Religion is evil

[CommieTommy]

I am a intense German ideology freak, I read everything from Hegel to Marx. It is most obvious that the "class struggle" and the prolateriats roots come straight from the birth of religon. At the beginning of time, cavemen saw natural occurances ( lightning, disasters, etc. ) and they thought they came from some weird superior being. They constructed Gods and the witch doctors and preist became the upper class as they forced people to construct temples in places such as MEsoptamia, in Indus Valley, and in Asia Minor. These preist became the ruling class, and soon holy families would be created and would receive the divine right to rule. IF there was any revolt, they would be betraying God. Soon Rulers began calling themselfs Gods, ( ex. Alexander the great claimed he was son of Zeus ) With this religous power that began at the beginning of time, large temples, and keeps were built and the peasant was put down. There was the slaves of the ancient ages, Plebians of the roman classical age, Serfs of the middle ages, and finally we see the prolateriat of the industrial revolution. To support any religon as a Marxist is agaisnt your belief, its not even marxism, its religous fundamentalism.

[Rockfan]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29 2005, 01:47 PM
Hegel to Marx
Wow there extreamly different. But apart form that I have nothing else to say about your post, you've left no real space for question.

[Xvall]

"Evil" is a concept stemmed from religion.

This is like saying that "Swear words and fucking bullshit."

[LSD]

Religion isn't "evil", it's just useless, destructive, and exploitative.

...like capitalism.

[Wasted7]

To support any religon as a Marxist is agaisnt your belief

Religion isn't a bad thing in itself, its people who distort religion to serve their own means and try to impose their religion upon other people.

[KC]

Religion isn't a bad thing in itself

And why don't you think it's bad?

[ComradeOm]

Religion is a symptom of class struggle rather than its root. As you said yourself the divine right to rule has been used to excuse atrocities committed by the ruling class for thousands of years. The atrocities were not committed because of religion but the underlying need to repress the population, something that religion has proven to be very, very good at doing.

[enigma2517]

Religion isn't a bad thing in itself, its people who distort religion to serve their own means and try to impose their religion upon other people.

An ultra religious girl that I was talking to once said that. I asked her how she could account for the terrible things that religion has done and she said that yes, it is unfortunate that people take God's message and twist it around to serve evil and blah blah blah.

I just laughed and left it at that. But for future reference, how would you respond?

[KC]

I just laughed and left it at that. But for future reference, how would you respond?

I'd probably kick her in the throat.

Seriously, though, I probably wouldn't even be talking to her. And if I got in the situation where we were having that conversation I'd probably either try to convince her how stupid religion is, or just walk away (probably the latter, if she's a religious freak as you say she is).

[Black Dagger]

But for future reference, how would you respond?

She was christian yeah? The bible is big, internally contradictory and without a doubt- reactionary in totality. There is enough 'juicy' bits of scripture and 'words of god' in there that speak directly to and justify the crimes of its adherents. There are biblical justifications for all crimes committed in 'it's' name. That is hardly 'twisting' the 'word of god'- it came straight from 'his' mouth! And when it hasn't come directly for 'god' it's from one of his followers, his prophets, his 'representatives' or from his 'son' (which means technically 'god' said it).

[idealisticcommie]

It never ceases to amaze me how materialists become just as "religious" about their materialism as the religionists. No shame, or blame; just an observation. :)

[shanks]

She was christian yeah? The bible is big, internally contradictory and without a doubt- reactionary in totality. There is enough 'juicy' bits of scripture and 'words of god' in there that speak directly to and justify the crimes of its adherents. There are biblical justifications for all crimes committed in 'it's' name. That is hardly 'twisting' the 'word of god'- it came straight from 'his' mouth! And when it hasn't come directly for 'god' it's from one of his followers, his prophets, his 'representatives' or from his 'son' (which means technically 'god' said it).

you mean like the communist manifesto and its related works?


christianity:
When in doubt, call them a heratic and burn their ass!

communism:
When in doubt, call them borgousie and exocute their ass!

[Black Dagger]

It never ceases to amaze me how materialists become just as "religious" about their materialism as the religionists. No shame, or blame; just an observation.

Can you please explain how materialism is superstitious, irrational and/or illogical?

[red team]

Can you please explain how materialism is superstitious, irrational and/or illogical?

Incidentally, thats how despotic "Communist" or as I would like to call them revisionist states turn Marxism into a state religion. They "educate" people into assuming the preliminary premises of Marxism without going further into details and proving these premises, so you have some people in the leadership positions babbling out some Marxist platitudes and tracts totally out of context to justify practally anything they want.

Furthermore, simply saying that once material conditions are reached there will no longer by class struggle and we'll all be living in a classless utopia of freely associating human beings is really an assumption thats unlikely to turn out to be true given the present technical progress of humanity.

Its one thing to be materially rich, but its quite another to say that once you have lots of material things there will no longer be any conflict in human society. First of all lets just assume that society is materially abundant. So what? There would still be workers needed to make it materially abundant. There will still be people working and dying in dangerous working conditions. There would still be people working in alienating, repetitive, unfulfilling, mind-numbing work. There will still be people who wish they were doing something else, but under circumstances beyond their control will be stuck working in these unfulfilling jobs for much of their lives. And unless all the material things we have are magically made of materials that don't break or wear out these conditions for the workers, assuming our current technical level, will carry on indefinately. Because of this problem some people will inevitably have easier jobs than most of those doing the manual work and hence class conflict will still exists.

What we should be aiming for is not optimal material conditions because abundance in material isn't enough. What is also needed is abundance in material with minimal manual effort and that involves a higher technical level in automated production than we currently have.


Red Team