself it seems "frighteningly suspicious", why don't you trust your judgement?

hm. now i know the power of the media, and do take it with a pinch of salt, but i think this is a bit ridiculous. "beyond reasonable doubt"?! if this was true, then i'm sure even those 'brainwashed by the capitalist media' would realise it.





First off there is pretty damning evidence; enough to convict in any court in the world,


ANY court? then surely they would have been convicted....



secondly, if you are "not willing to accept such theories" you are a brainwashed fool; American society can't handle the truth, it would result in the overthrow of the Bush administration (if not the capitalist system itself), thus you must put faith in the research and evidence that suggest the 9/11 attacks were an Imperialist propaganda coup; it's the left thing to do.

im starting to feel a bit silly- are you being ironic?

"the left thing to do"?!

[La_Dominicana_Rebelde]

[font=Arial]<span style=&#39;font-family:Impact&#39;>I dont believe in any form of violence.....I think that although the reasons for the attcks are valid the loss of life is still not justified.....I know of ppl who died there and I live in NYC and trust me I was scared half to death..and thinking about it still brings tears to my eyes...WE -the poor- have to realize that we need reform the world but there are other way in doing so..we need to realize that we dont have to stoop to such barbaric measures....Que Viva La Revolution Pacifista....by the way comrads PEACE and Change can happen simultaneouly.....</span>

[bolshevik butcher]

Originally posted by Atlas Swallowed+Nov 5 2005, 01:26 PM--> (Atlas Swallowed @ Nov 5 2005, 01:26 PM)
black banner black [email protected] 5 2005, 04:13 AM

Osama bin Goldstein

Whoa, wait a minute, what?
It is a joke. Emmanuel Goldstein is the governments bad guy in George Orwells 1984. He does not actually exist in the book, he is used by the government to scare the populance into believing they need the government to protect them, when it is infact the government that is perpatrating the attacks. [/b]
He was losley based on trotsky, in that he was a leader of the revolution, and the party blaimed everything on his teachings and followers.

[Luís Henrique]

Originally posted by Rage Against The [email protected] 5 2005, 04:11 PM




if you are "not willing to accept such theories" you are a brainwashed fool;

So Marxists are brainwashed fools; only people who belive in paranoid semi-fascist idiocy are braindirty smarties.

If they do have all that power, obviously they have planted you here to state that they do, so that we believe they don&#39;t. Otherwise, why haven&#39;t they suppressed you yet? :blink:

Luís Henrique

[Atlas Swallowed]

When a crime is committed it is investigated and the evidence is examined. Cheney right off the bat blocked any investagation. The remains of the trade center were removed and the steel sold before any engineers or scientists could examine it. The 9-11 commission only investigated intelligence failures and was basically a whitewash, besides they did not start investigating until a year and half after the fact. The media repeats the official story as it were fact, when it was never proved. The official story has more holes in it than a five pound block of swiss cheese.

When I heard Bush say shortly after 9-11 say to disregard all conspiracy theories. That was enough to get me curious. When a man who is a proven and repetitive liar gives you advice the opposite is usually the case.

[Guerrilla22]

some of the people in the towers were legtimate members of the proletariat, others were technocrats bent on cashing in no matter what the ramifications.

[Sankara1983]

Do I support the 9/11 Attacks? No.

Do I advocate such acts? No.