Good By Seperation of Church and State

[RedCeltic]

George W. Bush is single handedly dismanteling the dreem of the founding fathers. A man who was elected by the courts not the people and has made the Bill of Rights a useless doccument with the 200+ page doccument "Patriot act"... voted on and passed in one day...

....now has plans to break down the protective barrier known as "Seperation of Church and State" a revolutionary idea of it's time when the founding fathers erected the nation, now will go by the wayside because as George W. Bush and the rest of the Bible thumping hypocritical gang of thugs see it.... seperation of church and state is discrimination against religious groups.

If George W. Bush's plan goes through, Churches that have civic programs will recieve funding from the government to build churches and civic centers and to fund their social programs.

Social programs should be non denominational. Many homeless shelters run by Christian organisations actually discorage the homeless from reentering society and finding jobs. They would rather they stay in the shelters and recieve religious insruction. Many like several here in Albany New York, do not allow people to bring any reading material in except the Holy Bible.

[Disgustipated]

We're fucked.
The guy is putting ultra conservative federal judges in all the courts in the land, trying to overturn affirmative action ( very close to succeeding), overturn Roe v. Wade (very close to overturning), set up an office for the religious lobby, which in my opinion is basically giving them a blank check. Soon kids will have to pray in shcool and be forced to say the Pledge of Allegiance. Gave us the Patriot Act which essentially turns the US into a police state, Created the Total Information bullshit so that they can watch bank accounts, email etc. without your knowledge, and most recently, signed into existence, the new Global Communications department (read..Propaganda Ministry) to help convince scepticle countries that the US is doing the right things globally etc. etc.. It's like the shit they did in South America with the propaganda "freedom radio". This is GW's way of paying back all the ultra right for his campaign. This shit keeps slipping through Congress without so much as a wimper from the fucking Democrats.

So as a wrap up, lets list shall we?

Separation of church and state.....Gone
Civil Liberties.................................Gone
Abortion Rights..............................Gone
Privacy Rights................................Gone
Free and Democratic elections.......Gone

I don't know about anyone else, but this shit freaks me out. I think I'm gonna start looking for a new place to live.

[Pepe Cy]

I wonder why you still call America the country of Freedom

[Disgustipated]

I wonder too!

[RedCeltic]

People who support George W. Bush and his agenda are anything but "Patrots" ...While they use words like, Patrot, Freedom and Liberty, they support no such thing.

Meanwhile George W. Bush is practicing politics of massd distraction, I imagine he views thousands of people out protesting his proposed war with Iraq a good thing....

... because while they focus on his murderous forgien policy, they are ignoring his even more dangerous domectic one.

Just how much damage can a far right wing government do if four years?

Besides compleately dismanteling the only positive things about the United States.... and principles it was founded on in the first place.

I wonder if the Church of Satan had a youth outreach program... would they recieve government funding as well????

[truthaddict11]

yeah the real threat is that the relegious right turns out to EVERY election from president to school board.
goodbye R v W
goodbye freedom of and from relgion
goodbye constituition
oh yeah the head of homeland security is a very anti-gay relegious fundalmentalist. he calls gay people "a disease" he is also the man who fought to execute Mumia Abu Jamal

[Umoja]

And religious people really need to look, and realize that the Churches aren't being funded by their members, and as such are drifting away from their purpose anyway. It's not a crime, or even offense to religious people to see state run daycares, along side church run day-cares. No need to mix the two.

[redstar2000]

I think this has been building for a long time...and we just happen to be unlucky enough to live to see the ugly structure in full outline.

50 years or so ago, there was no "In God We Trust" on the currency, no "under God" in the pledge of allegiance, no teaching of "creation science" in the public schools, etc.

It's all been slowly put in place, piece by piece. Now we see the outlines of what they (the ruling capitalist class) had in mind all along. The volitile mixture of religion and patriotism is a perfect fuel for the vehicle of imperialist war abroad and fascism at home.

Disgustipated, if you have the resources and opportunity to permanently escape "living" in the United States, do so as quickly as you can...while it is still possible to get out.

I'm serious! This is going to be a horrible place to live in the coming decades...leave while you still can!

:angry:

[El Brujo]

Yup. I knew he was a christian fundamentalist. If there is one group of people that sickens me in this world, its the fundies. I cant think of a single more idiotic, hypocritical and romantic movement.

[truthaddict11]

arent the fundalmentalists trying to get the 10 commandments in schools and courts?

[RedCeltic]

Quote: from truthaddict11 on 5:07 am on Jan. 24, 2003
arent the fundalmentalists trying to get the 10 commandments in schools and courts?

Trying to get them back.... they once had them in every classroom and courtroom in the United States, as well as a general prayer before the school day.

During the Regan administration he tried to get around the no prayer in school by having a "Moment of silence", but that's mostly gone by the wayside.

As far as Creation Science, I don't think that's something that's required by the federal government but some conservitive state governments. As I don't recall hearing of it being in the New York Public school system... I suppose New York Students are too busy taking real subjects.

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

One of the best things ever happend in human history(church and state separation) is now gone.

It looks like the US is going in some form of modern Mid eveal and dragging the rest of the world with it, the poor people hoping for a better future, follows the US as flys flying towards light.

Look at the things, a small sumarization:
[list]Church and state back again
State is right and no one else, then you're declared non patriotic
The state is getting great influence back throug social control
They influence the people throug church for their interrests

[list] Just to name a few things that came to mind

[El Brujo]

This is disgusting. Its a blatant abuse of "freedom of religion" when they claim they support it. I would much rather have religion banned than this shit.

[Disgustipated]

Red Star, I'm luckier than most. My wife and I live on our sailboat so in essence it's easier for us to move out than most. We have been seriously talking about leaving since GW took power. Now, it's just a matter of deciding where to go.

[Umoja]

....They Speak English in Canada....

But seriously though, it's pretty silly to even associate Church and State because Bushy boy is gonna make it harder for even certain Christians to live. I don't wanna see Quakers getting lyched again, then I'd really be dead. Black, Quaker, Leftist! I'd have it in for me.

[RedCeltic]

Quote: from Umoja on 8:36 pm on Jan. 24, 2003
....They Speak English in Canada....

But seriously though, it's pretty silly to even associate Church and State because Bushy boy is gonna make it harder for even certain Christians to live. I don't wanna see Quakers getting lyched again, then I'd really be dead. Black, Quaker, Leftist! I'd have it in for me.

You have to look to English History understand what seperation of Church and State is and what we will go back to. It's not even saying that "All" Christianity will be supported by the state, because those who fled England to settle in the New World for "Religious Freedom" where Christians.

King Henery the VIII on his disagreement with the Catholic Church outlawed the Catholic religion in England, took away their lands and established the Church of England.

As soon as the reformantion hit England there was no stopping it and soon you had Puritans, Quakers, etc...

Everyone thinking they are the "true" church...

So if Bushy made The born again church or, Fundie church or whatever the fuck it's called.. "State religion" that's going back to what they "Seperation of CHurch and state" was against in the first place... (The church of England)

[Fires of History]

Well, if any of you need a place to stay in Canada, PM me.

And, yes, this is fucked. Are they going to give money to the Nation of Islam? Wiccan fellowships? Etc? We'll see, but I doubt it. They'll find loopholes.

And people are always asking me why I care about what religious people believe. This is why. Fundies religious agenda IS a political agenda. People like to laugh at people like Robertson and Falwell. Ha ha, they say, they're idiots. But people don't get that these people are leaders, and only represent millions and millions of like-minded fools.

Not so funny anymore eh?

I had some intimate exposure to the Southern Baptist Convention, and Comrades, it's fucking scary. The pulpit in the South is nothing but a political bullhorn. It's a Christian nation after all, and they're simply trying to reinstate that after decades of secular liberals and communists slowly taking over their blessed country.

Anyway, I agree RedCeltic. This is so wrong there's hardly words for it.

And if Shrub is able to appoint a couple Supreme Court justices, it's all over. All over.

Like I said, I've got cots and tents.