Iran leader joins in protests

[Phalanx]

Protests (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4384264.stm)

Normally I wouldn't care so much, but as Iran is developing nuclear power, I'm starting to doubt that their intentions are purely civilian. Calling for one nation's complete destruction while developing nuclear power is extremely suspicious. The man obviously is just a bloodthirsty, corrupt leader. This has created me to strongly oppose their want of nuclear power.

[Free Palestine]

Apparently France summoned the Iranian ambassador over this remark about the destruction of Israel. I wonder if they'll summon an Israeli ambassador over the actual destruction of Palestine by Israel?

[bolshevik butcher]

This is a crazy and sutpid statemnet to make. Israel also has nuclear weapons though, so it's probably just retoric.

[Master Che]

What about the destruction of Palestine? Isreal has nuclear weapons why dont these hypocritcal motherfuckers bother them?

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

Because they still have the receipt.

[Guerrilla22]

I thought it was a great statement. Who cares if Iran is or isn't developing nukes? If they are making nuclear weapons it is only because they need a deterent to keep the ever invasive US from invading their sovereign territory.

[bolshevik butcher]

A great staement?? You want millions of israeli working people to be blasted from the world? Are you soem kind of saddist?

[Ownthink]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28 2005, 04:05 PM
I thought it was a great statement. Who cares if Iran is or isn't developing nukes? If they are making nuclear weapons it is only because they need a deterent to keep the ever invasive US from invading their sovereign territory.
No.

[Edelweiss]

Is that president on crack, or what? Either that, or he is a paid agent of the CIA. :lol:

Seriously, it's obvious that the next aim of US imperialist ambitions is Iran. With such statements he is giving the neocons in the white house a deep forward pass to take the pressure on Iran to a new level. A president with such a lack of diplomatic skills is a threat for it's own country.

[camilo_cienfuegos]

the iraeli state is a fucking disgrace
the things they do in israel can only lead to he iranians, and such like, calling for thier destruction
the terrorist state of israel will be destryed eventually

[Amusing Scrotum]

the iraeli state is a fucking disgrace
the things they do in israel can only lead to he iranians, and such like, calling for thier destruction
the terrorist state of israel will be destryed eventually

Yes of course because Iran is a beacon of freedom, a paradise in which there is no oppression.

It is useful to note this -


Egypt said they showed "the weakness of the Iranian government". A Palestinian official also rejected the remarks.


While most Muslim and Arab capitals have remained silent on the president's remarks, a few have spoken out - including Palestinian chief negotiator Saeb Erekat.

"Palestinians recognise the right of the state of Israel to exist and I reject his comments," he told the BBC News website.

"What we need to be talking about is adding the state of Palestine to the map and not wiping Israel from the map," he said.


Tell me exactly why you support the statements of this reactionary bastard?

Despite the lack of legitimacy of Israel, are Communists here actually now supporting the forceful removal of a whole people, because frankly this is not very different to what the Zionists did to the Palestinians. Are we now borrowing ideas from Zionist theory?


Seriously, it's obvious that the next aim of US imperialist ambitions is Iran. With such statements he is giving the neocons in the white house a deep forward pass to take the pressure on Iran to a new level. A president with such a lack of diplomatic skills is a threat for it's own country.

I completely agree, and whilst I oppose imperialism of all varieties. I would not wish to ally myself in any way with a lunatic like Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

[camilo_cienfuegos]

i didnt say iran was a beacon of freedom you ****, dont put words in my mouth.
but israels actions are going to lead to its eventual downfall, that was my point

[Amusing Scrotum]

i didnt say iran was a beacon of freedom you ****, dont put words in my mouth.
but israels actions are going to lead to its eventual downfall, that was my point

Its nice to see you have such a wide vocabulary, you pestiferous fool.

If you do not think Iran is a more free, democratic and open society than Israel, then why would you support Iranian criticisms of Israel. If you were truly repulsed by the Iranian Government then you would have mentioned that Iran's abysmal record on human rights leaves them in no position to criticise Israel. No matter how accurate this criticism was.

By simple deduction it is easy to conclude that you think Iran has some form of moral authority over Israel and therefore Iranian criticisms are not only just, but should be supported.

Also what "downfall" is this you talk of, are you pledging support for Iranian intervention? Maybe world intervention? Or maybe you are suggesting that Israel will have a workers' revolution? Please be more specific when you talk about a nations destruction and whether you are pledging support for the destructor's.

[camilo_cienfuegos]

Originally posted by Armchair [email protected] 28 2005, 11:07 PM

i didnt say iran was a beacon of freedom you ****, dont put words in my mouth.
but israels actions are going to lead to its eventual downfall, that was my point

Its nice to see you have such a wide vocabulary, you pestiferous fool.

If you do not think Iran is a more free, democratic and open society than Israel, then why would you support Iranian criticisms of Israel. If you were truly repulsed by the Iranian Government then you would have mentioned that Iran's abysmal record on human rights leaves them in no position to criticise Israel. No matter how accurate this criticism was.

By simple deduction it is easy to conclude that you think Iran has some form of moral authority over Israel and therefore Iranian criticisms are not only just, but should be supported.

Also what "downfall" is this you talk of, are you pledging support for Iranian intervention? Maybe world intervention? Or maybe you are suggesting that Israel will have a workers' revolution? Please be more specific when you talk about a nations destruction and whether you are pledging support for the destructor's.
i would prfer a workers revolution, but to bve honest i dont much care who gets rid of them, as long as they are gotten rid of

[Amusing Scrotum]

i would prfer a workers revolution, but to bve honest i dont much care who gets rid of them, as long as they are gotten rid of

So you are advocating a forceful removal of a people from a country with recognised borders, by an outside imperialistic force. Now tell me how this differs from the Zionists wishing to forcefully remove the Palestinian people?

[Dark Exodus]

i would prfer a workers revolution, but to bve honest i dont much care who gets rid of them, as long as they are gotten rid of

What makes every person living in Israel worthy of death anymore than everyone in America or Britain or most other western countries?


I do think that it is rather laughable that Israel is now calling for action against Iran by the UN. After all of those (US vetoed) sanctions by the UN against them.

[camilo_cienfuegos]

Originally posted by Armchair [email protected] 28 2005, 11:21 PM

i would prfer a workers revolution, but to bve honest i dont much care who gets rid of them, as long as they are gotten rid of

So you are advocating a forceful removal of a people from a country with recognised borders, by an outside imperialistic force. Now tell me how this differs from the Zionists wishing to forcefully remove the Palestinian people?
im not sayin the poeple should be gotten rid of, im saying the fucking government and religious bullshit should be gotten rid of

[camilo_cienfuegos]

Originally posted by camilo_cienfuegos+Oct 28 2005, 11:26 PM--> (camilo_cienfuegos @ Oct 28 2005, 11:26 PM)
Armchair [email protected] 28 2005, 11:21 PM

i would prfer a workers revolution, but to bve honest i dont much care who gets rid of them, as long as they are gotten rid of

So you are advocating a forceful removal of a people from a country with recognised borders, by an outside imperialistic force. Now tell me how this differs from the Zionists wishing to forcefully remove the Palestinian people?
im not sayin the poeple should be gotten rid of, im saying the fucking government and religious bullshit should be gotten rid of [/b]
i win
*dances*

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

On Egypt, which was brought up earlier. The president is a complete puppet of U.S. imperialism. Don't forget that Egypt gets heavy U.S. funding, as does Israel.

[Severian]

Originally posted by Armchair [email protected] 28 2005, 05:07 PM
If you do not think Iran is a more free, democratic and open society than Israel, then why would you support Iranian criticisms of Israel.
Excuse me, but if a statement's true, it's true regardless of who says it.

This prediction that the "next wave" of Palestinian resistance would "wipe Israel off the map" is more demagogic than true. But in response to the hue and cry over it, the Iranian government said something that is true: that it's been made a scandal by people who know a billion Muslims dream of a world without Israel.

Probably Ahmadinejad and other politicians in the Muslim world say things like this all the time, in order to demagogically appeal to that anti-imperialist sentiment (and keep themselves in power.) Often they say more exaggerated things, or outright anti-Semitic statements. For example, the pro-US dictator of Malaysia once blamed Jewish financial speculators for the East Asia financial crisis and the devaluation of the Malaysian currency, making a demagogic reference to Palestine in doing so.

It's just that various governments and media outlets found it useful to make a big deal in this case, precisely because of the context of imperialist threats and pressure against Iran and its nuclear power program.

Note that for all the talk of "genocide," Ahmadinejad did not in fact say anything about Israel's population. Nor did he threaten Iranian military action, as the Israeli government is pretending in its Security Council complaint - on the contrary, it was Palestinian resistance he predicted would do away with Israel.

[Amusing Scrotum]

im not sayin the poeple should be gotten rid of, im saying the fucking government and religious bullshit should be gotten rid of

You said "i dont much care who gets rid of them." By saying "them" you don't make it clear whether you are referring to the Government or the population. In fact using the word "them" in this type of statement is often the type of language the far right uses to describe a group of people.

At the very least you are guilty of using inappropriate language in your posts.


Excuse me, but if a statement's true, it's true regardless of who says it.

This prediction that the "next wave" of Palestinian resistance would "wipe Israel off the map" is more demagogic than true. But in response to the hue and cry over it, the Iranian government said something that is true: that it's been made a scandal by people who know a billion Muslims dream of a world without Israel.

Probably Ahmadinejad and other politicians in the Muslim world say things like this all the time, in order to demagogically appeal to that anti-imperialist sentiment (and keep themselves in power.) Often they say more exaggerated things, or outright anti-Semitic statements. For example, the pro-US dictator of Malaysia once blamed Jewish financial speculators for the East Asia financial crisis and the devaluation of the Malaysian currency, making a demagogic reference to Palestine in doing so.

It's just that various governments and media outlets found it useful to make a big deal in this case, precisely because of the context of imperialist threats and pressure against Iran and its nuclear power program.

Note that for all the talk of "genocide," Ahmadinejad did not in fact say anything about Israel's population. Nor did he threaten Iranian military action, as the Israeli government is pretending in its Security Council complaint - on the contrary, it was Palestinian resistance he predicted would do away with Israel.

I'm not saying that the some of the criticisms are not valid or well founded. I am saying that these criticisms are coming from someone who has no right to criticise. The same way I would not accept criticisms of Soviet crimes from the American Government. We should make our own criticisms from our own political perspective and not ally ourselves with the criticisms presented by a conservative lunatic.

It is a similar situation to what happened in the 70s when the common market debate was happening. Tony Benn and the National Front both opposed the common market yet Tony Benn refused to share a stage with the National Front. This is because while they both opposed the common market, they did so from different political perspectives.

We should not ally ourselves with any faction of the oppressing class because they may dislike the same things we dislike. We must create our own criticisms from a leftist perspective. You yourself have admitted that these statements may be from an anti-Semitic perspective. I do not dislike Israel because I am an anti-Semite, therefore I will not support statements from an anti-Semitic perspective, I will formulate my own criticisms.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

On that; a correct idea is correct no matter who has it. If George Bush says something correct, it's still correct.

[Andy Bowden]

Am I the only one who thinks this has been blown up a bit?

Perhaps a pretext for an Israeli limited attack on Iranian Nuclear power stations?

Because as far as I can see, Ahmadinejad was just doing some barrell thumpong and reinforcing the party line.


But I think that we could easily see the Israelis repeat what they did at Osirak 1 + 2 in Iraq to Iranian nuclear power thanks to Ahmadinejads (possibly overhyped) comments.

[Severian]

Originally posted by Armchair [email protected] 29 2005, 12:07 PM
We should make our own criticisms from our own political perspective and not ally ourselves with the criticisms presented by a conservative lunatic.
True. (Though "populist demagogue" is a more accurate description of Ahmadinejad IMO. It's a significant point in terms of internal Iranian politics, and what his election says about the consciousness of working people in Iran today.)

My point is more about deflating the immense, hysterical hue and cry raised by imperialists around this fairly routine statement.....

[Intifada]

On the last Friday of the month of Ramadan, Iran holds protests against Israel amongst other things. This is a tradition.

In fact, five years ago, the "moderate" former President Hashemi Rafsanjani called for a Muslim state to annihilate Israel with a nuclear strike.

Nobody in the West said anything then.

They need an excuse to attack Iran, whether it be through invasion is another matter.

[metalero]

I agree on what Severian said. Imperialists following their economical interests on an eventual invasion to Iran, make a whole deal about demagogical anti-semitic statements rather than worrying to stop the actual destruction of palestinian people by the Israeli state. Ask any palestinian living under the infrahuman conditions Israeli state impose on them about the destruction of Israel they would say yes, but not refering to destruction of the jewish people, but rather the destruction of Israeli military, zionist policies and the return to their usurped lands.

[bolshevik butcher]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31 2005, 09:52 PM


They need an excuse to attack Iran, whether it be through invasion is another matter.
Apparently they seriosuly considered invading iran after 9/11 but they decided against it, and went for iraq because they decided that it was more 'dooable.' Syria could be their next target, they dont have the same military capacity or sheer size that iran has.

[Intifada]

Apparently they seriosuly considered invading iran after 9/11 but they decided against it, and went for iraq because they decided that it was more 'dooable.'

Invading Iran would not be an easy task.

In fact, attacking Iran through UN sanctions would also be hard, seeing as the Iranians are close to both the Russians and Chinese.


Syria could be they're next target

Indeed.

[Enragé]

Originally posted by Clenched [email protected] 28 2005, 09:25 PM
A great staement?? You want millions of israeli working people to be blasted from the world? Are you soem kind of saddist?
Ahmadinejad said that Israel should be wiped off the map...not the israelis.

[Phalanx]

Of course you could see it that way, but as Iran is developing nuclear technology, I don't think he meant peacefully.

[metalero]

Originally posted by Chinghis [email protected] 1 2005, 03:56 PM
Of course you could see it that way, but as Iran is developing nuclear technology, I don't think he meant peacefully.
Look and analyze reality: Israeli state already has nuclear weapons, and has already implemented zionist policies to wipe-off the palestinian people!

[Commie Rat]

on the though of destroying a zionist state there should be applause all around
no one said the people should be destroyed just the state

the iranian president is just opening himself up for a whole case of ass whooping

[Enragé]

Originally posted by Chinghis [email protected] 1 2005, 08:56 PM
Of course you could see it that way, but as Iran is developing nuclear technology, I don't think he meant peacefully.
Iran will never use nuclear technology for arms, it is simply not their way. You can accuse Iran of many things, but being hypocritical is not one of them.

[h&s]

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40958000/jpg/_40958424_flag203bap.jpg
This pisses me off. Every time some twat makes a statement such as the one that has been made, the news makes sure that it shows pictures of protests in favour of the statement as if thats the view of everyone in that country.
These protests are normally arranged by the Iranian government, and are in no way representative. Images of them just fuel support for imperialism.

[Enragé]

yea but i think most people here realise that. Though i really do believe lots of Iranians support what Ahmadinejad said.

"Where's the mosh pit....?"

Never has a more important question been asked... :)

[bolshevik butcher]

Originally posted by NewKindOfSoldier+Nov 1 2005, 07:53 PM--> (NewKindOfSoldier @ Nov 1 2005, 07:53 PM)
Clenched [email protected] 28 2005, 09:25 PM
A great staement?? You want millions of israeli working people to be blasted from the world? Are you soem kind of saddist?
Ahmadinejad said that Israel should be wiped off the map...not the israelis. [/b]
So you'd support an iranian invasion of israel? The zionists vs the fundementalists. I think i'd support the israeli resistance, imperialism is wrong and they've lived they're all there lvies for the most.

[h&s]

yea but i think most people here realise that. Though i really do believe lots of Iranians support what Ahmadinejad said.
How can you tell what the public opinion is?
And if the people do support the government's view on Israel, how do we know whether thats actual support come through people coming to the same conclusion, or support like the people of Germany supposedly supported the invasion of Europe?
I know I could be wrong.


Where's the mosh pit....?"

Never has a more important question been asked... :)
If only people were to mosh, all of the world's problems would be solved. :P

[Enragé]

Originally posted by Clenched Fist+Nov 2 2005, 04:43 PM--> (Clenched Fist @ Nov 2 2005, 04:43 PM)
Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2005, 07:53 PM

Clenched [email protected] 28 2005, 09:25 PM
A great staement?? You want millions of israeli working people to be blasted from the world? Are you soem kind of saddist?
Ahmadinejad said that Israel should be wiped off the map...not the israelis.
So you'd support an iranian invasion of israel? The zionists vs the fundementalists. I think i'd support the israeli resistance, imperialism is wrong and they've lived they're all there lvies for the most. [/b]
nope but i dont think thats what Ahmadinejad meant. What he meant was
Israel will be wiped off the earth by a flood of attacks (which is pretty much what he literally said) by which he most likely meant palestinian attacks.
OK even if you dont believe this...look at the map of the middle east...look up Iran...then look up Israel...Iran cant invade israel cuz they would have to go through either Iraq and Syria or through Saudi Arabia...


How can you tell what the public opinion is?
And if the people do support the government's view on Israel, how do we know whether thats actual support come through people coming to the same conclusion, or support like the people of Germany supposedly supported the invasion of Europe?
I know I could be wrong.

Well...iranians are muslims, in their point of view their palestinian brethren are being oppressed by outside invaders...ofcourse they'll support the palestines. Seems pure logic to me.
Look its very hard to get objective info, but if you take into account Iran's culture, its history, including the people's history...they most likely hate Israel.
And well..about that last comment...that would be incredibly hard to verify..in any country.


If only people were to mosh, all of the world's problems would be solved.

Exactly :lol: After some good moshing it'll be all like "whoaa...damn Sharon..you hurt me bad dude" "Yea ahmad...so did you" "lets all stop this shit ok sharon, lets just have peace...i cant fight when im all bruised up" "yea...great idea ahmad...now pass the joint"
:)