High School

[Fidel Follower]

Im 14, an i go to Highfields school, and theres only about 3 commies including me! So does any one else have any tips or what they've been through? :hammer:

[which doctor]

I'm 15 almost 15 and I'm the only commie that I know of in my school. Lots of us here are commies in high school. I go to a private high school of about 280 students and I'm no too happy with it, but I put up with it realizing that my other choice wouldn't be any better. Recently I've been becoming more vocal about my beliefs. I don't really have any tips for you, just don't make oo many enemies.

[Socialistpenguin]

Originally posted by Fidel [email protected] 23 2005, 04:53 PM
Im 14, an i go to Highfields school, and theres only about 3 commies including me! So does any one else have any tips or what they've been through? :hammer:
Wow, be thankful you've got at least other commies at school! I think I'm the only commie in my school, amongst a small stratum of pseudo-political friends.
My advice to you:

1. If you take History, that is an excellent time to announce your beliefs, especially if you're doing McCarthyism and the Red Scare, or even the Russian revolution. They'll probably teach the same bullshit "human nature" and "communist state-dictatorship" (even though it's an oxymoron). Educate, if asked for your opinion. Just beware of any chavs / trailer trash that might detract from your speech.

2. Print propaganda out and share it amongst comrades and potential comrades. "The most violent reaction in society is ignorance"- Emma Goldman. Some people don't even know what system they live in currently! Tell them of the pros of communist society, and the cons of capitalist "society".

3. Research! Do not be made a fool of in a debate for not knowing your target subject. And whenever you can, GO ON THE OFFENSIVE! Things to start you off...
"How can YOU justify a system in which the workers do all the work, and get a fraction of the money THEY earnt, yet the boss does next to nothing and gets the highest salary?"
"How can you justify a system that has given us racism, nationalism, sexism, and other discriminatory traits?"
"Can you prove human nature exists?" -(Guaranteed you'll need that one).

That's all for now.

[More Fire for the People]

I'm a sophmore, Marxist-Leninist-Maoist of sorts. Theres a few other leftist at my school, mainly of the social democrat type or the "punk-anarchist" variety.

[which doctor]

Here's my tactic: Take all the honors classes, get all A's, write a paper about the glories of communism, then the teachers take you seriously and start to see your point of view.

[red_orchestra]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2005, 04:50 PM
Wow, be thankful you've got at least other commies at school! I think I'm the only commie in my school, amongst a small stratum of pseudo-political friends.
My advice to you:

1. If you take History, that is an excellent time to announce your beliefs, especially if you're doing McCarthyism and the Red Scare, or even the Russian revolution. They'll probably teach the same bullshit "human nature" and "communist state-dictatorship" (even though it's an oxymoron). Educate, if asked for your opinion. Just beware of any chavs / trailer trash that might detract from your speech.

2. Print propaganda out and share it amongst comrades and potential comrades. "The most violent reaction in society is ignorance"- Emma Goldman. Some people don't even know what system they live in currently! Tell them of the pros of communist society, and the cons of capitalist "society".

3. Research! Do not be made a fool of in a debate for not knowing your target subject. And whenever you can, GO ON THE OFFENSIVE! Things to start you off...
"How can YOU justify a system in which the workers do all the work, and get a fraction of the money THEY earnt, yet the boss does next to nothing and gets the highest salary?"
"How can you justify a system that has given us racism, nationalism, sexism, and other discriminatory traits?"
"Can you prove human nature exists?" -(Guaranteed you'll need that one).

That's all for now.
I'm an educator, and a strong believer in militant Socialism. Students line up for my classes because I teach from a very different perspective...and I get away with it. No, I don't preach...I allow for students to develope their own political beliefs. I do teach from a Marxist perspective.

So, not every teacher is your enemy guys.

[which doctor]

I'm considering becoming a high school teacher and teaching a politics, econ, government, or history and teaching my a communist tilt. I think it would be fun and it would help me stay youthful.

[More Fire for the People]

I suggest you teach from a Socratic or dialectic method, so that when you're accused of being liberal you can just point to your alternative teaching method which is unbiased.

[Fidel Follower]

:D Wohoo that really good thanks alot all and Socialistpenguin, and well there is definatly one commie and two that say there on the left but who knows?

I have taken History and i think my History teacher is abit towards the left he has good morals!

Ohh and is there any rules on hurting some one that says all communists are "gay"? Just a thought?

Thanks again! Comrades :hammer:

[danny android]

I am a junior in highschool and I have a libertarian capitalist economics teacher. Me and him always get in debates openly in class. And I openly tell him and everybody else around be that I am an anarchist/communist. I find that you are able to say more of what you want to say when you are atleast freindly about it. Me and my teacher get along really good and so I pretty much get to say whatever I want even though he doesn't agree with me at all. Just going off and telling your teacher that they are a stupid duesche bag or something like that just doesn't get you anywhere, gain there respect first and then you will be permited to say whatever you want. Do well in the class and be active in it this is pretty much the main way to gain the respect of your teachers. However I do realize that sometimes it is impossible to gain peoples respect, I was just lucky enouf to have a teacher who is really nice and stuff. So if you can't gain the respect of the teacher then you totally have the right to just be a complete dick to them, just make sure that you don't just look like some punk blowing off steam, this may turn some people off to you.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

I'm not sure how much use it will be, but, in high school, myself and a group of friends formed a radical collective that was able to organize guest-speakers, carry out actions, and build links between highschool students and the larger activist community.
Most of the documents from "YAC" (pamphlets, meeting minutes, etc.) are still, I think, on a computer at my parents' house. If anybody is interested, I'd happily email them around next time I'm at my parents house. Drop me a Private-Message w/ yr email addy if you're interested.

I'm going to disagree, to some extent, with the advice that y'all go immediately "on the offensive" as it were. In my own experience, yr best bet is to concentrate on understanding the daily implications of our social system, and relating them to the daily experiences of yr peers. Read as much as you can while you're still in highschool and have the free time. Listen to the right-wing teachers, and really understand their arguments so that when the time is right you know yr enemy. This done, don't organize people around "communism!" necessarily - organize them around every day issues and show them why a revolutionary approach and understanding is the solution to these problems. For all of YAC's propagandizing, our biggest jump in membership followed a campaign around free-speech in the school, and the right to express political opinions of any stripe (excluding, of course, reactionary opinions ;)).


So, not every teacher is your enemy guys.

VERY, VERY, VERY TRUE.
Don't get sucked into self-rightous belief that you and yr friends are the only ones who "get it" - and "preppy fucks", teachers, parents, etc. never will.

[DisIllusion]

I'm 14 too, but i'm an Anarchist at my school. I'm always getting shit from people who consider themselves "real anarchists" but never do anything about it and don't even know what Anarchism is. Then there's the people who expect me to throw molotov cocktails at everything and be a delinquent. I have a question though, how can one get an Anarchist/Socialist Commune started at their school as a club or whatever? Suggestions please?

[Fidel Follower]

Thanks Virgin Molotov Cocktail, i will ask you for those papers when i have the time.

And you advise seems pritty sound! ;)

I dont have any suggestions about how to form a group, and it is hard to find out where every body stands, so you will have a hard time trying to find someone who argrees with your political views! (from experience)

So apart from that i really dont know?

:hammer:

[Redanny]

There's a godd few lefties in our school. we even have a logo/flag for a Red Scotland. :hammer:


Click to see... :P

[Fidel Follower]

:D thats really good! :hammer: I like that alot!

[Redanny]

thanks! :D

[Fidel Follower]

So your from scotland? Where abouts? :hammer:

[Redanny]

Originally posted by Fidel [email protected] 24 2005, 02:57 PM
So your from scotland? Where abouts? :hammer:
Just outside Edinburgh, Livingston. :rolleyes:

Where you from?

[Fidel Follower]

Humm im from Derbyshire which is dead bang in the centre of England. Any one else from Derbyshire??? :hammer: Ohh and what do you talk about or do, you leftys i mean.

Oh and you have inspired me to make my own flag! :D

[Fidel Follower]

Ohh and can some one tell me how to get the quote box, i cant work out how to do it :blush: :hammer: Thanks again! Commrades

[Redanny]

at the top right hand corner of a post, is the quote button, just click that, then a page will come almost identical to a reply page. when you right your message, the quote will appear in your reply.

Post your flag when its done!

[Redanny]

here are some more of our flag ideas. :D

[Redanny]

1 more..

[Livetrueordie]

if you raise the resolution(pixels per *) on those flags they will come out less pixellized

[DisIllusion]

La Jolla? In Nor Cal or So Cal?

[Redanny]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2005, 02:46 AM
if you raise the resolution(pixels per *) on those flags they will come out less pixellized
how do i do that? :blink:

[Livetrueordie]

What Image software are you using? Your probably using MSpaint which isn't good for anything. You can use Photoshop if you have access to a copy or The gimp (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_GIMP) for free. Things will come out much crisper with these programs...

[drain.you]

Well, I'm 17 and go to college in North-East England. I have a few people who sympathise with my beliefs but to be fair they are just Old Labour supporters and not quite the real thing at that. It sucks being alone in your beliefs and its hard to defend yourself in class debates when everyone is against you but it gets easier over time. Suppose the fact that I feel so isolated in college is the reason I've became a part of this forum, to discuss ideas with like-minded people, such as yourself. :)

[Fidel Follower]

Ohh i have almost finished my flag :D i will post it when i've completed it! And sorry i havent been talking much my computer was ill..:hammer:

[lemmycaution]

hey,
I'm a seventeen year old from Mumbai,India. I'm pretty much the only guy in my class who knows anything about politics. History in school and college is taught from an extremely bourgeois angle defending every fuck-up of the ruling government. recently, the ruling party dumped the Communists by 'opening the doors' to liberalization and globalization...can any of you help me to make my fellow students more aware about the current situation? d'you know how i could make defying injustice seem more attractive than booze and drugs and parties? feel free to give me a lot of suggestions...i desperately need help!

[Graham_Pogo]

I'm 16 and I go to Spring-Ford higschool (PA, United States). I'm the only commie.... Hell I'm one of the only leftists in my school. The teachers think its funny , and the kids think im pinko scum. Eh doesn't bother me that much. :hammer:

[Gura]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28 2005, 01:53 PM
recently, the ruling party dumped the Communists by 'opening the doors' to liberalization and globalization...can any of you help me to make my fellow students more aware about the current situation?
You could talk about what the communists in government did to help or try to help students and workers. If the students are going to be affected by liberalisation of the economy, that might be a good place to start. For example, if the government in the past has helped students get into colleges by paying all or part of the fees, then they will be concerned about that. You could also mention that a more open market is going to have direct effect on the quality of education they recieve (for example, the government may cut funding for schools, and students will have to learn from old beat-up textbooks, etc.).

You might also talk about how the capitalist economy provides no assurance that they will either have a job or have decent services when they get out of school.

[CommieTommy]

I am a strong Socialist. I like to keep it quiet because people would think I am terribly weird if I walk around preach. I got one of my freinds into Marxist economics and I met this really weird communist there that likes Stalin and Pol Pot. McDowell High School in Erie PA is probily the most conservative school ever.

[Livetrueordie]

you stomp the stalinist out? ;)

[rossith]

Im one of 2 communist pagans in my school in manchester, uk, so we're a bit of a rare sort, but there are about 15 communists im friends with too.

[which doctor]

Originally posted by [email protected] 30 2005, 06:51 AM
Im one of 2 communist pagans in my school in manchester, uk, so we're a bit of a rare sort, but there are about 15 communists im friends with too.
15 commie friends, damn. I'm jealous.

[Fidel Follower]

15 wowsa thats alot you could defanatly start a club with that many!

(mutters to self "stupid 15, i wish i had 15")

[MoscowFarewell]

I am. I'm a junior in Beyer at Modesto. Before I spoke of it, I was pretty influential. So now when I state it, instead of shying away from my beliefs, they ask why, in which I can give an explanation. Now a majority of people I know understand my views on it.

[Qwerty Dvorak]

yeah, i was the only commie in my school till i managed to convert a friend... :D

[ScottishSocialist13]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31 2005, 08:01 PM
yeah, i was the only commie in my school till i managed to convert a friend... :D
That is the best way to convert people. Tell friends the advantages of communism, you'll be suprised how many people agree with the principles.

[Livetrueordie]

you'll be suprised how many people agree with the principles.
Why be surprised? i look at it this way "If someone understands communism, then they are a communist"

[Noah]

Im one of 2 communist pagans in my school in manchester, uk, so we're a bit of a rare sort, but there are about 15 communists im friends with too. Quote Rossith.


Hey there guys,

My name is Noah, I go to Rossith's school (his real name is Ross) I'm not the paganist one (not sure whether he is referring to me), i'm an Athiest. I used to be interested in so called 'Left Hand Path' religions though but now it's definitely not my thing.

We do have quiet a few commie people in our school but they don't know what they talk about. Sometimes I get annoyed at people who call themselves communists but in actualy fact, don't and won't want to learn about communism they just want to be a black sheep who stick out in a crowd.

I know this boy in our school, who's dad died in Congo and had communist links, or something along these lines. Because of this he feels he has no need to learn about communism and believe Cuba is a communist country or as he says 'some villages in Cuba are communist'. He doesn't want to learn again he enjoys being a black sheep, more like a trend it makes me angry. But because his dad was a communist he is by nature ... communist. He refuses to read the Commie manifesto or anything in regards to communism's concept because he's 'naturally communist. Makes me so angry..

Me and Rossith like to educate ourselves about communism, I find alot of my friends in school who go; 'What is communism' before I finish the first sentence it's like...'Oh I want to fight for communists' they need to educate themselves first, they make it sounds like a fashion trend, let's all buy Che Guevara posters. Or sometimes it feels like they just do it because they're you're friends but don't really want to learn about it.

But to say the least political understanding in our school is very backwards.

I know one teacher in my school, who teaches RE who is slightly left wing and tends to put his views across while teaching :D. Not very religious i must say.

Anyway I'm 14 and am in Year 10 I have been interested in communism for two years.

I'm involved in many organisations locally. And I get involved alot in History and RE and but my left wing views across, in a confident tone and try to never hesitate, the teacher seems to gives me respect for it. It's better than just swearing at them or any of that behavior.

We do have many chavs in our school, who are numheaded and just like they're fake bling and so on.

Thanks for reading guys :D.

Noah..

[rossith]

heh nice noah nice. There is also a history teacher that i have who is left wing and says he is sympatheitic towards communist beliefs. i find it quite interesting to be taught history by somebody who has left wing views insted of others as i guess firstly because i agree with his ideas but also secondly, its shown me the different sides to political arguements.

anyway i must be off
rossith

[omegaflare]

Heh, Im 16 in Dallas, TX. I go to Skyline High school... 4900 Students, they've got... Anyways, since there are that many people at Skyline, ive encountered this many different political affiliations...

12 commies

5 anarchists

loads and loads and loads of the "punk anarchist"

3 Social Democrats

1 Green

2 Stalinists

1 Maoist

and get this.....

1 Nazi....Hes 1/6 Austrian and that gives him the full right to be a Nazi...Guess what this fuckers other heritages are? Ironically, Hes also Jewish, Black, Mexican, Ethiopian, and generic "white". His mother is A jehova's witness and his cousin is gay. Can you say "Oxymoron"?

[enigma2517]

hating yourself must be the new fad

[Colombia]

Since we are on the topic of high school, has anyone ever tried running for class officer as a communist? I'm thinking of doing it when I'm a senior next year.

[enigma2517]

I think it'd be more of a joke than anything else.

It's an economic system...which you can't really implement in something that isn't economic (i.e. school)

Moreover, you'll probably just look like some kind of crazy authoritarian.

It would be fun for the attention, but if you really care about what you believe in then I bet your energy could be directed elsewhere.

[Noah]

I'm the form class (or class officer) and i'm deputy house captain for 1/4 of the school. People know i read about leftwing and am a supporter of communism, very religious Christians because they always contradict themselves in Religious Education and I always point it out so they tend to stay clear of me but when I tell everyone people the truth points about communism instead of the rubbish some of the teachers tell them, they just give me respect for it.

Mainly I just do my job, which in my school is discussing points like removing junk food. After a 3 yr campaign we finally removed coca cola but now our new headmaster wants to bring it back in order to increase profits (for himself probably at the expense of the pupil's health).

I dont know how you guys vote for class officers but in our school every class votes in a candidate. I'm on good terms with most people in my class too, so that could be a possibility why I won the votes.

Noah.

[which doctor]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2005, 02:38 PM
Since we are on the topic of high school, has anyone ever tried running for class officer as a communist? I'm thinking of doing it when I'm a senior next year.
At my old school class elections were nothing more than popularity contests and people didn't really give themselves to a particular political party. Student councl didn't really do anything except design the spirit day shirts. And what exactly do you plan on doing as a communist in a student council?

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

I'm also the form captain (like class officer) and people nkow that i'm russian and know my beliefs and ideals but it doesnt really affect the way they treat me anymore. They give respect for very moderate beliefs (like fair trade or bein anti war in Iraq) but i harsh as it sounds i don't think they're clever (or interested enough) to discuss political theory or ideology.

[Noah]

At my old school class elections were nothing more than popularity contests and people didn't really give themselves to a particular political party. Student councl didn't really do anything except design the spirit day shirts. And what exactly do you plan on doing as a communist in a student council?

Same with my school, it's just a popularity contest of that certain class. I am an good terms with most people in my class and no other male candidates signed up so...

I thought I'd be able to lead a campain against the headmaster bringing back junk food and coca cola so he can increase profits..I'm still working on it but I must say our new headteacher is an absolute and utter wacko.

I also agree with Comrade Yastrebkov, I also get respect for my beliefs but many students seem to be apathetic with politic issues.

[Red October]

im 14 and go to enloe high in north carolina. im the only socialist at my school, but i have had the opportunity to educate other kids about the evils of capitalism and why trotsky is good :trotski:

[which doctor]

Oh yeah and another thing last year the winners of the election for my calls were all asian. I think people tried to vote for as many huang's, chang's, and wiu's as possible.

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

Lol, being politically correct. Our headmistress is a conservative biatch. Today I found out that I was gonna get banned fom the school internet for "going on extreme left-wing websites with inappropriate content"...turns out they were spying on me all along. The website i went on was this one. Lol what a joke.

[which doctor]

Take magnets to all of their computers. Show 'em who's boss.

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

Lol good idea, will bear it in mind.

[Martyr]

I'am sort of in a way persecuted by my teachers and fellow students because I'am a leftist. Even though I play sports the the students especially the Jocks hate anyone leftist.

[Red October]

if you have the time, try removing the hard drives of the computers. all you need is a screw driver and some other basic tools.

[which doctor]

Originally posted by Red October [email protected] 2 2005, 07:46 PM
if you have the time, try removing the hard drives of the computers. all you need is a screw driver and some other basic tools.
Someone did that last year at my school in my drafting class. He brought in lock cutters to cut the padlock, then he removed the hard drive. Many school computers have locks on the back of the computer to preven that kind of theft.

[Fidel Follower]

Humm i see i have started quite a debate! Hurray! I just wanted to remind every one, and yes you probalably know this but....make sure you know your stuff!

It really helps when some one asks "What the hell is communism?"

Or "ohh yeah starlin was a communist, your gay, GAY hahahhahahaha"

know your stuff and you will win every debate! :hammer:

By the way the CIA watches this web site!

F Follower

[rossith]

bloody hell its amazing how brainwashed so many people are with capitalist ideas

[themaskedavenger]

I dont even know why we still have student councils cause they dont do shit and all it is, is just a huge popularity contest. Every promises all these things in their platforms and speeches, when really no one gives a shit and whoever is elected winds up falling through on their promises anyway.
FUck em all, thats what i say

[Simotix]

While I am not a full fledged communist there is not many people at my school that "lean to the left". Only maybe about two or three that I know of, im sure there is a few more that just don't realize it.




Originally posted by Fidel [email protected] 3 2005, 05:59 PM
By the way the CIA watches this web site!
What are you talking about?

[ack]

Originally posted by Red October [email protected] 2 2005, 08:18 PM
im 14 and go to enloe high in north carolina. im the only socialist at my school, but i have had the opportunity to educate other kids about the evils of capitalism and why trotsky is good :trotski:
Nah, man, I'm a socialist too.

[Fidel Follower]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2005, 07:05 PM
bloody hell its amazing how brainwashed so many people are with capitalist ideas
You what? Whats that suppose to mean?

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

What did u mean bout the CIA wayching the site? I kno i het watched at skool constantly by senior members of staff but the CIA.. wow im becoming a right "enemy of the state". Will have to run away soon.

[rossith]

ah people were just pissing me off on msn saying how communism is like nazism :blink: annoyed me how they know so little

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

I know the feeling mate! We just have to smile and pity them..Perhaps by the time theyre 30ish they mite learn a few things apart from games/sex/dope/getting pissed and...well, more getting pissed.

[rossith]

heh yer, and maybe understand something about politics by then aswell

[Noah]

It's because of the information available to the people/students apathetic to communism, many of them get taught the wrong, untrue things about communism.

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

True. Thats what the ruling class want them to be taught, and thats what theyre exposed to in popular culture e.g. hollywood movies, or games or books.

There are also some people who aren't like the normal dumb crowd but don't know wat to channel their thoughts/efforts into. Thyre clever but just need putting "onto the right path". Thats where us lot come in :)

[TheComrade]

Fidel Follower - I GO TO HIGHFIELDS SCHOOL! I am, I believe, one of the few commies in the school! Well...I wouldn't quite say I am a Communist - I am very interested in the system - the say it works etc.

I say to any CIA agent watching this site- come and get me!

Though I am young I am confident that if I get arrested for 'Glorifying Terrorism' I will stir up (with help from parents and comrades) a new wave of social unrest. I believe it is time the UK woke up to the slow decent this country is taking into dictatorship and a destruction of all civil liberties!

[TheComrade]

Elections of all kinds in our school are also popularity contests. I have always failed to influence them up until about a year ago - where I changed my ways. I became less arrogant - cocky - I became friendly, more accepting, more caring - I have, of course retained my deep Socialist beliefs - but I have become popular!! I feel better about myself!! Just wanted to let you all know that....!

[Ownthink]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2005, 06:05 PM
Elections of all kinds in our school are also popularity contests. I have always failed to influence them up until about a year ago - where I changed my ways. I became less arrogant - cocky - I became friendly, more accepting, more caring - I have, of course retained my deep Socialist beliefs - but I have become popular!! I feel better about myself!! Just wanted to let you all know that....!
Being friendly is for pussies.


:)

[Noah]

Che Guevara was actually quiet friendly...And he sure wasn't no pussay.

[Fidel Follower]

Originally posted by [email protected] 5 2005, 12:54 AM
Che Guevara was actually quiet friendly...And he sure wasn't no pussay.
yeah Che was friendly but he is only 1 commie out of thousands...

this is constuctive critisism so hope you can deal with it :hammer:

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

Woah! I think there's a difference between being friendly and trying to suck up to "popular" people and chavs who u have nothing in common with but just want to be accepted.

Sure, be friednly to people so they don't have an excuse to say bad things about you, but don't follow the crowd - its not worth it. Better to be an outcast.. :D

[Noah]

this is constuctive critisism so hope you can deal with it - Fidel Follower.

How is saying 'being friendly is for pussies' constructive?

[Waffler]

Thats pussy talk!

And by that i mean... im pretty sure he was joking.

[Simotix]

Originally posted by [email protected] 5 2005, 12:54 AM
Che Guevara was actually quiet friendly...And he sure wasn't no pussay.
Che Guevara was friendly but a very harsh ridicular when necessary.

There is times when he actually made his own soldiers cry when after fierce yelling at them.

[Noah]

Originally posted by [email protected] 7 2005, 04:52 PM
Che Guevara was friendly but a very harsh ridicular when necessary.

There is times when he actually made his own soldiers cry when after fierce yelling at them.


That is true but you must remember they were soldiers, sometimes you can't be friendly with soldiers as a leader. I doubt Che would ever be like that towards civilians even in a hostile country.

And yes I'm sure Ownthink was probably joking :) that's why I wondered why Fidel Follower though it was, constructive criticism and then asking me whether I could deal with it?

Noah

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

I'm sure he loves you really :D

[Noah]

I'm sure he does but there is no need to offend a fellow comrade on unstable grounds.

[against all authority]

im 16 and currently at school in the isle of man. including me i think there are only 2 far left students who go to my school. im constantly in debate with people about various problems that right wing governing creates. if there are any other rev left users who live in the isle of man plz email me.

[Fidel Follower]

Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2005, 10:32 PM

this is constuctive critisism so hope you can deal with it - Fidel Follower.

How is saying 'being friendly is for pussies' constructive?
Acchem Noah i never said :being friendly is for pussies" if you have a proper look i think you will find i never said that....comrade!

anyway moving on Isle of man, i have been there many a time!
Its really nice over there i dont like the ferry journy though!

ps i went to Duglas?

[against all authority]

yeah, thats the "capital" although its tiny! yeah the isle of mans quite a nice place but it seriously lacks diversity. there are absolutely no sub-cultures over here and near enough everyone falls into the catorgory of skater or chav lol. thats why im so eager to find someone here who shares the same interests as me, as at the moment it seems like only very few do!

[arielle]

I'm 16, turning 17 Anarachist junior in a South Jersey high school. That's right... the most republican christian part of this little democratic state. It's "illegal" to hand out fliers or actual facts to other people in school without admistration's approval (meanwhile "anime club" and "mock trial" club don't need written permission to put their posters up around the school and they aren't even funded by the school). But I am not the only leftest in my school (only anarchist but I need SOMEONE to have something in common with lol), an Independant (very leftest who looks up to Che). And another Independant who I am in a relationship with who thinks any kind of revolution can only happen through force (ie: france at the moment) being that we get FORCED backdown.

:\ I need more fliers

[Erythromycin-diazepam]

Not sure if i posted this already...

im not the only lefty.


I got to school with weisty and greenaffairz and 2 other comrades that arnt on this forum

[Fidel Follower]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2005, 09:36 PM
It's "illegal" to hand out fliers or actual facts to other people in school without admistration's approval (meanwhile "anime club" and "mock trial" club don't need written permission to put their posters up around the school and they aren't even funded by the school).

:\ I need more fliers
Comrade dont listen to the petty rules! Revolutions were not formed by following the rules. When Hitler was in rule over Germany two students( i forget their names) printed hundreds of fliers around their school...

they were found out and killed, but it would be a great idea to post fliers!!
you have got me thinking about doing that in my school!!! :hammer:

[TheComrade]

I agree, Fidel Follower - BEND the rules - think of a subtle way of getting around the rules.

Fidel Follower - Would anyone REALLY be interested in a communist revolution in our school?? I know some of my...fanatical followers...who might get excited by it but I dont think they would fully understand...shame...

[Fidel Follower]

Yeah, its would be nice but...i dont think it is going to happen BUT i can hope....lol


:hammer: :D

[against all authority]

yeah it wasnt reli acceptable in our school either. so i found a load of anti-capitalist and anti-bush posters on the internet and used the school printers to mass produce them. :D

[gewehr_3]

It would be a great idea for one of us to create an anti bush/ anti war flyer and we can all print them off on the schools laser printers and pass them out

[Noah]

Idea flash...We could create a network around the UK for all the people in the UK but through schoo like a student council. This way the teachers in our school would know that something powerful is emerging, we would be much more stronger that way in saying look guys 'it's not just us five or ten in this school who believe this but lots of students are supporting this around the UK'. .

[rossith]

I'm liking that noah (i go to the same school as noah) and we should have a poster/flier that we could all use. Is there anybody that is good at I.T. on this forum and if so, would it be possible for them to produce such a poster/flier?

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

I could design a leaflet/flier but don't have the resources to mass produce them cos im a poor student (thanks to mr blair's tuition fee policies) that student council thing is a good idea, but it will need to be well organised. And aren't there already lots of student unions around the country?

[Simotix]

I put this following flyer up at my school (though was quickly being taken down).

[Noah]

Ok well, we should begin to make a list of UK based schools first of all...for us UK members.


I'm not sure whether mentioning our school on here because of neo-nazi people, like were not allowed to show our pictures...so we should make a list of the council and then make contact on MSN or Private Message.

We would need to think of a name for the council then we could begin making a poster / some form of propaganda.

So then who's up for it?

[rossith]

Well you know i am noah, and we can do a joint bit around our school

[against all authority]

definately count me in. ill hanlde the isle of man side of things lol

[Noah]

Do you have MSN against all authority? If you do PM it to me, we can talk more there!

[against all authority]

so the plan is to create a website with information pages on all the usual topics with a smaller forum ( to prevent getting little assholes with their "i am a nazi" posts) but direct people with an actual interest to rev left. then produce a flyer with the new websites address. we may even be able to run it through schools if we persuade them that its "educational". anyone got any other ideas?

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

Noah count me in too. Wow a website and forum eh? Will take lots of work then. I think the list of schools and a council is a good idea. What will be the purpose of it? We need to have concrete aims that we need to pursue.

[Fidel Follower]

Yep count this comrade in! It you want a free web sire use www.piczo.com or the free webs one!

And i am reasonably good at IT skills, and i have alot of ink!

Any one who want my Hotmail send me a message! If we organise this right it could be huge! :hammer:

[Jacob]

i like what noah is saying. though, going to the same school, he already confronted me, so i'm in! hehe

[Noah]

Comrades...Fidel Follower and Comrade Yastrebkov, do you have MSN or email I can contact you...we should all decide what our aims our and come to a mutual decision, so far i'm just making a list of the people, areas and schools.

Then we can tell our schools we are making a group from all over England led by a school in Manchester (my school, they won't say anything) to discuss 'political issues' for youth / A level college students. This way we can exploit the schools resources like photocopiers, paper and even pencils we can rob :D , so we can organize this group!

We can also feedback to our schools what we are discussing, you can just make it up because if we say it is left wing...then I doubt they will support it.


Regarding the website and forum...I can arrange something for an actual domain and a little forum where we can discuss group-related issues.

[TheComrade]

Noah - I go to the same school as Fidel Follower - I'm good friends with him. I would be elated to be a part of this group, I am focusing on exams at the moment (I also don't want to end up suspended or in prison!) but I will help where I can! Shall I PM you my MSN??

[Fidel Follower]

ahhemm sorry Thecomrade, but who are you?.......hummmm i think i know?

:hammer:

[against all authority]

Noah, i spoke to my head of year today and she said she cant see any problem in the school endorising our site. so i will be able to put up posters, flyers and get a page in the school newsheet. just tell them it is for educaitonal purposes.. as soon as i said that she was all for it lol.

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

when you fellows have the website and forum up, some PM me...

I started my own group @ school (www.orangefront.tk) perhaps we could affiliate?

[Noah]

I'm sure that is a possibily Kevies!

Nice one AAA, my head of year said they'll tell me on Monday and I said it was for educational purposes too :D .

[Fidel Follower]

I've gotta say that web site is impressive, what did you use to make it?

:hammer:

[TheComrade]

I can produce simple websites very quickly and efficently - www.janeweir.co.uk and www.templarpoetry.co.uk are two websites I was comissioned to produce. I can just about establish an Invisionboard forum but I don't know how to edit etc. I have a tiny bit of experience in search engine optimisation... I will help in any way I can - I can gather more support from friends too!

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Originally posted by Fidel [email protected] 12 2005, 07:34 PM
I've gotta say that web site is impressive, what did you use to make it?

:hammer:
I did all the graphics in Adobe Photoshop CS2, made the site in dreamweaver MX 2004.. uploaded it to geocities and got a .tk extension.

EDIT: I used www.invisionfree.com for the forum...

[Fidel Follower]

kk, nice one mate! The site is really impressive! And if you can sort out my acount on your page if you would? That would be great..

SO about the posters we need to think of a poster we can give out/put up in all the schools!

Ohhh and what do you think about good graffity? Sorry im bad at spelling? :hammer:

[Noah]

In-school graffiti?

[Fidel Follower]

Humm i didnt originaly mean that, buttt..... thats a good idea, i suppose you would be found out really quick..because if commie Graffiti got sprayed everywere who would the police look to?

A commie! But any where really, city centres buses and so on?

:hammer:

[against all authority]

i like the rebellious idea but i think for the time being we should play it safe.. try to avoid any unnecessary confrontations with the law lol. at least until we get this thing up and running. if we go around doing that, and we get caught, its not exactly going to incline people to join us if they think were going to get them into trouble. plus we want to get as much support as possible, from everyone... parents teachers etc... there is power in numbers so lets get them first lol! :P

[Noah]

Ok but I have an urge to scape in our website (when/if one goes up) into the toilets now :D

[against all authority]

okay, thats acceptable i suppose lol! :D :P

[Fidel Follower]

Have you seen www.orangefront.tk its a really good web site made by one of our comrades! It also has a forum just like this one! Hurayy|!


:hammer: And if you dont think we sould Graffiti, what can i draw on!!!!!?!lol :blink:

[Fidel Follower]

So if you do want to start a web site let me know i have some free-time on my hands....so give me a bell........:hammer:

[against all authority]

yeah that would be cool. the idea really is to give people in high school the opportunity to learn about different aspects of leftism (as its quite hard to find unless you know where to look) so they are able to form their own opinions on things. then hopefully we will have more lefties around all the schools. knowledge is power! :hammer:

[TheComrade]

I can build websites - professional ones too! I have little spare time at the moment what with mocks in a few weeks...but I will help where and whenever I can!

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Originally posted by Fidel [email protected] 14 2005, 07:20 AM
Have you seen www.orangefront.tk its a really good web site made by one of our comrades! It also has a forum just like this one! Hurayy|!


:hammer: And if you dont think we sould Graffiti, what can i draw on!!!!!?!lol :blink:
hopefully soon we can get up a forum and site primarily for this union project..

I think everyone involved needs to start communicating and perhaps having some IM conferences (msn messenger)... I already have Fidel Follower on my contact list...

[against all authority]

ill send u my email address when i get my home pc fixed. the server in my school is shite and blocks absolutely everything, and it wont let me PM lol :angry: it even blocks things like anarchism etc!

[Fidel Follower]

:angry: My pc is being a real Fascist :angry:! So im on and off! (its not working) Grrrr

And my school blocks everything too, i mean everything! Humm i will give my MSN to any one who wants it, but its not working at the moment so this is my only source of communication!

So ask away, and yes knowledge is power! Well commie power anyway :P

[Noah]

Fidel Follower please send me your email comrad, by PM so I can add you to MSN.

I'm making an app people can fill in so I can see who can / is attempting to make links through schools about leftwing politics.

We can talk more on IM email.

I've PMed you my email too.

Noah

[Hegemonicretribution]

You can get past the blocks by using a proxy. I definitely know it will work for you AAA.

[TheComrade]

School filters are obsurd! I went on www.afghanistan.com(?) because I was doing the Afgan war in history - it was blocked! (the filter claimed it was a 'terrorist site' !!! What the hell?!?! I think I have even had a few pages of RevLeft blocked for the same reason!! How funny!!.....

[against all authority]

Hegemonicretribution... what proxy? ive tried everything to get around the school server restrictions and everything i do they pic up on it and close it down almost instantly... how and where do i get and use that proxy ur on about?

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 10:12 PM
School filters are obsurd! I went on www.afghanistan.com(?) because I was doing the Afgan war in history - it was blocked! (the filter claimed it was a 'terrorist site' !!! What the hell?!?! I think I have even had a few pages of RevLeft blocked for the same reason!! How funny!!.....
School filters got me out of doing my science work the other day. We were supposed to research the face on Mars and the pyramids for part of our astronomy project... nearly every page I found was blocked for being into the "occult"... they've blocked hotmail and try and force people to use the shitty school email system (so they can monitor our mail), I couldn't research the KKK for part of a history project and we can't use any image search engines...

[Fidel Follower]

:P Dont even get me started on filters....

I have to say today was great! Me and my friend TheComrade had an own clothes day (you get to wear your own clothes insted of uniform) at school and he brought in his comunist flag, and we went around school waving it! fan-bloody-tastic!

We got abit of abouse but nothing major! TheComrade had his Russian Commie hat! Which ive orderd but hasnt come yet!

Anyway we need to stay on the subject of propaganer*cant spell*
ThComrade has some good posters which seem to be rather good, hopefully if he looks at this site more than he says he does he will be able to scan and post!

So keep it real, and RED until the next post good day comrades!

[John Dory]

I'm a senior in high school :hammer:

[Fidel Follower]

:blink: Nice but im English so i dont know how old that is? Im in y10, but i bet you dont know what that is either?

What group are you in? Commie, Anarchist ? When you answer that you might be intersested in helping our highschool/any school movement?

:hammer:

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

God don't get me started on school filters. Recently, I had my internet access removed and got a 2 hour detention for going on this site! My crime was 'going on left-wing sites with inapproprieate content'.

Thing is, I've done research into all the small print of the school rules and also the European Convention of Human Rights. If they put me in detention for that, they will be in direct violation of several articles. I'm just writing the letter to my head of year to ask for an apology. God, I wish I could see the look on his face when he receives it. :D

[TheComrade]

Haha!! Go Comrade Yastrebkov!

Fidel Follower is correct in saying school was much fun today! I had a Soviet Union flag (questionable communism but anyway!) waved it alot - history teacher even let me hang it from a cupboard! My brilliant english teacher also allowed me to stick it up but when it fell down he said (funny!) "Thats a bit symbolic!" *nervous silence* well anyway - I have posters, PM me, anyone, and I will send you them...

[Creature]

All you need to know in highschool is local laws and rights, interntional human rights, and one more but I forgot what it was... To get out of most punsihment for doing what you want in school.

Micahel Moore once got out of a day of school because where he lived there was a law that, 'The princepal was not allowed to deny students to go to the county fair if they requested.'. Not to mention he ran on the school council at 18 and fired the school princepal. He got voted in because all the adults split their vote, and he got every stoner in school to vote for him.

Just remember, know your rights, even if they are dictated by the state, and present your argument resonably to who ever is concerened. The second you get mad and irational, that's when they get you. Just stay calm, listen carefully and think quick.

Also, give us a copy fo that letter when your done!

[CCJ]

I agree with Creature: the key to success is twofold: 1) knowing what one is talking about 2) being aware of all of the laws and using them to one's advantage.

[TheComrade]

Yes, if you just start shouting, ranting and spitting words everywhere not only will they laugh at you but it puts you in the wrong and them in the right - you are all intelligent and know this already though!

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

For flags, I've got the Vietnam one... it's so simple it's beautiful... again, questionable Communism though especially at present...

I had an own clothes day as well yesterday, I wore a 3 piece pinstripe suit with a red star/hammer and sickle pin in the button hole... most loved it and I got a few orders for some, highlight was argueing with the deputy head (cappie bastard) who was trying to imply I was a Stalinist...

[vladimirm]

16 adn am in high school in my final year. My history teacher shh's me and kicks me out of the room whenever we start doing anythign remotely comminust, my ict teahers taken to calling me stalin, my geography teacher calls me trotsky, and from the most ignorant i get "communisms crap, your only doing it to make friends" and from teh misinformed i either have to explain what communism is or try to erase 16 years of propaganda. My history book has been "vandalised" from the bolesheviks rise to power to the end of the cold war

[TheComrade]

Ha! There are three types of response to a Communist motion (for example flag bearing)
1. "YEAHHH!!! COMMUNISM! COMMUNISM! COMMUNISM!"
2. "Whats Communism? Why are you waving that around?!"
3. "F**cking COMMIE! DIE!! *followed by an assault from an angry mob*"

I experienced all three responses - obviously no 1 is the best - number 2 is a chance to explain and convert someone - no. 3 is bad but get fobbed off by other people.

[Fidel Follower]

Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2005, 11:19 PM


Fidel Follower is correct in saying school was much fun today! I had a Soviet Union flag (questionable communism but anyway!) waved it alot
WHAT! It most defanatly stood for commies! But it was fun, and this little "Fascist" comes up to me and says Britian will rule the Earth! OMFG he ws soo funnnyyy, and small.
i just got all my lose change and threw it at thim and said, "if you like money you capitalist have this" it was only about 40p but it was funny, shame non of it hit him,, ohhh welll we can dream....

:hammer: Okay for every who is bothered my Russian soviet hat is coming on tuesday! Hurray! :cuba: :castro:

[TheComrade]

Hurray! I say questionable communism because the Soviet Union wasn't a communist state - I know there are many who will agree with me! It did not hold true to the Marxist principles!

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2005, 11:49 AM
"communisms crap, your only doing it to make friends"


If anything being a commie in highschool makes it harder to get friends... unless you're unvowedly popular anyway...

My deputy head calls me "the peoples hero"

[Fidel Follower]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2005, 09:19 PM
My deputy head calls me "the peoples hero"
:o WOW you must be good if you are compared to the people's hero Che Guevara!!!! :P

[Hegemonicretribution]

I think you have all realised a valuable lesson, shouting "I am a commie" achieves fuck all, and will in fact turn people off.

If your ideal is held true, and is not just a desire to belong to some clique, then why do you need to declare what you are? When you and someone else talk about communism they are talking about two totally different things. It doesn't matter how much you tell them that isn't communism, they have heard it many more times, from people they see at sources of knowledge, and will disregard much of what you say.

If you want to talk to them about the same thing, talk about what you stand for. I hope this isn't soviet t-shirts, or commie hats, but something more substantial. Talk about specific things that you do or belief in, and I don't just mean a magical revolution, rather aspects about equality of gender, sex, and age. Age equality will appeal more to those in high school, my best advice is to tell them what you are actually for.

Why do you rely on symobols of failed state capitalism? A soviet flag has connnotations much removed from the image I believe you want to create. If I was you I would not introduce a specific title to your beliefs, until people have a truer picture of what you mean. By doing so you are alienating your self, and again this goes back to the original question of why you feel the need to tell people.

[TheComrade]

I do agree with you Hegemonicretribution - it's just an immature bit of fun! The organisation that many of us a talking about setting up sounds allot more reasonable - more exciting and more about discussion and debate rather than just ranting against Capitalism.

I just need to grow up, don't I?

[Hegemonicretribution]

Sorry, I read back, and I did sound a bit aggressve there. I was similar, although I seldom used the term communist, except in response to an incorrect definition of a teacher when I was at school.

There is nothing wrong with being passionate about your beliefs, and some of the fire does go after a while, but it will likely be replaced with reasoning and information, you make decisions of with your head.

Growing up implies that there is a suerior state you wish to aspire to, it isn't that as such, but deeper understanding of yourself, your opposition and aplication of your ideals is something we are all constantly learning about.

The group does sound like a better idea, I was talking to AAA about it recently. However getting yourself a certain reputation now (by wavng flags etc) will not necessarily be benificial if your group does take off. Especially groups held within school.

[vladimirm]

i disagree, i believe that a show of numbers is neccersary, if a couple of hundred communsits just went marching through london fo ra day it'd scare them all shitless. We need a wake up call, all teh communist parties are sittgin around saying how wrong the world is and refinging their ideologies what we need is an acitve party; somethign that shows that communism isnt a failed idea of the 19th century and that we havent failed just because the soviet union did

[Hegemonicretribution]

You go marching and it won't make a difference. We do not yet have the majority support of the proletariat, something which will be very hand when we come to seize the means of production.

Shouting communist first and then talking will have one effect: people will turn off to you, any connotations will be negative, decietful and wrong.

Shout what you are actually about first, the good side, and then if the time is right place a title upon it. Personally I seldom use the term communism, I use it to sommunicate with leftists only, because in bourgeois language it has a very powerful, but different meaning. If we want to reclaim the title, the way I have highlighted is the only one.

Why are you bothered about a term describing a hypothetical society? It has never happened, and the association is that which has been attributed to in our material condition.

The reason there is innactivity is because there is no consensus. That, and the fact that change will come when the material conditions are right, they probably aren't there quite yet.

The results we have had when conditions were not right have not been good, whether or not they were even attempts is debatable.

Communism has come to mean the failed ideal of the 19th century. Fuck a battle over language, keep the ideas alive, the word isn't as important, ressurect it later.

[against all authority]

"Shout what you are actually about first, the good side, and then if the time is right place a title upon it"

also give the negatives and consequences of capitalism. for some reason, people seem to be sympathetic to the symptoms of poverty in 3rd world countries, but are reluctant to accept that the cause is partially capitalism and our governments.

[bunk]

Here's a good website

http://www.getfreedropout.tk/

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by against all [email protected] 21 2005, 03:28 PM
also give the negatives and consequences of capitalism. for some reason, people seem to be sympathetic to the symptoms of poverty in 3rd world countries, but are reluctant to accept that the cause is partially capitalism and our governments.
This is very important, you must make it clear why you oppose what we have even though we are "lucky." The only other side of debate you have to learn is against real capitalists, not Americanists or other advocaters of mixed economies, but real capitalists.

Capitalism, as defined by the capitalists themselves, is not really faesible with government (at least of any size) much like communism. Arguments about America with these guys is much like arguments about the USSR, or the DPRK with us, they simply don't apply to what they are talking about.

The system they propose is by some called anarcho-capitalism, and they advocate complete "freedom." Whilst some of the views on the abolishment of government are fairly similar, they think the world should be ruled by the laws of supply and demand. Essentially they seem to think that prevention of private property rights, is legalism and you cannot be free. What they often do not understand is that we aren't necessarily in the business of preventing property rights, rather abolishing the very concept of property itself.

You may think initially there system sounds preferable, however the property rights (the only ones, when they agree there should be law, that should be protected by law) are not compatible. Essentially it is through ownership of property that classes, in this instance, arise.

Removing property from the equation is what Marxism is about, this is one of the only ways that complete freedom can be realised without the re-emergence of newer classes, just like what has happened so far.

I bring this up for two reasons, first of all a capitalist that actually knows what he stands for will know this shit, and if you mention a capitalist governmenty he will call it a contradiction in terms. It is benificial to know that there actual belief exists outside of labels, yet is itself flawed.

The second reason is that through knowing one system you better get to know your own. You can not best describe true communism (in my oppinion) with out touching upon true capitalism. This is why I personally (although not many do) actively encourage people to read a lot of different ideologies. Seeing a weakness is as benificial as seeing a strength and this is how we truly understand what we stand for.

Sorry about the length of the post, this is a very brief description and lacking a lot of detail, but there are more for and against arguments applicable here.

Oh one last thing, and this is a technicality, you weren't wrong to call our current system capitalism, Marx coined the term in the first place, and many of his observations are still true today. The term just takes on a different meaning when used by these people. (just like communism does when it is used in school or on the news)

[Fidel Follower]

So if there is any people left who started the posters and leaflets debate, i need information!

What have people come up with, has any one talked tho their head of year and so on.....

We need to keep this subject active or it will fail like most communist revolutions....im sad to say it but lets keep discusing our ideas... Thanks again!
:hammer:

[Fidel Follower]

And Hegemonicretribution i hear your point! You Speak real truth!

And communism really is PERFECT! :hammer:

[Hasta la Victoria siempre]

yeah...i'm 16 and i there are only a few in my school...
but a lot of people are accepting of the fact...they aren't against it or nething
except whenever i walk into class...this one kid goes "commi commi commi commi" to me..but its all good. i enjoy being different.
i embrace it.

[Punk Rocker]

The other goths/punks at my school are pretty much all leftists too, I'm the most devoted one though.

Don't take this the wrong way, but all communists in this society should be goths and punks I think, because conformity is the backbone of capitalism, the whole point of conformity is too make it easier to market shit to you. Since rebellion is the essence of communism, it makes no sense to be a communist and a conformist.

[ScottishSocialist13]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 21 2005, 09:49 PM
The other goths/punks at my school are pretty much all leftists too, I'm the most devoted one though.

Don't take this the wrong way, but all communists in this society should be goths and punks I think, because conformity is the backbone of capitalism, the whole point of conformity is too make it easier to market shit to you. Since rebellion is the essence of communism, it makes no sense to be a communist and a conformist.
i disagree. i would not change the way i dress or behave because of my beliefs. i doubt that anywone who looks at a goth thinks, "oh they must be lefties". People say that goths and punks stand out from the crowd, thats incorrect. Goths and punks are a crowd in themselves, hardly a minority in most cities nowadays. What is the difference between the "goth" crowd and the "conformist" crowd? In essence the goths all conform with a certain style.

[Noah]

I agree with ScottishSocialist13 I know many punkie/goths in my school and alot of them are against communism because of N. Korea and the USSR. They thinks 'as long as they called themself communist they are!'

I don't change the way I dress because of my leftist beliefs! I used to be quite grungy though!

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 21 2005, 09:49 PM
Don't take this the wrong way, but all communists in this society should be goths and punks I think, because conformity is the backbone of capitalism, the whole point of conformity is too make it easier to market shit to you. Since rebellion is the essence of communism, it makes no sense to be a communist and a conformist.
That is replacing one form of conformity with another. Absolute subscription to any group's ideas is conformity and I do see what this can achieve. One of the things the left does have going for it is that it is not a unified movement. This begs questions about effectiveness, however it does mean that a complete put down of dissenters is impossible.

The only thing the left comprises of is diversity. Such fashions are picked up, and regurgitated by the MTV generation. When everything becomes about who is "genuine" in these groups the initiall ideal has all but disappeared. A group shouldn't exist so that you can try your hardest to fit into it, you should (if you so choose) only truly become a part of groups you fit into whether or not you see yourself as already a member.

Yes it would be good to hear what progress you guys have made. Has anyone started a group yet? Or decided on a particular goal to pursue? If there is someone with a particular interest in law I would also recommend finding out exactly what rights you have in school, because essentially you can get yourself out of a lot of shit (and others into it).

[Fidel Follower]

Well as regards to propagander ThComrade has some good posters which i think he should share with his new found comunity! :D

I am also going to talk to my head of year, to see what i can/cant do. But it is really hard to go around giving out leaftets and posters, mainly the mocking and shouting, and also i have quite a few "bullys" on my head, but lets not talk about that....

So if any one has any good posters ect post em' up, or send them by PM
:hammer: Cheers

[Gura]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 21 2005, 09:49 PM
Don't take this the wrong way, but all communists in this society should be goths and punks I think, because conformity is the backbone of capitalism, the whole point of conformity is too make it easier to market shit to you. Since rebellion is the essence of communism, it makes no sense to be a communist and a conformist.
Communists (or socialists, anacrachist, etc - whatever you are) are not (or should not be) defined by their style of dress, but by their actions, words, and beliefs.

It makes no sense to wear a style of clothing because it's "non-conformist".

[rossith]

Thecomrade does have some good posters and i agree that they should be shared with this new community. Noah, Jacob and I have been granted permission in our school to start a 'political society'. We are able to use the school facilities for producing posters and other things...well at least until they find out the ideas printed on the leaflets themselves...

[against all authority]

i thought i told you the initial purpose of this website/school committee thing Hegemonicretribution ?

basically, its to give the people who are interested in leftism and getting involved an alternative source of media, so they can read and learn about different ideologies and other aspects (which we'll try to make as none bias as possible) so they then have the opportunity to form their own opinions and theories. because, as it is now, the education system is merely for setting us up for our role later in society and the economy, therefore we are taught from a middle class perspective, which is not suited to everyone.so this committee thing is basically to give students the information that mainstream education isnt. plus if we organise it well enough and actually run it as a national group via schools, we will start to form a name and get noticed.

[against all authority]

oh yeah, www.topplebush.com has some really good flyers :)

[Wanted Man]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 21 2005, 09:49 PM
The other goths/punks at my school are pretty much all leftists too, I'm the most devoted one though.
I know of many occasions where "goths" or "punks" and the like are usually apolitical, or submit to some kind of reformism, social-democracy or liberalism. Just because you know some commie goths, doesn't mean all communists should be goths or punks.


Don't take this the wrong way, but all communists in this society should be goths and punks I think, because conformity is the backbone of capitalism, the whole point of conformity is too make it easier to market shit to you. Since rebellion is the essence of communism, it makes no sense to be a communist and a conformist.
How is not having several piercings, sporting a mohawk, wearing black tear makeup and dressing in big black dresses conformist? Conformist to what, exactly? Remember, revolution comes from the masses. Not a bunch of uppity middle-class "alternative" teenagers who think they're rebelling against the system. People like that, with their hatred of anything that is not like them(which is supposedly "conformist", don't make me laugh), become communists to stand out, to be different, so they do it out of hatred of the people, not love. Most will eventually either abandon communism for more efficient ways to hate the state, or they will educate themselves and learn more about it.

[Hegemonicretribution]

AAA, yer you told me about it, I was asking about direct action prospects though, I wasn't sure f you were going to go down that line. I realise you weren't initially, I was just wondering if it was part of the larger plan.

If you are interested in criticisms of schooling as a system and as a concept have a search through Rousseau, but also Ivan Illich "De-schooling society" There s also a thread which was stickied in practice I think :blink: ? About withdrawal from such a system, which is if nothing else worth a look. Definately get your hands on Illich though, ask the sociology tutor, they should be able to help you.

[Punk Rocker]

How is not having several piercings, sporting a mohawk, wearing black tear makeup and dressing in big black dresses conformist? Conformist to what, exactly? Remember, revolution comes from the masses. Not a bunch of uppity middle-class "alternative" teenagers who think they're rebelling against the system. People like that, with their hatred of anything that is not like them(which is supposedly "conformist", don't make me laugh), become communists to stand out, to be different, so they do it out of hatred of the people, not love. Most will eventually either abandon communism for more efficient ways to hate the state, or they will educate themselves and learn more about it.

Conformist to what? Conformist to capitalism!

Looks like you're a year old than me and you live in the Netherlands. And you're telling me I'm not a revolutionary because I'm a "middle class kid".

"Uppity", my ass. You don't know shit about punk or goth culture and ideas. We are not "uppity", we rebel against capitalist society, we rebel against the capitalist kids like you with big plastic smiles and bright polo and abercrombie that think they're better than everyone else because of the things they own. They don't give a shit if people are being killed and starved to death by imperialism, let alone what imperialism is.

We fight capitalism with every breath we take, with our clothes and our music, our words and our actions. The revolution is our lives, each of us is a revolution. People like you have never really rebelled against capitalism except from in front of your computer.

Stop saying punks and goths are apolitical. You probably have never even gotten to know a punk or a goth, so don't judge us from capitalist stereotypes. If you would actually listen to our music and talk to us you'd see we do love the revolution and we're very passionate about it, and with our whole lives.

Fuck, have you even heard of Rage Against the Machine? Suicide Machines? The Sex Pistols? Anti-Flag? All communist and anarchist.

"It's right to rebel" -Mao

[CCJ]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 24 2005, 03:26 AM
Stop saying punks and goths are apolitical. You probably have never even gotten to know a punk or a goth, so don't judge us from capitalist stereotypes. If you would actually listen to our music and talk to us you'd see we do love the revolution and we're very passionate about it, and with our whole lives.

Fuck, have you even heard of Rage Against the Machine? Suicide Machines? The Sex Pistols? Anti-Flag? All communist and anarchist.
Actually, Anti-Flag is more libertarian socialist than anarchist, per se, but yea. Other than that I completely agree.

[against all authority]

being a punk myself, i like to wear clothes which reflect my views because it provokes questions and queries from onlookers, which provides me with the opportunity to explain. i personally dont believe that i am conforming to any subculture, its my personal taste. and Matthijs, so fucking what if some leftists were born middle class, it wasnt their fault, im pretty much certain that ur of middle class origins, doesnt make them anyless leftist than anyone else. in my opinion( remember equality?), leftists need to disregard differences among other leftists and respect their own personal taste and ideals. if leftism is ever going to take off in a major way, the leftists need to stick together and support eachother, not critisise and patrionise.

[Wanted Man]

Originally posted by Punk Rocker+Nov 24 2005, 03:26 AM--> (Punk Rocker @ Nov 24 2005, 03:26 AM) Conformist to what? Conformist to capitalism!" [/b]
Why? If you buy clothes in some "alternative" shop, you're still supporting capitalism. Was that studded belt made by child labour in Asia? Who knows... Just because it looks alternative, doesn't mean that it's clean.


"Uppity", my ass. You don't know shit about punk or goth culture and ideas. We are not "uppity", we rebel against capitalist society
What are you currently doing for the communist movement? You don't have to tell me, I'll freely admit that I could be a lot more dedicated to the cause... and that's where we are different! You keep saying that you and your little punk friends are "rebelling" by not looking like some other generic label(because that's what this all boils down to), whereas I do not speak of things that I never actually achieved.


we rebel against the capitalist kids like you with big plastic smiles and bright polo and abercrombie that think they're better than everyone else because of the things they own. They don't give a shit if people are being killed and starved to death by imperialism, let alone what imperialism is.
From my post, you have deduced that I am capitalist, walk around with a "big plastic smile", wear bright polos and Abercrombie, and that I'm not anti-imperialist? Good job, master detective. Because I disagree with your fake-ass little "rebellion", I MUST be wearing Abercrombie and a fake smile. :rolleyes: Oh, and of course my disagreement with you MUST mean that I shit on the exploited masses. :rolleyes:


We fight capitalism with every breath we take, with our clothes
Bought and produced in a capitalist and probably imperialist manner...


and our music
Maybe. I have no idea what you listen to, but I'll take your word on it if you say you don't listen to generic, pre-produced emo crap.


our words and our actions.
What words? "Everyone who is not a punk or a goth cannot be a (good) communist". Brilliant analysis, you should become a philosopher. Gee, judging people because they refuse to stamp your little label on their foreheads, who would have ever thought of that? :rolleyes:


The revolution is our lives, each of us is a revolution. People like you have never really rebelled against capitalism except from in front of your computer.
More baseless assumptions. How would you know, kid? For all you know, I could have always been at the forefront of every fight against capitalism and become a known revolutionary activist. I'm not saying this is the case(not at all), but if it had been, you would have looked like even more than a fool then you do now by making these assumptions.


Stop saying punks and goths are apolitical. You probably have never even gotten to know a punk or a goth, so don't judge us from capitalist stereotypes. If you would actually listen to our music and talk to us you'd see we do love the revolution and we're very passionate about it, and with our whole lives.
Got a problem with reading, kid? I'll try again:


I know of many occasions where "goths" or "punks" and the like are usually apolitical, or submit to some kind of reformism, social-democracy or liberalism. Just because you know some commie goths, doesn't mean all communists should be goths or punks.
Perhaps the goths and punks over here differ from where you live, but I've known a few goths, and only one of them became communist, and that is because I introduced them to it. Every other goth I know is apolitical, as are 75% or so of the punks that I know(who do love wearing circled A's and Che Guevara for some funny reason), with the other 25, as I said, adhering to reformism. If a great majority of the punks and goths in your area are communist, good for you. Go get a cookie. It doesn't mean that all communists should bear your silly little label.

By the way, putting "no offence meant" in front of a highly offensive statement, doesn't render you incapable of offending people. And I find the statement that I am less of a communist because I'm neither a punk nor a goth extremely offensive. If I had simply said that I am neither of those, you would already have thought less of me, which is extremely prejudice. And prejudice might come in handy in political movements far to our right, but a prejudiced communist(with a prejudice against people who don't subscribe to the same subculture, of all groups one can be prejudiced against!) is ridiculous.


Fuck, have you even heard of Rage Against the Machine? Suicide Machines? The Sex Pistols? Anti-Flag? All communist and anarchist.
I've heard Rage Against the Machine. I didn't like it. If you enjoy the music, all the more power to you, but again, just because somebody doesn't like the music, doesn't make them lesser communists. The Sex Pistols, I've heard some songs by them, I quite liked it. Never heard Anti-Flag, but a comrade of mine listens to them.

By the way, I love how throughout your latest posts here, you have been trying to slap labels on both yourself(goth/punk) and me(supposedly a preppy Abercrombie wearer). You are aware that these pathetic labels are just another way for the bourgeoisie to divide those people who are the greatest threat to their power(youngsters), right? By slapping around labels, you're arguing from a pro-capitalist point of view.


It's right to rebel" -Mao
Against EVERY kind of capitalism and imperialism. Capitalism that tries to divide the rebelling youths by their clothes or their preferred music, is still capitalism.


other guy
being a punk myself, i like to wear clothes which reflect my views because it provokes questions and queries from onlookers, which provides me with the opportunity to explain.
Fair enough. Still, how is this a reason to criticise those who also wear clothes that reflect their views, but are simply not punks or goths.


i personally dont believe that i am conforming to any subculture, its my personal taste.
More power to you.


and Matthijs, so fucking what if some leftists were born middle class, it wasnt their fault
Indeed, but it IS their fault when they continue to argue in favour of the means used by the bourgeoisie to divide the rebelling youth.


im pretty much certain that ur of middle class origins
False.


doesnt make them anyless leftist than anyone else. in my opinion( remember equality?), leftists need to disregard differences among other leftists and respect their own personal taste and ideals. if leftism is ever going to take off in a major way, the leftists need to stick together and support eachother, not critisise and patrionise.
I agree. But surely you also disagree with saying that people who are neither punk nor gothic are lesser commies or not commies at all? My problem with Punk Rocker is not his background, but the background that he is arguing from.

[Hegemonicretribution]

Conformist to what? Conformist to capitalism!
By failure to subscribe to a new class ideal? Sorry I can't agree with this, I think I know what you are trying to say, bu I am afraid if you are talking about generalised groups, then the only way you could contrast one with those that stem from class antagonisms, is if it itself is solely acreditted of being true to a revolutionary cause.

This is something that does not exist within the left, it is comprised of people (in varying degree) from all backgrounds, and there is no one background which is solely comprised of revolutionary thought. Fascism's original nazis were closer to this than the left has ever been (although they too are also largely a counter-culture fad). The example of fascism is nothing to go by, the left itself stands, f for anything, for diversity. No one group can be synonomus with such a movement.

I will skip the flames, and really guys you should all keep this polite :D playing the class card is a pile of crap and we know it. We are for the abolition of classes, and if someone that benifits from their class background desires the same, then power to them.


Stop saying punks and goths are apolitical. You probably have never even gotten to know a punk or a goth, so don't judge us from capitalist stereotypes.
Punks and goths are not unified movements. They are definitely not apolitical, within the structure of these movements there is often a very political motive. I remember the label of "wannabe" and it really doesn't help. This again suggests that there is something definite that allows entry into one of these groups, this is not the case. The capitalist stereotypes have become an integral part of both movements, you may claim that people are not true to the movement because of one aspect, but they may also claim the same of you. If you study the rise of any of these groups there has been a common factor, and that is two way growth. The MTV generation feed from counter-culture fashions, ideals and practices, and the movement grows on how new members respond to both the original ideas and the media representation. It is often hard to strictly differentiate, and attempts to do so have proved counter productive.


If you would actually listen to our music and talk to us you'd see we do love the revolution and we're very passionate about it, and with our whole lives.
The music ascribed to these movements is highly debatable, whether or not you accept anything mainstream at all, or only mainstream bands that contradict their own existence doesn't matter, not all the music is representitive of a particular ideology.


Fuck, have you even heard of Rage Against the Machine? Suicide Machines? The Sex Pistols? Anti-Flag? All communist and anarchist.
Well I wouldn't say communist or anarchist, but they have tendencies towards liberalism and in some occassions left wing economics. Although some definitive gothic or punk groups have an inverse effect, largely this sentiment is based on the conflict philosophy of the youth generation. Sentiments of conformity usually kick in, in later life as a result of pesimism regarding change, some guys that were once true are now republican.

These sentiments in musc are not unique to gothic or punk music. Dead Prez are more obviously socialist in leanings than many of the groups you mentioned, although they exist in a genre which is traditionally the most endorsing of the capitalist system.


"It's right to rebel" -Mao
Pretty rich coming from Mao :P

[Punk Rocker]

Matthijs and Hege you arguments are fair enough.

Matthijs it wasn't fair for me to say you're a prep, obviously you're not or you wouldn't be here.

I still think you're being too prejudicial about punks and goths, but as long as you realize that we're still comrades even though I'm a punk and you're not, it's all cool.

Out of curiosity though, since you say punk styles are capitalist, how do you dress?

[Wanted Man]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 24 2005, 07:59 PM
Matthijs it wasn't fair for me to say you're a prep, obviously you're not or you wouldn't be here.

I still think you're being too prejudicial about punks and goths, but as long as you realize that we're still comrades even though I'm a punk and you're not, it's all cool.

Out of curiosity though, since you say punk styles are capitalist, how do you dress?
It's fair of you to say that, comrade, I could probably have made less generalising or at least less confusing comments on punks and goths, as well as class backgrounds, I agree that to somebody who reads quickly. I did not intend to say that punks and goths in general tend to be apolitical or reformist, nor am I of the opinion that those with a non-working class background are lesser comrades.

As for your inquiry about my dress, I don't necessarily consider all punk styles capitalist, I was rather referring simply to the way these clothes are made and sold, which is no different from clothes other people usually wear. As for me, I usually just wear jeans and a shirt of some band that I like(you have your Sex Pistols and Anti-Flag, I'm more into metal) or some shirt of Che(I've also got this one shirt of Ho Chi Minh, and one of Mao, they're both quite awesome).

[against all authority]

Matthijs, of course i agree that punk or gothic leftists shouldnt be held higher in regard than any other leftist. hence me writing the last part of my last post. but i personally believe that clothes and image are not as important to leftism as beliefs. if we leftists have the same ideals and beliefs (more or less) then there should be absolutely no difference in the way they are treated or regarded.

[Hegemonicretribution]

Punk Rocker, I agree with the others, it doesn't really matter how you dress. Dressing to controversy is fine, but when you start doing it just to get a reaction you have to have a look at yourself. Wear what you want, who is cooler the goth who is not dressing like a preppy prick, or someone who is not a preppy prick, but dresses as one no matter what the goth says.

I used to wear much stranger clothing than I do now, and whilst I have no roblem dressing however I want (I have more than proved my point before) I tend to dress smart casual to smart at most times. The only tye of clothing I would really avoid are those synonomus with child labour, sportswear with big slogans. The left doesn't need piercings and hair as such, but it could definately do without walking bill boards.

[Punk Rocker]

As for me, I usually just wear jeans and a shirt of some band that I like(you have your Sex Pistols and Anti-Flag, I'm more into metal) or some shirt of Che(I've also got this one shirt of Ho Chi Minh, and one of Mao, they're both quite awesome).

Actually I'd consider that punk.

I always wear dark jeans and a black shirt. I have a lot of band shirts and shirts of Che, Mao, and Lenin (with a hammer and sickle). I also like to wear studded things (bracelets, belts) and I used to have this crazy spiky hair but it's too long to spike now so I just started letting it hang a month or so ago. Again not that I'm saying all revolutionaries should dress like me, it's just my taste.

I love punk but metal kicks ass too, Breaking Benjamin is my favorite. I know Story of the Year used to be emo but their new album is metal and I'm into them now. Godsmack, System of a Down, and Nine Inch Nails are all up there too. Check out the Getting Away With Murder video in my sig, it's Papa Roach. Cool shit.


Punk Rocker, I agree with the others, it doesn't really matter how you dress. Dressing to controversy is fine, but when you start doing it just to get a reaction you have to have a look at yourself.

I just dress to my taste, I'm not conforming to anything. On the other hand most preps just follow the herd and dress to what is popular. This is an easy way for corporations to make money. If there was no conformity, and corporations had to sell to each person's individual tastes, the free market would fall. That's why I think confomirty is the backbone of capitalism.

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by Punk [email protected] 26 2005, 04:41 AM
I just dress to my taste, I'm not conforming to anything. On the other hand most preps just follow the herd and dress to what is popular. This is an easy way for corporations to make money. If there was no conformity, and corporations had to sell to each person's individual tastes, the free market would fall. That's why I think confomirty is the backbone of capitalism.
If people just withdrew their labour the market would collasse, but they don't because of their economic compulsion. That is that they want to feed, clothe and shelther themselves and their families.

For this reason not everyone will refuse to buy what is available, if the alternative is nudity. All fashion, and it has existed within most sub-cultures as well, is the desire for similarity to some extent. It would be very difficult to concieve 5billion different styles, and impossible to make them. Firstly everyone would have to make thier own which is not comatable with those living out side of primitivist existence, and secondly because similarities would be drawn between the new styles. They might be groued by colour, material, bagginess who knows.

Also, whilst a completely individual approach to fashion, negating comulsion may well affect a caitalist market, it would also affect any post-industrial mass production.

This is a bit of a pet theory of mine, but one of the reasons communism is more sustainable economically than caitalism is because of economies of scale. You may well have come accross Adam Smith's example of a pin, and how specialisation of labour creates proportionately many more pins than if people focussed on the task as a whole.

The problem with this however is that under caitalism there is only rofit incentive for employment, and structural unemployment would be common when whole industries follwed the laws of economics and fuck off, leaving thousands of over specialised workers with no job. Even under socialism this is not a factor. This also more than accounts for the supposed problems of incentive if you can't be arsed arguing a purely hypothetical line.

[Fidel Follower]

Hummm we have gone on to a totally diffrent subject how about starting a new thred?
This is for people who are at high school and what help or to talk about it , i know i sound abit snobish but this really matters to me :hammer:

[against all authority]

yeah lol,

well ive sweetened up my school to the idea. all we need now is a list of participating schools and the representatives from each, and get the site organised. this could be big if we play it right :hammer:

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

perhaps all the people involved on here could arrange a time when they're all on messenger so details can be sorted.. ja?

[Jacob]

has anyone made a list of participating schools and the representatives?

I know Noah was doing something...

[Jacob]

perhaps all the people involved on here could arrange a time when they're all on messenger so details can be sorted.. ja?

sounds good to me. PM personal [hotmail] addresses?

[Fidel Follower]

:D Okays I am on around 5'oclock most days, if corsework allows! I really need TheComrade to tell me what the situation is becasue he has posters and i think it would be better if more than one of us asked if we can start a group ans shit like that... so if your listening then talk!

Umm i think thats all comrades?....i must go to do niht graffiting now :ph34r: :hammer:

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

About making a list of schools and participants, lets make one on this topic. Don't give your name out for obvious reasons, but the name of your school and it's location (roughly). Then we can map it and see how our network can be built up, and generally see how many people we can get involved in this.

I'll start

I'm yr 11 at Howard of Effingham school in Effingham, Surrey.

[Jacob]

I'm in Y11 at Trinity CE High School [very close to the MCR University] in Manchester

[rossith]

im the same as jacob

[Noah]

I recommend you DO NOT do that, people (facists) can still track you down through your username and find out your real name quiet easily and come to your school.

But yeh... Same as Rossith and Jacob.

[Comrade Yastrebkov]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2005, 10:21 PM
I recommend you DO NOT do that, people (facists) can still track you down through your username and find out your real name quiet easily and come to your school.

But yeh... Same as Rossith and Jacob.
Lol, at least you didnt just contradict yourself there. I think its safe, theres only a very low chance of that sort of thing happening. But if ppl are uncertain, we can use PM instead.

[TheComrade]

Fidel Follower - I will speak to thou at school (if it ever opens again - 'boiler broken')

Anyone who actually wishes to see these posters - PM me (but don't sell them and make tons of money without giving me any!!)

[against all authority]

Breif explanation of the COA.. firstly, me and noah are hoping to set up a separate forum where a few admin users will be established so that all users can securely send their school and contact details via PM to us. then we will store then on a database. then, construct an informative webiste which can be endorsed by our schools for 'educational alternative media'. then we just have to issue leaflets, put ad's in school newsletters etc. and exploit the schools resources to do so :P

[enigma2517]

but i personally believe that clothes and image are not as important to leftism as beliefs. if we leftists have the same ideals and beliefs (more or less) then there should be absolutely no difference in the way they are treated or regarded.

Verryyy true.


I just dress to my taste, I'm not conforming to anything. On the other hand most preps just follow the herd and dress to what is popular. This is an easy way for corporations to make money. If there was no conformity, and corporations had to sell to each person's individual tastes, the free market would fall. That's why I think confomirty is the backbone of capitalism.

Verrryy.....not true.

Sorry dude.

I don't have anything against you dressing in a different way. Honestly. The part that irks me is that this is considered "revolutionary". Sorry, it's not.

In fact, I think lifestylism like that is what makes anarchists look ridiculous and retards the actual social movement. The statement you made, while not completely unreasonable, its pretty amaterialist. I suggest you learn a little bit more about class anatagonisms and the way capitalism functions.

Class consciousness is paramount to all. A very restrained form of "boycotting" isn't going to do the trick. Plus the market clapses on its on own :) haha

[Hegemonicretribution]

First of all guys it is great you are getting things sorted, do you have a target date yet? For first getting on line, or will that be on hold for a while?

Secondly (maybe we should get this split, or start a new thread), it is conceivable that boycotts can help raise class consciousness. "Capitalism carried within itself the seeds of its own destruction"- This is reffering to the proletariat largely, and this is only really applicable after class conscience is established. Are small time boycotts, and lifsyling "revolutionary" not really, but if everyone did it at once it would be. That is the whole point, it might not mean a lot now, but it can create itself as something growing, and the importance of it grows to.

[redchrisfalling]

Yah im still in high school, it sucks. My town is about 2000 people and the electorate vote 92% conservative so you can guess how much fun i have in school. I have found a fellow lefty in resent months though which has made it more bareable. Unfourtunatly he is a pesamistic commie border line redneck and i am a optamistic enviromental anarchist, so we find ourselves argueing whenever there is no common enemy.

[unite2fight1984]

High School Senior Anarchist with desires to be a history teacher. My views have developed from a sucession of very-liberal teachers in the field of Social Studies. 8 different teachers in 9 different courses have left me with some broad views of the world. I disgust many classmates because at my school only one year of social studies is required, Im graduating with 7 years worth (a school record)

[Fidel Follower]

Hummm TheComrade talk to me!!! Ive seen you at skewl and ive heard NADA!
Any way i will PM my skewl, i think TheComrade is a little touchy about saying out loud. :P

So please feel free to ask, the database seems a real good idea..so lets not let this burn out...Keep it red guys, and girls..:hammer:

[FidelCastro]

Kids in my class are idiots who associate communism with fascism. They yell because I make generalizing statements cause they're perfectionizing pricks (just a few really) they know what I mean, the teacher is a ***** too. From personal experiance, I have found that females suck at teaching history. My old history teacher named Mr. Fowler was a fucking genius and my other old history teacher named Mr. Stone was pretty damn good too. My new one named Mrs Gardner can't teach for shit and had the nerve to tell my parents I was smug. Fucking *****, all she does is make us watch movies and read a shitty text book.

[commie anarchist rebel]

Im the only anarcho-communist in my school i kno of 1 other anarchist but hes the kind that gives us a bad name i was just wondering if i could get a few tips on bringing students and teachers over to my side rather than have them make asumtions about communism

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by commie anarchist [email protected] 21 2005, 02:25 AM
Im the only anarcho-communist in my school i kno of 1 other anarchist but hes the kind that gives us a bad name i was just wondering if i could get a few tips on bringing students and teachers over to my side rather than have them make asumtions about communism
It is simle, most people agree that communism is a "nice idea" but just doubt whether or not it is plausible. To be honest I always exlain beliefs without using a term that has broad implications, or definite negative connotations in this instance.

If you can assume a metered debate with either a friend or teaching, minus pseudo-intellectual bullshit terminology then you would most likely focus on what you agree on, rather than starting a debate with a big argument. You just have to know your theory, and theirs to have any effect. I remember when my economic's teacher first likened my beliefs to collectivism and spouted the inherent flaws. They were not interested in my responses, but then I asked a direct question, "Have you ever read any Smith, any Hayeck? Von Mises? Or is your economic "knowledge" contained within this book? (Holds up shitty book). They didn't lie, and admitted to not having read any significant work on their own ideology, never mind that they had never read anything more left wing than the Guardian. The teacher openly said that I may know more about economics, but they know more about passing the exam, which I didn't agree with. I quit school shortly after.

The point is, if you can keep calm, whilst everyone else is making logical leaps, you can focus on the problems with the leaps they are making. It isn't hard to get people to agree with your ideas without the label, and it isn't hard to show people they actually know nothing about these ideas, even though they might consider themselves, through custom, an authority on it. This will of course depend on the individual, and the skill is the being able to get through to the most difficult people.

[Paul R]

Im 17 and go to a catholic high school in Scotland. Im one of 3 lefties, one of which is a Stalinist so the less I talk to him the better to be honest. My friend and I would be labelled as Socialists or "Communist Scum" as we have been called.

Being a leftie in a cathiolic school is interesting. In Scotland there is a strong connection between Old Labour and Catholics but in my school its very authoritarian and promotes strong Capitalist values, but then again I think most schools do.

Me and my leftie friends are pretty active, we are trying to start a student union as an alternative to the ineffective school council and we also managed to get Coca Cola products removed from our school.

[cpjames_elsocialista]

i study in a state university and the subsidy from the gov. is decreased every year. some of the state scholars are losing their scholarships. my suggestion is, agitate these guys that are affected greatly by this shity system(imperialism) and find the leaders and tell them there is a better way and then educate them and let them decide for themselves based on their understandign.

[Cyanide Suicide]

I live in a rural town in Indiana, filled with ingnorant, know-nothing hicks. Hell, I'm probably the only person left of center in town.

As for school, during last years US presidential election, I had to hear over and over about how "Bush rocks, and Kerry's a fag with a funny shaped head." Then, as I would try to tell them my beliefs, they would call me a 'liberal-whore-fag'. So yeah, I'm like the only leftist at my high school.

[gewehr_3]

That sound exactly like my town except my brother and one of my friends is also a leftist, except my friend doesnt think for himself he thinks that what I say is right

[which doctor]

I'm the only communist in a rural private high school full of reactionaries. Yeah, it's tough, but I manage.

[Fidel Follower]

So we come back to the topic of how to tell your peers in Highschools the benefits of a communist nation.
I have read all the posts under Highschool, and most of students say that they have around 1-4 lefties at their school, thats a good start.

Now once you know you're stuff, and dont underestimate knowing who's who. Knowledge is power. You need to start talking to people(start with friends) about communsim. Thats how i sarted off..then theres propagander. I asked my head of year whether we could put up posters leaftets, things like that. He said he doesnt mind putting a few up, so im going to see hoe it goes from there.

I suppose im asking you all to be hands on, i know its not easy to be differant in Highschool, but try..So remeber folks stay Red:hammer:

I think Noah is starting up a Database of all highschools that have lefties in, or leftist groups(UK or Amerikan, or any where else for that matter) So dont post the names of your school and your names, cus you never know about neo-nazi's and the like, so either PM me or ask me for my MSN.

[PsychOtiC]

I'm the only leftist in my school...
...and my business studies teacher (how ironic) usually agrees with what I have to say on some things which we learn.

It's very hard for me to start an 'alternative politics' club, when I would probably be the only on in it...

[Fidel Follower]

Yeah thats a problem we all share, i dont really have any ideas for that one..? :huh:

[Global_Justice]

"Fidelcastro" why do you have that quote from scarface on your signature?

that film gloryfies everything i hate, it's a celebration of extreme capatilism, destroying anyone who gets in his way to making money

[Noah]

It's just a film...it's entertainment not a political statement.

[Global_Justice]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2006, 02:56 PM
It's just a film...it's entertainment not a political statement.
the film isn't a political statment, but surely having a quote from it on a left wing political site is

[Wiesty]

I am also 14. Ive rounded up all the leftists i know of, and we all kind of hang out and debate. And where as most people at my high school dont give a shit about politics, there are few right wingers as well.

[against all authority]

hey noah, any progress on the database? if u tell me which site u intend to use i could crack on with it also to try and speed things up abit?

[gewehr_3]

I was in spanish class and a previous student visited. He joined the marines and he goes to a military language shool in california, but he wants to move to texas because california is too "liberal"and texas has more bush supporters. he says he translates radio messages from latin american countries, and he says how big of a threat evo morales, hugo chavez, and fidel are to amerika because they are anti imperialist. and by the way he spoke it sounds like the US is planning something...I wanted to punch the bastard so bad. EVERYONE but one of my friends was agreeing with him and i wanted to puke.

[Fidel Follower]

Punch him then puke on him.. :D (No..second thoughts dont)

Yeah Noah we need info..talk to us and then we can talk to you..thanks..:hammer:

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Man I pity you guys... here in Norfolk we've still got an overwhelming conservative majority. But as some of you i speak to on messenger will know, we've got a fairly strong leftist movement of around 20 kids going on at our school. That's about 1/7th of my year.

[Noah]

I am tying a network in Manchester first.

What i'm thinking is for everyone in the UK (or maybe abroad) to make local networks, then when were established we will come together.

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

My local "union" has been going since August

[against all authority]

well if u ask them all if they wouldnt mind being a part of this network ( which im sure they wouldnt ) to make a list of some contact names and send them to me or anyone else whos involved in this and we'll find out where everyone is located and collabarate. then establish communication links for sakes of demonstrations and blah. also produce our website with info accessable and understandable by school students with links etc. the bigger we are the more notice will be taken of us.

if u use messanger just pm me ur address and ill add u or give u my address.

lets make this work :hammer:

[PsychOtiC]

Can I just ask what kind of network are you talking about ??

[against all authority]

a network of young leftists ran under one common name. (which we still need to come up with so post some suggestions ) you know how hard it is being leftist in school trying to broaden your knowledge when your surrounded by middle class opinions. its basically to give kids in school a chance to learn about alternative views to enable them to form their own opinions and offer them support. also it would be useful for meeting at demonstrations etc

[Kok0pelli]

Greetings my friends, new member here and it is my first post.
I am a junior and i am one of 2 extreme lefties of about 1600 students, but the other is a senior and will be leaving me soon. I talk to my other 'liberal' friends about change and all that good stuff but they are too drawn up in getting good grades and focusing on how to 'get ahead' in this soceity to think it is all flawed. poor bastards...

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Originally posted by against all [email protected] 5 2006, 12:03 AM
well if u ask them all if they wouldnt mind being a part of this network ( which im sure they wouldnt ) to make a list of some contact names and send them to me or anyone else whos involved in this and we'll find out where everyone is located and collabarate. then establish communication links for sakes of demonstrations and blah. also produce our website with info accessable and understandable by school students with links etc. the bigger we are the more notice will be taken of us.

if u use messanger just pm me ur address and ill add u or give u my address.

lets make this work :hammer:
I'm already fairly sorted out with the network, I'm just waiting for Noah or whoever's doing the database to get round to the Norfolk sector so we can sort some stuff out

edit: you've already PMed me your address apparently :) I just havn't got around to adding it to my msn evidently. Just added you now *thums up*

[Noah]

Kevis, is your network your school only or all of Norfolk?

I am currently constructing, a Manchester Youth Union before I try to do anything else. It's harder than I thought!

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

primarily it's just my school but since it's creation people have left and gone to sixth forms/colleges as well as some still at my school and we have one or two members from nearby schools.

It covers about a 16 mile radius overall

[Ol' Dirty]

I'm going to high school next year (I'm not telling you rapping bastards how old I am :lol: !). I'm rather fortunate, because my mother is an english teacher there, and she runs the socialist club.